Author |
Share Topic Topic Search Topic Options
|
Hemin Mukri
Immortal Guard
suspended
Joined: 12-May-2014
Location: Istanbul
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5
|
Quote Reply
Topic: Kurds are German? Posted: 12-May-2014 at 13:11 |
Dear Homayoun,
Please do not act with your feelings, if you do so you may drool. As most of Persians drool regarding Lurs and Bakhtiars. Here some Kurmanji Kurdish and Persian loanwords for comparison. Then you give me a logical answer why is that:
KURDISH PERSIAN ENGLISH Bab Padar Father De, Mak Madar Mother Bra Bradar Brother Sister Xweh Khwahar Dot, Keç Dokhtar Daugther Dotmam Dokhtar Amoo Uncle daughter Kurt, Kin Kutah Short Qic, Hur Kuchak Small Kur Pesar Son Mer Mard Man Dlop Raha Kardan Drop Hek Tokhm margh Egg Ster Satara Star Anin Awurdan Bring Grin Beriistan Cry Nu Taza, Jadid (arabic) New Çav Chashm Eye Tli, Peçi Angusht Finger Agir Atash Fire Birçi Gorosna(gi) Hungry Kenin Khandidan Laugh Ba Bad Wind Baran Baran Rain Bahoz Tufan shada Tempest Brusk Barq (Arabic) Lightning M^er Mardana Masculine N^er Zanana Feminine J^ın Zandagi Life Dev Dahan Mouth .......
And so on. As you see majority Kurdish loanwords are shorther than Persian. Is it an indication to that Persians added some more letters onto Kurdish originated words or Kurds just throw away from Persian originated words, for example the words "Bra","Bradar" and "Dot" , "Dokhtar"as are in English "Brother" and "Daughter"
Edited by Hemin Mukri - 12-May-2014 at 13:16
|
Bele....
|
|
red clay
Administrator
Tomato Master Emeritus
Joined: 14-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10226
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 12-May-2014 at 13:40 |
Hemin Mukri, your tone is close to disrespect. Your new here, I suggest you read the Code of Conduct.
|
"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
|
|
Hemin Mukri
Immortal Guard
suspended
Joined: 12-May-2014
Location: Istanbul
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 12-May-2014 at 13:53 |
First,
The text is not correctly typed.
Second,
It is in Zaza/Dimli language/dialect. Not Kurmanji Kurdish.
|
Bele....
|
|
Hemin Mukri
Immortal Guard
suspended
Joined: 12-May-2014
Location: Istanbul
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 12-May-2014 at 14:08 |
Then warn me when is disrespected. Some one will have a right to claim that I am not existed at all with no evidence and you will welcome him/her; when I say him do not drool, will it be disrespected. Then go ahead man. What can you do at most????? Then do it. Do not turn me crazy
|
Bele....
|
|
red clay
Administrator
Tomato Master Emeritus
Joined: 14-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10226
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 13-May-2014 at 09:14 |
I just did it. Your banned.
|
"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
|
|
Ince
Colonel
Joined: 24-Dec-2009
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 550
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 14-May-2014 at 14:54 |
Originally posted by Hemin Mukri
Dear Homayoun,
Please do not act with your feelings, if you do so you may drool. As most of Persians drool regarding Lurs and Bakhtiars. Here some Kurmanji Kurdish and Persian loanwords for comparison. Then you give me a logical answer why is that:
KURDISH PERSIAN ENGLISH Bab Padar Father De, Mak Madar Mother Bra Bradar Brother Sister Xweh Khwahar Dot, Keç Dokhtar Daugther Dotmam Dokhtar Amoo Uncle daughter Kurt, Kin Kutah Short Qic, Hur Kuchak Small Kur Pesar Son Mer Mard Man Dlop Raha Kardan Drop Hek Tokhm margh Egg Ster Satara Star Anin Awurdan Bring Grin Beriistan Cry Nu Taza, Jadid (arabic) New Çav Chashm Eye Tli, Peçi Angusht Finger Agir Atash Fire Birçi Gorosna(gi) Hungry Kenin Khandidan Laugh Ba Bad Wind Baran Baran Rain Bahoz Tufan shada Tempest Brusk Barq (Arabic) Lightning M^er Mardana Masculine N^er Zanana Feminine J^ın Zandagi Life Dev Dahan Mouth .......
And so on. As you see majority Kurdish loanwords are shorther than Persian. Is it an indication to that Persians added some more letters onto Kurdish originated words or Kurds just throw away from Persian originated words, for example the words "Bra","Bradar" and "Dot" , "Dokhtar"as are in English "Brother" and "Daughter"
|
It is Kurmanji Kurdish that has dropped the longer version of words. For example Sorani still has some words that are long for example Kurmanji "Kir" and Sorani "Kirdin" and more like it as Kurmanji has dropped the "d" and Sorani has retained it. Kurmanji seems to be the one that has shorten the words as in other Kurdish languages like Gorani the words are prounced more similar to other Iranian Languages. Also those words are not Persian loan words they are Iranian Language words that share a common root in all Iranian Languages. It be like saying the word Goot in german was a loan word from English word Good and the fact is both languages share the same origins.
Edited by Ince - 14-May-2014 at 14:58
|
|
Karlaswagnaz
Janissary
Joined: 31-May-2014
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 01-Jun-2014 at 01:40 |
The Kerman region in Iran was called "Germania" by the Greeks, but I think it's a phonetical coincidence, like the Iberia of the Caucasus and the Iberia of western Europe.
|
Stars die and reborn...
|
|
Cyrus Shahmiri
Administrator
King of Kings
Joined: 07-Aug-2004
Location: Iran
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6240
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 04-Jun-2014 at 07:35 |
Originally posted by Karlaswagnaz
The Kerman region in Iran was called "Germania" by the Greeks, but I think it's a phonetical coincidence, like the Iberia of the Caucasus and the Iberia of western Europe. |
The interesting thing that there are also several place names in Kerman region which sound like German places, for example look at this page from Unesco website: http://whc.unesco.org/en/tentativelists/5205/ As you see it talks about Citadel of Bam (Bamberg) and Rhine.
|
|
|
Karlaswagnaz
Janissary
Joined: 31-May-2014
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 04-Jun-2014 at 16:49 |
There are better examples in the west, "Aire" means "noble" in Gaelic of Ireland and Scotland, and the Galician people from Spain have some things in common with Gilaki people, look their traditional dresses:
|
Stars die and reborn...
|
|
Merd Bawer
Immortal Guard
Joined: 17-Aug-2014
Location: Istanbul
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 17-Aug-2014 at 14:59 |
KURMANJI
KURDISH PERSIAN ENGLISH SORANI KURDISH GERMAN
Bab, bav* Padar* Father Bab = باب Vater
Dê, Mak Madar Mother Daye = دايه Mutter
Bra Bradar* Brother Bira = برا Bruder
Xweh, xwişk Khwahar Sister **Xwişk= خوشك Schwester
Dot, Keç Dokhtar* Daugther Kiç = کچ Tochter
Mam, Ap Amoo, Mam Paternal uncle Mam = مام Onkel
Dotmam Dokhtar-amoo Uncle's daughter Kiçî mam = کچ مام Onkel Tochter
Kurt, Kin Kutah Short Kurt = كورت Kurz
Qic, Hur Kuchak* Small Çûk = چووک Klein
Kur, Pis Pesar Son Kur = كور مام Sohn
Pismam Pesar Amoo Cousin Kurî mam = كور Sohn des Onkels
Mêr Mard* Man Pyaw= پـيــاو Mann
Dlop Raha Kardan Drop Dlop= دلوپ Tropfen
Hêk Tokhm-margh* Egg Tow = تۆو ,Helka=هيلكه Ei, egg
Stêr Satara Star Astera=ئستره Stern
Anîn Awurdan Bring Hawir=هاور Bringen
Grîn Beriistan Cry Grî = گری Weinen, Schrei
Nû Taza, Jadid(Arabic)* New Nwê = نـوێ Neu
Çav Chashm* Eye Çaw = چاو Auge
Tlî, Pêçî Angusht Finger Pil = پل,Panca= پـنجـه Finger
Agir Atash* Fire Agir= ئاگر Feuer Birçî Gorosnagi Hungry Birsî=بـرسى Begierig,hungrig
Kenîn Khandidan Laugh Kenîn = کـه نين Lachen
Ba Bad Wind Ba = با Blähung, Wind
Baran Baran Rain Baran = باران Regnen
Bahoz Tufan shada* Tempest Boran* = بوران Sturm
Brûsk Barq (Arabic) Lightning Trişka = ترشقه Blitz
Mê Zanana Feminine Mê =مى feminin
Nêr Mardana* Masculine Nêr = نير maskulin
Jîn Zandagi Life Jîn = ژين Leben
Dev Dahan Mouth Dam = ده م Mund
*The words borrowed by Turks.
** The Letter "X" = "Kh" in English.
.......
Dear İnce,
Is that all you know about Kurdish language? Then, let me correct you; that you may lead others to get misinformed.
More than 70% of Kurds Speak Kurmanji (North Kurmanji) and 20% of Kurds speak Sorani (South Kurmanji) And the rest 10% speak other dialects.
The features distinguishing the two dialects (Kurmanji and Sorani) or sub-dialects within each group are mainly morphological. Differences on the phonological level are: (1) the Sorani /I: Î/ contrast does not appear in Kurmanji (as you mentioned in your example), (2) /h / found in some Sorani sub-dialects is lacking in Kurmanji, (3) the Kurmanji aspirated distinction /p, t, k - p, t, k /, probably borrowed from Armenian, is lacking in Sorani, (4) the Kurmanji. "emphatic" (i.e., velarized) consonants /s, t, z/, probably borrowed from Arabic, do not appear in Sorani.
Morphological differences include, among others, (1) the definite suffix -eke appears only in Sorani, (2) the Sorani. verb suffix -ewe appears as preverb ve- in Kurmanji., (3) Sorani. pronominal suffixes -(i)m, -(i)t, etc are lacking in Kurmanji., and (4) the Kurmanji distinction in case (normative and oblique) and gender (masculine and feminine) in nouns and pronouns is lacking in Sorani (some of these distinctions appear to a very Inflated extent in Mukri and other sub-dialects of S.). The rest are mostly the same.
So, just have a look to the new table that re-arranged by me and added Sorani (South Kurmanji) words too. Then tell me, can you see much more difference between the two dialects as you were expected? No, But you can see a lot of similarities between Kurdish and German. In fact, we can even say Kurdish language is more ancient than German.
Let me give some examples: “Door” in Kurdish is “Derî” which comes from the verb “Der ve” meaning “out-side” we can expand the meaning in Kurdish as “(Thing) which separates out-side, the “barrier” the “Derî” which is in German is “Tür”
Lets talk about the word “Brother” that is in Persian “Bradar = برادر " and is in Kurdish Kurmanjî/Sorani “Bira = برا “ the origin of “Bira” might come from “Bi-ra” which means “With/By vein or With/By blood-vessel. So, we can expand it as “(who) comes from the same vein or blood-vessel”. So where goes the “-ther” and “-der” in “Bro-ther” and “Bra-dar”? I can say nowhere in Kurdish. Because ve Kurds already using the word “Der” as “Out-side”
Let's talk about the “New” in Persian is “Taza” or “Jadid = جديد (Arabic Orig.) We Kurds in Kurmanji say “Nû” and in Sorani “Nwê” which is in German “Neu”.
Also the word “Lightning” in Persian is “Barq = برق " which is in Kurdish “Brûsk” and in German is “ Blitz“ that is nothing to do with Persian.
Also the word “Drop„ in Persian is “Raha kardan = رها کردن " that is in Kurdish/Sorani/Kurmanji “Dlop„ and in German “Trop-fen„. They added the "fen" (!)
In Kurdish Kurmancî/Sorani for “Son„ you can use several alternatives such as “Kur, law, pis, role„ but in Persian only “Pusar„ Same for “Daughter you can use either “Dot, keç, qiz„ but in Persian only “Dokhtar„.
So, lets come to other side of the medallion, the Turkish influence. I can prove that you (Turks) borrowed a huge amount of words from foreigners. Lets say 40% from Arabic&Semitic and 35% from Indo-Europeans, and 15% from Mongol, Chinese and Russian, Latin etc. And may be 5% to 10% is pure Turkish. In fact some Turks put forward this idea. Just read this article “Türkçe Diye Bir Dil Yok!” at aykiridogrulardotcom that prepared by Turks.
And also lets inspect the given table and find Indo-Aryan (Kurdish, Persian, etc.) originated words that borrowed by Turks:
Bab
Peder
Brader
Doktor
Küçük
Taze
Çeşme
Tohum
Ateş
Tufan
Boran
Mert
Merdane
To be more clearly, you (Turks) even don't have your OWN word for the “word” and “sentence” that are “Kelime” and “cümle” both are borrowed from Arabs. You imagine the rest ;)
At the end of your article you mentioned “It be like saying the word Goot in German was a loan word from English word Good and the fact is both languages share the same origins”
Then I am asking you: How much you know the German and English history? Do you know that in the ancient times forefathers of Germans immigrated to the UK then afterwards a people so called English formed over there. Isn't it a conflict example given by you?
You better go and get busy with the proposed questions that asked in some other web sites, lets say “Turks are barbarians? Yes with the rest of the World”. Or go and get busy with the Turkish Language and its root “Türkçe Diye Bir Dil Yok! = “There is no such a language called Turkish” that proposed by some Turks.
Dear İnce,
Please think more ince and follow the true path amkp. ;)
|
Merd BAwer
|
|
Merd Bawer
Immortal Guard
Joined: 17-Aug-2014
Location: Istanbul
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 17-Aug-2014 at 15:22 |
You know de meaning Persian in Kurdish language? It is "Parsek" that means "Beggar" That's all I know about you. See the Kurdish journalist Musa Anter's "Memoirs". To me you Persian were gypsies and came live near around Kurds. I believe in that as I believe in God.
|
Merd BAwer
|
|
Centrix Vigilis
Emperor
Joined: 18-Aug-2006
Location: The Llano
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7392
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 17-Aug-2014 at 18:46 |
My friendly advice to you is slow down the rhetoric and the quasi insulting language and tone. You have your beliefs others as well. If you don't want to end up like Hemin. Then be easier on the opposition's feelings and position. No one says you have to agree. But you can disagree with more respect.
CV
|
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"
S. T. Friedman
Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'
|
|
red clay
Administrator
Tomato Master Emeritus
Joined: 14-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10226
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 18-Aug-2014 at 08:39 |
Take his advice Merd. Only 2 posts and your already on thin ice.
|
"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
|
|
Zagros-Toros
Immortal Guard
Joined: 28-Jan-2015
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 28-Jan-2015 at 06:36 |
30-40 thousand years ago people used stone tools, Heritage underground
temple, splendid rock tombs, the continued removal of rock blocks on the
size of the stone quarries is like an open-air museum. Doliche which is
the holiest city of the Kurdish Hittites (Medes) since the Byzantine
era with the archdiocese moved to Zeugma in the 7th century religious
center position is lost. From this date, a new city that was founded
around the Dilok (Kurdish: Dîlok or Ayntap) Kurdish Castle (Median)
Ayintap Dolikh began to take the place of the city and eventually became
a village Ayintap. Finds in Tell Doliche include stone tools from 30-40
thousand years ago. The so-called Dulicien culture is Neolithic. Other
finds in Doliche are an underground Kurdish Mithraic temple, rock
graves, and stone quarries from which giant rock blocks are produced.
During the Hittite period, it was a stop on the road connecting the
Mediterranean to Mesopotamia. It was also a religious center. The
sanctuary of the Hittite god Teshub was just at the north of the village http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pnqvCx7xQEhttp://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZXCpqhO-8E
Edited by Zagros-Toros - 28-Jan-2015 at 06:42
|
|
Zagros-Toros
Immortal Guard
Joined: 28-Jan-2015
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 28-Jan-2015 at 06:38 |
Kurdish Aries Statue and Grave Stones
http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiHg7bGJB3Y
Eerie Kurdish Cemetery in Batman, northern Kurdistan
http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Of4A_IR7rmg
Edited by Zagros-Toros - 28-Jan-2015 at 06:47
|
|
Zagros-Toros
Immortal Guard
Joined: 28-Jan-2015
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 28-Jan-2015 at 06:40 |
[QUOTE=Zagros-Toros]
Zagros-Toros]The Sumerian were Aryans-Kurds Sumerian language was spoken in ancient Kurdish Mesopotamia (Kurdish:
MezraBotan) is Proto Indo-European language. These great civilizations
is known for the invention of writing, at the end of the year 4000 BC
Lived in the region between the Tigris and Euphrates rivers
(Mesopotamian). Four thousand years ago, our community life, the role of
agriculture, ox power in the production and purification efficiency and
disciplined work Sumerians had created an economic doctrine. The
Sumerian language, is with Kur, Gutian, Hatti/Luwian, Xaldi (Urartu),
Hurrian/Mitanni, and other Aryan (Median) language is found to be
closely today as it bears resemblance with the Kurdish seen. It is
obvious that come from the same root as the etymology of words.Language
is alive, and very little language may remain unchanged in 4000. The
Kurds, over 1400 years the Arab cultural imperialism and the Turkey 86
years and despite denial were able to save their language from dying.The
reason for this is the Kurdish oral literature and folklore are rich.
Russian scholar: "The Kurds are the people most of the stories in the
world has ..." he pointed to the Kurdish oral literature. This rich oral
literature of the Ari Kurdish language was saved from dying. The Sumerian were Aryans Kurds Sumerian- Kurdish Language (Indo-European Language) Part 1/2 http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xKiwd6Xq3USumerian- Kurdish Language (Indo-European Language) Part 2/2 http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUJF9hhVoRc
Edited by Zagros-Toros - 28-Jan-2015 at 06:58
|
|
ChildrenOfMala'Kak
Janissary
Joined: 24-Feb-2016
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 19
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 24-Feb-2016 at 12:20 |
That is wrong on so many levels. Kurds are not germanic at all. Kurds are part of Iranic people. And Iranic people are part of the Aryan culture. Being Arayan got nothing to do with being tall,blue eye and blond hair. The Aryan culture derived from some tribe in Africa who migrated to India and then Middle east and founded Persia and Median and Scythian Empire. Iranic people today still celebrates Newroz which is a part of the Arayan tradition. Hitler used the term Arayan for sin own agenda. And he was neither tall,blond haired or blue eyed himself.
|
|
red clay
Administrator
Tomato Master Emeritus
Joined: 14-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 10226
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 24-Feb-2016 at 13:06 |
Opinions on this subject are like bellybuttons, everyone has one.
Welcome aboard.
|
"Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces".
Unknown.
|
|
Centrix Vigilis
Emperor
Joined: 18-Aug-2006
Location: The Llano
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7392
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 24-Feb-2016 at 17:01 |
Originally posted by ChildrenOfMala'Kak
That is wrong on so many levels. Kurds are not germanic at all. Kurds are part of Iranic people. And Iranic people are part of the Aryan culture. Being Arayan got nothing to do with being tall,blue eye and blond hair. The Aryan culture derived from some tribe in Africa who migrated to India and then Middle east and founded Persia and Median and Scythian Empire. Iranic people today still celebrates Newroz which is a part of the Arayan tradition. Hitler used the term Arayan for sin own agenda. And he was neither tall,blond haired or blue eyed himself. |
Amen.
And what the guy above me said. otoh, this isn't particularly a new thread so don't expect much in the way of future responses to your post.
Iow. it's been beat to death not to mention that innumerable sources exist that id and support various themes on the history of Kurds.
Personally, because I'm a historian I'd start with the ''Sharafnama''.
R. Izady..and anything else he wrote/writes. The CIA/DOD still uses his
''The Kurds: a concise handbook''
|
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"
S. T. Friedman
Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'
|
|
ChildrenOfMala'Kak
Janissary
Joined: 24-Feb-2016
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 19
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 24-Feb-2016 at 17:25 |
Thank you sir. I'm kurdish myself, and this is the first time I've heard this. And with all do respect I was hoping It was more of a joke. Most of us today are dark skinned. I live scandinavia , so I have a pretty good Idead what germanic people looks like. So claiming they are kurds, we will automatically shoot ourselves in the foot. Because that automatically disqualifies us as kurds.
|
|