Affinity between ancient Iranic peoples

Originally posted by calvo rather than discussing the similarities between German and Iranian, let's keep to the subject on the affinities between different Iranian groups.

One thing that has been fairly well documented for almost all of the groups is their affection for horses.

We see this phrase repeated a few times on the inscriptions in Persepolis

"thâtiy Dârayavaush xshâyathiya iyam dahyâush Pârsa tyâm manâ Auramazdâ frâbara hyâ naibâ uvaspâ umartiyâ" which translates into "King Darius says 'This great country Parsa which Ahuramazda bestowed upon me, possessed of good horses, possessed of good men...'"

And it's also see on a few other places, where it is attributed to older kings (though it is unclear if they were responsible for it themselves).  The following is from a gold tablet found in Hamedan (although it is suspected to be a "forgery").

"thâtiy Ariyâramna xshâyathiya iyam dahyâushi Pârsâ tya adam dârayâ miy hya uvaspâ umartiyâ manâ baga vazraka Auramazdâ frâbara vashnâ Auramazdâha adam xshâyathiya iyam dahyâush amiy" translating into "King Ariaramnes says 'This country Persia which I hold, which is possessed of good horses, of good men, the Great God Ahuramazda bestowed it upon me. By the favor of Ahuramazda I am king in this country.' "

Horses are also featured fairly prominently in scythian art and coins. Sarmatians, Cimmerians and Parthians are all documented to have been equestrian societies (especially in their style of warfare.)

You are right, the climate could be different in very ancient times but the south of Iran could be near the north pole, as we read in Shahnameh!!

Edited by Cyrus Shahmiri - 12-Jul-2009 at 12:19

I don't know what you mean, "Kaiser" seems to be a loanword from Latin (Caesar), of course the Middle Persian word is the same as the German word, I think Persians were the first nation who called all Roman emperors "Kaiser".

You can hardly find any relation between original Iranian-speaking peoples and Indian, Slavic or Turko-Mongol peoples, of course there were some influences from one culture to another during a long contact between these peoples, but Iranian culture can be just related to Germanic culture, not other ones, it doesn't important Iranians believed in Ahura Mazda, Zurvan or Allah, they have always said "be name Goda/khoda" (in the name of God), and also it doesn't matter that their ruler was a khshaya/shah, basileus, malik, caliph, imam, ... they have always defended their kianig/kian (king, generation), if you find something in Iranian culture unsimilar to Germanic, you can consider that it is either from an non-Iranian origin or invented by Iranians in the later periods.

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri I also believe Germanic and Iranian peoples have a common origin, you can call it Iranian, Germanic or Irano-Germanic, anyway the obvious fact is that they differed from other Indo-European peoples, they were a people who believed in Goda (Middle Persian word for God [Modern Persian khoda]) and Kianig (Middle Persian word for king [Modern Persian Kian/Kiani), these are still the most holy words in the Persian culture.

I also believe Germanic and Iranian peoples have a common origin, you can call it Iranian, Germanic or Irano-Germanic, anyway the obvious fact is that they differed from other Indo-European peoples, they were a people who believed in Goda (Middle Persian word for God [Modern Persian khoda]) and Kianig (Middle Persian word for king [Modern Persian Kian/Kiani), these are still the most holy words in the Persian culture.

Originally posted by King John I didn't ask for similarities I asked in what way are they, the Lay of Hildebrand and the Roskam story, almost the same as Cyrus claims. This has more to do with Cyrus's theories about Germans being Iranian people or rather having a Scythian origin than anything else.

What are the differences between them? even in details, if you know?

Originally posted by King John So did Arthur, Oedipus (with his father), Zeus, Odin, and others.  So how is this not just Indo-European mythological similarities?  There are many stories that have fathers battling their sons, surely theirs more of a connection then that.  Saying that the story of Rostam and the Lay of Hildebrand are almost the same has to include more then just the fact that fathers battled their sons.

Add Suren to the list!