If you are refering to once Hellenized people of Thrace and Near East, today some of their descendents are part of the Turkish nation as Leonidas said. The rest, were exchanged (nüfus mübadelesi) with the Turkish Muslims of Greece. And a small part of them still remain as a minority.

 

Here is an interesting site about Kappadokes/Anatolian Greeks in English

 

Oh, that is a lovely book. In English it is called "Farewell Anatolia". I haven't read it, but it was recomended to me by both Greeks and Turks.

 

Excrepts from the Turkish version:

 

Benden Selam Söyle Anadolu'ya
Dido Sotiriu; Çeviren: Atilla Tokatlı

TR

"Ve sen Kör Mehmet'in damadý! Hele sen! Niye öyle tiksinerek bakýyorsun yüzüme? Öldürdüm evet seni, ne olmuþ! Ve iþte aðlýyorum... Sen de öldürdün! Kardeþler, dostlar; hemþehriler... Koskoca bir kuþak, durup dururken katletti kendi kendini!.. Anayurduma selam söyle benden Kör Mehmet'in damadý! Benden Selam Söyle Anadolu 'ya!.. Topraðýný kanla suladýk diye bize garezlenmesin... Ve kardeþi kardeþe kýrdýran cellatlarýn Allah bin belasýný versin!.."

 

and a friends attempt to translate it:

 

EN

And you,Blind Mehmet's son-in-law!Especially you! Why are you looking at me with distain? Alright,I killed you,so what? And I am crying...You killed as well. A whole generation murdered itself just like that!.. Say Hello to my homeland for me,Blind Mehmet's son-in-law. Say Hello for me to Anatolia.Tell her not to hate us for soaking her soil with blood....And May God Curse those who made brother slaughter brother!.."

 

I will read this book at some point.

Book Review:

Manolis Axiotis is born into a farming family in a Greek village in the mountains above Ephesus, where life revolves around the fields and the olive and fig trees. But he gets on badly with his father and is sent to the bustling, cosmopolitan city of Smyrna and exposed to a much broader world.
The villagers speak Turkish themselves and are on good terms with their Turkish neighbours; their lives follow patterns that have evolved over millennia. And Smyrna is a multi-ethnic city, shared by Turks, Greeks, Armenians, Levantines, and others. But the wars that start in 1912 and then 1914 herald a decade of violence that will destroy this world completely.

Manolis is conscripted into the Ottoman army — or rather, as an untrusted Greek, into Labour Battalions which work in appalling conditions. He deserts and goes into hiding, leading a furtive underground life. After the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, he ends up as part of the Greek army and the disastrous campaign to take Ankara. And at the end he is caught up in the massacres involved in the ethnic cleansing of Smyrna.

None of the characters in Farewell Anatolia really come to life: Manolis himself is too much of a blank slate, absorbing information and experiencing events, while the other characters are little more than types. But it is a powerful, gripping tale, offering a panoramic view of the catastrophic end of the Greek communities of Asia Minor. It is an ordinary person's view of how war and nationalism, used by self-centred politicians and amoral Great Powers, can drive communalism and ethnic conflict and destroy communities.

13 September 2004

 

Originally posted by Bashibozuk If you are refering to once Hellenized people of Thrace and Near East, today some of their descendents are part of the Turkish nation as Leonidas said. The rest, were exchanged (nόfus mόbadelesi) with the Turkish Muslims of Greece. And a small part of them still remain as a minority.

Karamanli Greeks Parakalo.I ve got great link about cappadokian greek from Varlaam.

 

Efharisto Poli

 

 Karamanli people not turkih they are greek.But importan point of this topic how can i reach them and their past.

 

I want to find Karamanli houses in Karaman and Central Anatolia

and speak with the people who live with then before.

 

I need more help from greek members.Please send me more info about

their community in Athens or Thessalonikh or any where in Greece.

 

Please port me their addresses or are information.

 

Efharisto poli

 

 

then I  will wait the wire for a long time

 

 

Gumuljine is the Turkish and Bulgarian  name of  the Komotene and Iskeje , realy I don't know

Also Xanthi and Komotini are ancient cities, older than the turkish presence (I don't know about Alexandroupoli, it is true it was called Dedeagats in old greek maps.)

 

Also, I don't think there is any danger in the way to Turkey. I mean thousands of trucks and Greek tourists cross the border and go to Constantinople.

A trip to Constntinople I think is better to be organized by a travel agency. I mean it is difficult for a man to just go by train, find a place to stay, and be able to see things. An agency will use a bus, find hotels and make tours inside the city.

 

This is nonsense and complete ignorance. Read about what Karamanoglu Mehmet Bey did. His ferman is only related about state affaires. In Ottomans and Seljuks, the language of minorities have never been banned. They have never intefered religious or daily life language of people.  Moreover, there were not schools in towns, villages or even cities to teach people Turkish so that they will forget their mother tongue and use Turkish in all parts of their daily life; moreover they will use Greek alphabet to write Turkish !!!

 

There is a possibility that they were using Greek alphabet since it was the alphabet of Orthodox Church and it has something holly in it.... But what about language? In fact Turkish was not a religious language as Greek and Arabic, it was not a language of literature as Persian or science as Latin and Arabic.... Despite of all they were speaking Turkish until they went to Greece in 20th century.

 

They have heavily resisted to go to Greece saying that we are Turks. In Greece, they are called as Turks and treated very badly. And fathers and mothers had prefered to forget their ethnicities. Now childs know anything about their pasts. 

 

I want to remind you that Karamanlides were so Turks that they were even using Turkish in their relegious practices, church songs etc.....

 

Karamanlides' origin is not very clear but most probably they are coming from the Cuman and Pecheneg Turks origin. They were converted to Christianity from shamanism in the Balkans  before Alparslan's Menzigert. They are involved into Byzantine army and some of them have been settled into border areas to protect the border.

 

In I.Crusades Byzatine army took over the city of Nicea which is the capital of Anatolian Seljuks by the Pecheneg troops of the Byzantine army. There are lots of historical documents about Turks in Byzantine armies.

 

For example: (These are very useful and interesting links to read if you are really interested in history).

 

http://san.beck.org/AB18-Crusaders.html - http://san.beck.org/AB18-Crusaders.html

 

"Adhémar was wounded by Pecheneg mercenaries. After an ambush these crusaders attacked Byzantine troops; but a letter from Emperor Alexius calmed things down."

 

"Belgrade was not expecting them, and the Byzantine governor of the Bulgarian province, Nicetas, evacuated the city. Pechenegs keeping imperial order tried to restrict crossing the Save River to one place and were attacked by Peter's crusaders, who captured and put some Pechenegs to death. "

 

"Alexius wanted these crusaders to move on, because more were coming; so in March 1097 he began reducing supplies of horse fodder, fish, and then bread. Crusaders raided the villages and fought with the Pecheneg police."

 

"A third army of crusaders led by the Frank troubadour, Duke William IX of Aquitane, was joined by Duke Welf of Bavaria as they passed through Germany and Hungary; after some unruly behavior they were escorted by Pechenegs to Constantinople."

 

Another example: The article is about Taticius, the famous Byzantine general. (His father was an Arab and his mother was most probably a Turk).

 

"When Alexius became emperor in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1081 - 1081 he held the office of Grand Primicerius in the imperial household. Later that year he commanded the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seljuk_Turks - Turkish (or possibly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pecheneg - Pecheneg ) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercenary - mercenaries from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohrid - Ohrid at the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dyrrhachium_%281081%29 - Battle of Dyrrhachium against http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Guiscard - Robert Guiscard ."

 

http://www.umiacs.umd.edu/~kuijt/dba153/ByzantineVariant.html - http://www.umiacs.umd.edu/~kuijt/dba153/ByzantineVariant.html

 

Article on Late Byzantine armies...

"The Light Horse were mostly Skythikon, originally Pechenegs but in the period under consideration usually Cumans. They would be almost exclusively unarmoured horse bowmen without shields. After 1242 a large mass of Cumans fleeing the Mongols were settled within Byzantine lands, and the Skythikon would have been largely Cuman allies in native equipment.

Up to one element of light horse could represent the Vardariotai guards formed from Magyar settlers in the Vardar valley; they would also be equipped as unarmoured horse bowmen without shields. Up to one element of light horse could be Tourkopouloi, converted Turks with bow and shield. "

The earliest record of the name of Cappadocia dates from the late 6th cent BC where it appears in the trili-ngual inscriptions of the  two Achaemenid Kings, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darius_I - Darius I and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xerxes - Xerxes , as one of the countries ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Persian - Old Persian dahyu-) which are part of the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achaemenid - Persian Empire . In these lists of countries the Old Persian name is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katpatuka - Katpatuka but it is clearly not a native Persian word.

Under the later kings of the Persian empire they were divided into two http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satrapy - satrapies , or governments, the one comprising the central and inland portion, to which the name of Cappadocia continued to be applied by Greek geographers, while the other was called http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontus - Pontus .

Where you find the Kadpadoksa-Kadpaduksa Marashantiya record ?

Where you find the Kadpadoksa-Kadpaduksa Marashantiya record ?

 

Not from wiki. Altough Kadpaduka is said to mean "land of beautiful horses", it is the name of a branch of Kizilirmak. And Marashantiya was the ancient name of Kizilirmak.

 

http://en.wikisource.org/w/index.php?title=User:Tim_Starling/ScanSet_TIFF_demo&vol=05&page=EB5A300 - http://en.wikisource.org/w/index.php?title=User:Tim_Starling/ScanSet_TIFF_demo&vol=05&page=EB5A300

 

 

Please, don't stop. I may also explain the origins of the myths of Aya Basileios, Aya Hieron, Onophorios, Aya Gregorios of Nyssa and many others like them. The thing is that, you have to understand the region was an important religious center for all religions which has influenced Anatolia (native religion, Mithraism, later Christianity and finally Islam), not only for Christians.

 

We know where he lived when and how he died and many things about his life(i am speaking for saint george),.

 

But we also know that the legend of a dragon is a myth, right?

 

you are speaking about Hittites like they are your progenitors.I hope you are not influenced by turkish propaganda

 

1. I had no such statement.

 

2. I hope they were. But I'm a Turkmen. Anyway, since I'm from Cappadocia, at least I try to preserve their cultural inheritance against some Ionians trying to steal it...

 

we grow up listening stories about how turks tortured them

 

That's obvious though. 

 

 

 

 

 

Interesting statements ageia, indeed.

 

Yes exactly. And they were saying that "we are not Greeks, we are Turks"...

 

Originally posted by ageia i can't stand  propaganda like this one .i believe if turkey will be more democratic(less military controlled) and less nationalist everything could be more easy.

 

Greeks like you are the expert of propaganda. The same story, the same exaggeration. Dear Ageia, you have been ruled by military dictatorship during years. Moreover now Greece is not a secular country. Greek Orthodox Church is everywhere in Greece. Religion is being used for political, militaristic and nationalistic purposes.  

 

"Less nationalistic Turkey" for you means a Turkey who will not defend its rights and interests against anyone especially to Greece. For example Greece wants to expend its sea borders from 6 miles to 10.... Less nationalistic Turkey will reply "Oh my lovely Greek neighbours if you want to do this I will accept. In addition to this you can do whatever you want in my own sea borders". For example in 1974 by the help of Greek military junda which ruled Greece, a military coup has been orginised in Cyprus. They controoled the government and the president of Cyprus had to run away. (He was a Greek Orthodox priest anyway showing how democracy has deep roots in Greek society). This fascist military regime supported by CIA like evey bloody nationalist fascists on the world has started to massacre Turkish minority and claimed that Cyprus will be a part of Greece. Less nationalist Turkey should reply "Oh our lovely Greek neighbours if you want you can take Cyprus and please send Turkish civilian bodies to Turkey to bury them in a more comfortable place. Of course if you do not mind"

 

Result: "Everything could be more easy"

 

 

 

Consequently, stop talking about nonsense preassumptions such as "we are a European country, so we are democratic, respectful to human rights " etc.....  Democracy and human rights is not in the monopoly of Europe or USA.

 

 

 

Now, and for the last millenia. But it wasn't totally Greek when Turks arrived, so your nationalists may take your sick epope dreams and masturbate somewhere else.

 

that's why i am going to stop posting for this thread.

 

Com'on, can't you dare not to stop?:D I may had stop you anywhere.

 

speaking with a man that has for avatar the face of kemal

 

It must be hard for you, but it is definately an honor.

 

It is like speaking with a german who has for avatar himler.no jews coud do this neither do i....

 

No, nothing is like speaking to uncle Donald Duck. And you can talk to me, I have nothing against Jews.

 

dont say that some greeks dont hyperbolize but our schools are controlled by a democratic goverment,

 

Or by butcher archibishops.