It's a waste of time becoming a medieval historian

Originally posted by Al Jassas As for you Parnell, god willing, I will dig up the legal history of Ireland and will definitely find a similar case to this.

Yes. I don't know what its like were you are from, but its considered a social no-no over here to imply that a woman 'has it coming to her' if she is a little promiscous or leaves little to the imagination when wearing clothes. Attitudes like these are disgusting and people who promote them are sick vermin.

Edited by Parnell - 04-Dec-2007 at 17:00

No one here said she "had it coming" Parnell. I dont know what the level of reading comprehension in your country is.

Edited by Mughaal - 11-Mar-2008 at 09:58

Originally posted by Mughaal No one here said she "had it coming" Parnell. I dont know what the level of reading comprehension in your country is.   Although if you make an open target of yourself; your more likely to get hit; isnt it? (if thats what your referring to)

You can't honestly be serious...? By exercising the freedom to wear clothes that don't resemble black bedsheets, a woman "opens herself" u to rape? Golly, if every woman who wore little clothing (say, bikinis at the beach) got raped worldwide, almost every woman in the west would have been raped! Which isn't quite the case. Are you implying that the burkha was designed as form of "self-defense" for women in the middle east, to protect them from marauding rapists? Or is it more so just a method of societal control to keep women relegated to he fringes and background of society? I'm guessing the latter...

And, Parnell, while I share some of your sentiments (as per disagreeing with some specific human-rights related aspects of Saudi society), I do not share your intolerant attitude. We're here to discuss and debate, not to demonize or insult other members. Name-calling is a childish action; the Mods aren't going to have to put you in time-out, are they?

Reductio ad Hitlerum, is not a very convincing arguement, Parnell. Hitler and the Nazis were directly responsible for the deaths of millions of people. The Saudis merely have rather strange sexual mores. Perspective is important.

Originally posted by Sparten Reductio ad Hitlerum, is not a very convincing arguement, Parnell. Hitler and the Nazis were directly responsible for the deaths of millions of people. The Saudis merely have rather strange sexual mores. Perspective is important.

Saudi belief that women shouldnt drive cars is a cultural issue; not a religious one.

Edited by Mughaal - 11-Mar-2008 at 09:57

Hello to you all

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim The idea that women can do nothing to protect themselves from a potential rapist is ludicrous. Rapists do not strike completely randomly.You can do things to protect yourself, and in countries with poorer security you must do more. Badmouthing those who would teach their daughters such skills by saying "They are blaming the girl for getting raped" is an extrodinarily dangerous thing to do.

True. Trouble is there is short way from this and to implying the women bear a part of the moral responsibility for the rape itself, which detracts some of the guilt from the rapist. It stems from the old fashioned (but not necessarily invalid) idea that a woman should exibit a minimum level of modesty if she is to be considered "decent" and thus be less likely to become a target of rape.

So how do we tell women to be careful without implying it's partly their fault if they happen to be molested? In analogy it's entirely uncontroversial to warn someone about wearing f.ex. expensive jewelry visibly while passing through a bad a neighbourhood, as they're likely to get robbed. While they bear no moral guilt for the crime it's undeniable they impacted the chain of events by wearing the jewelry in the first place. Likewise you could say that a woman who walks around downtown in the middle of night, alone and maybe even drunk, is more liable to be the victim of rape (or any other form of crime) than someone who takes precautions not to end up in this situation, even though they're both equally undeserving of such a crime. It's not a question of putting any of the blame on the woman, it's a question of common sense seen in light of statistics; most rapes (here at least) happen downtown between midnight and dawn, the victims are nearly always alone and very often affected by alcohol (partying is after all the reason they're out this late in the first place).

In an ideal world they should of course be able to go downtown naked, drink all night and stumble home alone through dark alleys without risking anything, but until we get there we should be more careful.

Originally posted by Brian J Checco   Name-calling is a childish action; the Mods aren't going to have to put you in time-out, are they?