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Kuu-ukko
Shogun
Joined: 02-Dec-2004
Location: Finland
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Posts: 204
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Topic: Dracology Posted: 29-Dec-2005 at 05:53 |
In Finnish a dragon is called lohikrme. Although lohi also means salmon in Finnish, the name is not salmon-snake, but the lohi is most likely from the Old Norse word for fire, logi.
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Istun kylmll kivell
Sammaleella kostealla
Puiden oksain suojaamina
Aistin aikain vahvat voimat
Olen tll onnellinen
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Maju
King
Joined: 14-Jul-2005
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Posts: 6565
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Posted: 29-Dec-2005 at 09:36 |
Originally posted by Ikki
Another question, why is the dragon evil in the West, and sacred in the East?
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Wow! I missed this most important question.
According to some modern Anti-patriarchal interpretations, the reason
for the Dragon being demonized in the west is that it embodied the
ancient "Neolithic" religion of the Mother Godess. As in Basque
mythology, probably in pre-IE Europe (and, up to a point, is some parts
of early IE Europe), the Dragon was the consort of the Godess (Mother
Earth?). The myths of a hero killing the Dragon, starting (as far as we
can trace) by Apollo in Delfos, represent the victory of the new
Patriarchal order over the older "Matristic" (or Matrifocal) order.
Medieval versions of these legends paint the Dragon as kidnapping a
maid (the Godess) but, according to Casilda Rodrigaez (see http://www.casildarodriganez.org/,
in Spanish), the actual true original meaning is that the Dragon was
actually protecting her, as he was her natural consort (the God) in the
context of an egalitarian Matrifocal religion of fertility.
Yet, even in Medieval times, we find some authors that give a more
favorable role to the Dragon, particularly in the cycle of Arthur.
Due to this (violent) social and cultural transformation, the
Dragon-God became the Dragon-Devil, in a simmilar manner as many Pagan
mythological characters were demonized under Christianity and the other
Abrahmanic religions.
The Godess was kidnapped then by the Apolinean Patriarchal "hero" and
became gradually: lesser godess, godess consort, human saint/consort
and even disappeared at all from religion/mythology.
But don't worry, the Dragon is back.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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vulkan02
Arch Duke
Termythinator
Joined: 27-Apr-2005
Location: U$A
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Posts: 1835
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Posted: 29-Dec-2005 at 23:19 |
Originally posted by Maju
Originally posted by Ikki
Another question, why is the dragon evil in the West, and sacred in the East?
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But don't worry, the Dragon is back.
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Like always... great info Maju.... and yes you can say that last line again.
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The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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Socrates
Baron
Joined: 12-Nov-2005
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Posts: 416
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Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 04:15 |
Originally posted by Zagros
Interesting similarity between the Persian Ejdeha and Serbian Azdeja (with j pronounced as y). |
Actually, it's Azhdaya.I didn't know it was an iranian word...interesting.
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Sharrukin
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Joined: 04-Aug-2004
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Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 22:07 |
from the Avestan dragon-snake Azi-Dahaka. Apparently, those originally Iranian Serbs were converted to Zoroastrianism at some point in their ancient history. Avestan sources indeed indicate that nomadic tribes received the preaching of Zoroaster. Among these were Sairimas, whom in the west were known as Sarmatians. We know that the Serboi of the classical geographers were in Sarmatian territory. It then just takes little imagination to see how some Serbian words are related to Iranian ones.
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ArmenianSurvival
Chieftain
Joined: 11-Aug-2004
Location: United States
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Posts: 1460
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Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 22:22 |
In Armenian, dragon is Vishab (pronounced vee-shahb).
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Mass Murderers Agree: Gun Control Works!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Resistance
Քիչ ենք բայց Հայ ենք։
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Socrates
Baron
Joined: 12-Nov-2005
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 08:30 |
Originally posted by Sharrukin
from the Avestan dragon-snake Azi-Dahaka. Apparently, those originally Iranian Serbs were converted to Zoroastrianism at some point in their ancient history. Avestan sources indeed indicate that nomadic tribes received the preaching of Zoroaster. Among these were Sairimas, whom in the west were known as Sarmatians. We know that the Serboi of the classical geographers were in Sarmatian territory. It then just takes little imagination to see how some Serbian words are related to Iranian ones. |
I'm not sure Sarmatians were under the influence of Zoroastrianism-I think they were more influenced by ''pagan'' Indo-Iranian cults.
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Socrates
Baron
Joined: 12-Nov-2005
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Posts: 416
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 08:35 |
Originally posted by Maju
Originally posted by Ikki
Another question, why is the dragon evil in the West, and sacred in the East?
|
Wow! I missed this most important question.
According to some modern Anti-patriarchal interpretations, the reason for the Dragon being demonized in the west is that it embodied the ancient "Neolithic" religion of the Mother Godess. As in Basque mythology, probably in pre-IE Europe (and, up to a point, is some parts of early IE Europe), the Dragon was the consort of the Godess (Mother Earth?). The myths of a hero killing the Dragon, starting (as far as we can trace) by Apollo in Delfos, represent the victory of the new Patriarchal order over the older "Matristic" (or Matrifocal) order. Medieval versions of these legends paint the Dragon as kidnapping a maid (the Godess) but, according to Casilda Rodrigaez (see http://www.casildarodriganez.org/, in Spanish), the actual true original meaning is that the Dragon was actually protecting her, as he was her natural consort (the God) in the context of an egalitarian Matrifocal religion of fertility.
Yet, even in Medieval times, we find some authors that give a more favorable role to the Dragon, particularly in the cycle of Arthur.
Due to this (violent) social and cultural transformation, the Dragon-God became the Dragon-Devil, in a simmilar manner as many Pagan mythological characters were demonized under Christianity and the other Abrahmanic religions.
The Godess was kidnapped then by the Apolinean Patriarchal "hero" and became gradually: lesser godess, godess consort, human saint/consort and even disappeared at all from religion/mythology.
But don't worry, the Dragon is back.
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Then u didn't like the 13th warrior -they r fighting against cannibals who worship the Mother Godess.That statue they showed in the film looks exactly like the one from Lepenski Vir culture in Serbia...
Btw-that film was a load of commercial rubbish...
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Maju
King
Joined: 14-Jul-2005
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Posts: 6565
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 09:34 |
Yes, that's commercial rubbish.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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