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US Foreign Policy’s Greatest Defier
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Poll Question: Who was or is US Foreign Policy’s most formidable opponent?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
7 [43.75%]
5 [31.25%]
0 [0.00%]
1 [6.25%]
1 [6.25%]
0 [0.00%]
0 [0.00%]
1 [6.25%]
0 [0.00%]
1 [6.25%]
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Komnenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 4361 		  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: US Foreign Policy’s Greatest Defier
    Posted: 23-May-2005 at 14:11
Got this idea from a thread on "Rome's greatest defier".

So, who in your opinion is the most important, or most successful, or most charismatic of these opponents of US policies?

I know that unlike the Roman, the American Empire is still alive and kicking, but we might as well have some intermediate results, or indeed an exit poll in.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2005 at 14:30
Fidel Castro. He overthrew an American puppet and rules a communist government only 200 km from Florida.
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cattus View Drop Down
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Posts: 1803 		  Quote cattus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2005 at 14:54
Just as Rome's greatest defier could have been itself, Americas might be as well(ex. Vietnam).

Ill go with Mixcoatl and Fidel Castro who hangs out in the US backyard.
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Posts: 85 		  Quote The Golden Phallanx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2005 at 15:02

Could someone give a short biography on each of these individuals?

 

 
We are all a result of what we have lived. Culture, attitude, perspective. For everything we do, there is a reason. There is no true evil, only the absence of proper communication.
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Posts: 3987 		  Quote hugoestr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2005 at 15:48
Fidel Castro is the most successful, although his victory is mostly symbolic. After the U.S. rejected his pleas for help, he went with the competition, was in the middle of a nuclear crisis, and managed to secure some kind of a promise that the U.S. was not going to invade his island. It has worked for the next 40 years.

In the long run, though, I think that the role of Fidel Castro is not going to be that important. He managed to survive, but the real impact on the U.S. is practically nonexistent.

I voted for Fidel because of his survival, but I agree with Catt: the U.S. may be its own worst enemy.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2005 at 17:07

Correct me if I'm wrong about this...

It seems that one difference between the legacies of Ho Chi Minh and Castro is the influence they are likely to exert on their respective regional pictures....

In the case of Castro he is a hero and Cuba is a model for the many people in Latin America who favour independence from American influence. (This is not to say that these independents seek to emulate Cuba's example exactly.)

Does anyone know if this hero status is similar for Ho Chi Minh in Southeast Asia? Do popular movements for independence in Thailand, Korea, Cambodia, Indonesia, Timor, etc. perceive Ho Chi Minh and Vietnam as symbols of independence with the same intensity?

I do not doubt Ho Chi Minh's influence on 20th century history, on his people, and even on the cultural fabric of the US. But in terms of a legacy might Castro's contribution to the Latin American framework be more important?  Perhaps because in Latin America the culture of resistance has broader roots than just Castro; it is nourished by the powerful influences of Guevara, Marley, Bolivar, Sandino, Allende, etc. as well as the consciousness of the experience of slavery and extermination of indigenous cultures.  Perhaps also because Castro's country has so far been spared the Carthaginian treatment at the hands of the US, he has had the chance to do something constructive, thus the health care, urban agriculture, and the leading literacy rate in the Western hemisphere.


By the way I voted for Ho Chi Minh, but it's a very close call



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Posts: 2112 		  Quote Jalisco Lancer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2005 at 21:32


Fidel Castro has been in power over 40 years and became the long lasting ruler on contemporary times.
He has survived to the Cold war, 10 US Administration, one invasion, the longst economic blockade, the fall of the communism in Europe and large quantity of assesination attempts.
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Posts: 6003 		  Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 00:59
Gerhard Schroeder?

I'd say Fidel Castro too, but i voted for George Galloway, to make the poll look more intresting. 
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Posts: 4361 		  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 03:27
Originally posted by Cywr

Gerhard Schroeder?



Well, he did oppose the Iraqi war, didn't he?
But I mainly included him, cause I couldn't think of aother European.
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Posts: 6003 		  Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 03:34
How about Chirac? He also opposed the Iraqi war, AND he's French!
Arrrgh!!"
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Posts: 4361 		  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 05:49
Originally posted by Cywr


How about Chirac? He also opposed the Iraqi war, AND he's French


Yeah, I had Chirac instead of Schroeder in my original draft, but as I thought neither of them would get a lot of votes anyway, I included Schroeder for mildly patriotic reasons.
In any case, Schroeder needs all the support he can get and being voted the US' greatest defier in AE might just swing the upcoming general elections in Germany in his favour.
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Posts: 4310 		  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 06:48

What about "other?" do they all have to be modern?  How about Emilio Auginauldo?
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I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 07:40
Originally posted by Jalisco Lancer

and became the long lasting ruler on contemporary times.

I'm not sure about that. Kim-Il Sung ruled for 46 years (longer actually, he's still 'eternal president' ). Fidel Castro also rules for 46 years.
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Posts: 6003 		  Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 20:13
What about Franco, how long did he rule for? And that Portugues guy?
Arrrgh!!"
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Posts: 2112 		  Quote Jalisco Lancer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 20:16

Franco did not oppose to the US, otherwise he could be removed from power after the end of WWII.
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Cywr View Drop Down
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Posts: 6003 		  Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 22:48
I was thinking about contender for longest ruling leader.
Arrrgh!!"
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Posts: 2187 		  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2005 at 23:02
What about Degaulle?
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poirot View Drop Down
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Posts: 1838 		  Quote poirot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2005 at 00:55
Osama bin Ladin?
AAAAAAAAAA
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cattus View Drop Down
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Posts: 1803 		  Quote cattus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2005 at 00:59
Nah, he only made it worse. He's pretty much a dead man anyway.
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Komnenos View Drop Down
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Posts: 4361 		  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2005 at 03:46
Originally posted by poirot

Osama bin Ladin?


Greatest defier of US foreign policy?

If it weren't that absurd, I would say he actually doesn't exist and the Bush/Haliburton regime invented him to assist them with their aims!

Hang on a minute!
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