Who Were the Trojans?

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From the reading the Iliad I see the Trojans & Greeks worshipped the same Gods, spoke the same language and had common bloodlines.  Notable examples would surface on the field of battle on occassion. 

Sounds like Trojans were in fact Greeks.  Having been defeated they fled to found Rome (Aeneas)

Trojans must have been a very close to the Greeks people.
Perhaps there is some pelasgian connection,maybe Trojans and Greeks assimilated the same Pelasgian substratum.
As far as the founding of Rome is concerned there are other theories that say that the first inhabitants of the palatine hill in Rome were Arcadian(Pelasgian) settlers.
I think the Trojans and the Greeks were ''step brothers'',same ''pelasgian'' substratum
This is a hypothesis or just science fiction


Edited by RomiosArktos

Well,about the founding of Rome I tend to believe more what is written by Dionisios of Alicarnassus in his work,Roman archeology.There he says that the first people that founded a community in Rome were the Arcadians led by  Oinotros,son of king Lycaon and grandson of Pelasgos.This happened about seven generations before the Trojan war.In Arcadia there was a city called Pallation and this city was considered metropolis of Rome by many  emperors.
I tend also to believe that the Hellenes of the classical times were a mix of those who had come from the north? and the autochtonous.So when I say pelasgians I mean the autochtonous population, ancestors of the classical time Greeks.
In Arcadia it was widespread  the worship of a lycantropic god(possibly ''pelasgian'')  which later became the Lyceos Zeus.(in greek lycos=wolf pronunciation li'kos)
This reminds me of the myth about the she-wolf etc.
The Arcadians were considered the most '''autochtonous'' among the Greeks.

 

If you read the Iliad, the sense that you may have is that the Trojan War was kinda "civil" war. It is very possible that there would have been a strong genetic connection between the Greeks and the Trojans if we don't want to call the latter, pure Greeks.

Greeks didn't confront Trojans as a foreign enemy.

When the Iliad was written, the pre-classical definition of "barbarian" (varvaros) was not fully defined and formulated yet. There is more then just a passing sympathy of Homer for the Trojans, but nobody calls them "Greeks", although a strong (cultural) connection is not only implied, but vigorously outspoken.

Althouhg, one must note that the Iliad presents the clash between Greeks and Trojans as a sorts of clash between "Europe" and "Asia", so there is a rather firm notion of the Trojans being "Asian", non-Greeks.

Homer was Anatolian Greek! Not Anatolian in general.

Originally posted by Maju Yet Trojans are not alien to the Aegean world... Greeks wouldn't percieve them as "foreigners" in the sense they could percieve Persians later but in the sense they could percieve Romans, for instance: someone with whom they have a strong cultural bond despite of being of diferent ethnicity.

This is precisely what I had in mind! There is more than just a passing afilliation, but the borders of "Danaos" (Greek) and "Trojan" are rather well-defined, in terms of ethnicity, although culturally they practically shared a common "Aegean" culture.

BTW Kotu, in all Greek literature (specifically the numerous tragedies with a "Trojan" theme) the Trojans are kinda "the good guys" and the Greeks the blasphemus, "bad guys". The Trojans are defending their homes, while the Greeks perform sacriledge after sacriledge in their effort to bring Troy down, and their conduct after they got Troy is painted with the worst possible colors by every Greek author.

I think ancient Greeks - as Isocrates puts it  - perceived culture as superior to blood. I think it is a sign of civilization, in some aspects. Also, Homer was undisputably Greek (not even half-Greek, as Herodotus) from Anatolian lands of Greek Ionia. What do you mean by "Anatolian"?


Edited by Alkiviades

Based on mythology and Homer's text we do see an undoubtable connection, as mentioned, religion and of course the names that are poure Hellinic and not Hellinized which could indicate foreign (to them) origins. A simple read of any text clearly indicates the difference in which the 'kin' from the 'foreigners' are depicted.
But Homer was a poet not a historian, so obviously his main interest wasn't depicting the historic issues of the battle, which is why his whole work is centered on Achilles choice of immortality..

The 'Hellen' part of the story, is a mere symbolization that we are still unable to understand. We know that prior to this expedition, Herakles had sacked Troy and killed everyone exept Priam who later became king.. so probably this war was all about the geographic position of the site, since we know of expeditions and connections of th 'Acheans' with regions as far as Georgia prior to the T.W..

If we look into the cultural elements presented, we find the interesting  fact that the 'Troyans' preformed a sacrifice to Poseidon. Today based on the finds of Linear B' tablets, we know that 'po-se-da-o-ne : ����������� = exactly as seen in Homeric texts' was the greatest of all figures for the  island populations of the Aegean, most probably due to their close relation with the sea..

What I also noticed is that the Hittites are mentioned.. But the Hittites according to all souces occupied areas in Central Anatolia, and there are finds that suggest an alliance rather than a kin relation..

Here is a map of Hittite influence(borders) from the Uni. of Texas..





I would like to know how we can speak of 'Turk' genes when Turkish scholars themselves agree that there is no Turish gene available in its pure form (obviously relating to Central Asia) nor was there any trace of Turks in the area prior to the 8th (probably) cent ??