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War is the only means to reunify China

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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: War is the only means to reunify China
    Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:21

Taiwan is part of China.

 

And, China does not mean regimes (PRC or ROC)

China is China by culture.

Both PRC and ROC (Mainland China and Taiwan) belong to the same identity of China.

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Both of these are regimes currently controlling the Chinese mainland and the island provinc of Taiwan.

It is not appropriate to refer China to any of these regimes because they are all governments of the one country of China.

 

PRC and ROC are all part of China just like the old Imperial Dynasties.

We can't say that the state of Chin was China and Chu was not when Chu was administrated by a different regime.

 

It is like during the Three Kingdom Era that all three states of Wei, Shu, and Wu referred to the same country of China, called all under heaven or Wah Ha ( I am sorry. I am bad with mandarin ping ying. I am trying to say Wah as in the second character of the full name of PRC or ROC in Chinese and Ha literally means summer.)

The fact was that China was controlled by three different regimes. However, none of them alienated themselves and called each other foreigners or aliens. The barbarians such as the Huns and Turks were, on the other hand, considered as aliens.

China is Chinalace by cultural heritage.

The vast majority of Taiwan is of Han descend. Both China and Taiwan share the same culture, language, customs, and tradition. Even the ways they do business are similar. (paying bride, exploitation, being miserly) Not true for all. So dont get mad.

In which sense, Hong Kong is more westernized. Hong Kong was ruled by the British for 150 years while Taiwan was only occupied by Japan for fifty years. If you compare the city layouts of Shanghai and Taipei, you can hardly find any obvious differences. But when you compare Hong Kong with cities on Taiwan and in Mainland China, you can see huge differences. But, Hong Kong is still a Chinese city after all. Even during the time when Hong Kong was ruled by the crown of England, the people there considered themselves as Chinese. They didnt call themselves White, English, British even though many of them were British national. What matters is the ethic heritage and culture.

Some might argue How about the Tibetans, Turks, and Mongolians? They are not of Han Chinese culture. Yes, they have differences and we control and rule them because we are stronger than them now.

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Taiwanese people are of Han descend like the majority of Mainland China. They should be the last ones who want to be independent because they are trying to split up the country formed by their own ethnicity. Its like English people trying to split up London from England.

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Its annoying and ignorant how some people on Taiwan call themselves pacific islanders and non Chinese while all of them hold Chinese surnames, have Chinese ancestors, have Chinese blood in them, and speak and write in Chinese.

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The name "China was actually derived from the world Chin when the first emperor unified China proper.

 

If you check the CIA factbook, it says the independence day of China is 221 bc under the First Emperor of Chin. Both mainland China and Taiwan are descendants of the Chin.

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So was Sino Sin referred to the Chin by the West, Thus, Sino was referred to China.

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I love peace and I hate war but I have realized that the only way to reunify the country is to fight a war.

Theres only one way out. Declare war on Taiwans separatists.

I am tired of hearing or reading their nonsense or news and magazines.

I know a lot of people pnTaiwan dont want reunification and even disregard their own ethnicity and identity and want to be barbaric islanders.

Think what you want. Just keep in mind that the reunification of China will come anyways. Its just a matter of whether it is by peaceful means or by force.

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Taiwans separatists are the disgrace of the Han people and or Chinese culture. And for those separatists, they should better stop using Chinese languages including Taiwanese (originally from Mainland China), release their blood, drop their surnames.

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The whole issue is not up to Taiwans population but the entire Chinese population.

Taiwan belongs to all Chinese people and not only people on this island.

Its like when you own some land, it doesnt mean you can declare independence of such an apartment from the country where it is located when all the family members want to be independent.

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Under current circumstances, it will most likely to be solved by war.

I have figured that declaring war on Taiwan is the only way out.

I have lost hope.

Declare war on Taiwan. The sooner, the better.

 

It is likely that China will suffer disastrous economic loss and it's a loss that all Chinese do not want. But, the reunification of China for thousands of years has always been the supreme goal and obligation for all regimes. It is viewed above all matters including the economy, human lives, and anything.



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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:45
yoou clearly are a troll with problems.  I think people national status should be determined on what they as people want, not the genes and their blood relatives.
"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
-Alexander Hamilton
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  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:47
I agree that if Taiwan does not want to be a part of the Chinese State, a war against this island nation would only be interpreted as aggressive.
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  Quote Styrbiorn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:47
Jaa, a Gross-China is exactly what we need. Why not start the Anschluss already?
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  Quote warhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:54

"I knew someone would use America as an example."

 

Because its the perfect one, its not just America, it include Australia as well.

 

"That's totally wrong and misleading for several factors:

 

"1. America has no official language and English is certainly not their official language."

 

What total BS, if English is not the official language what is Spanish?

 

"European Americans do not disregard their ethical heritage. Whether it is the Italian Americans, German Americans, they all call themselves Italians and Germans even though they don't even speak a word of Italian or German unlike the pathetic so called "Taiwanese"."

And when questioned their nationality, many will say american.

" America is a country formed by several expansions. Most of what is now the United States of America is consisted of lands far larger than the original thirteen colonies.And, please note that they were "colonies" that were never considered as part of England. "

 

The same goes with Taiwan during the Qing dynasty.

 

"Before America's independence, the vast majority of Americans actually requested the British crown to recognize their British citizenship and allowed them to be present in the British parliment. Yet, it was the British who denied Amercians' British citizenship and did not allow them to be considered as part of England proper, which led to the later rebellions by England's American's colonies."

 

That was then, now is now.

 

 

"English whites are no longer the majority of the United States of America. The white population is largely made up of Germans, Irish, Italians. "

 

So your BS is claiming that the U.S. in 1800 is not U.S. but England?

 

 

 " America is more like the case of Singapore where Chinese settlers went to Singapore and built a country of their own."

The point is speaking the same language and having the same blood does not make you the same nationality, do you even not understand this simple concept?

 

 "It has nothing in common with Taiwan. If you want Taiwan to be independent from China, it's like wanting Native Indians to be independent from their own country."

 

The Americans were from England, they were English, the same goes for Taiwan. If Taiwan becomes independent then they are a different country. Right now they are not. But thats due to political concept not ethnical.

 

"But the thing is there is no Indian nation. England gave up on America was like Japan giving up on Taiwan. And, China has soverighty over Taiwan."

 

Thats not the point, the point is ethnicity does not equal nationality.

 

"As I mentioned, America is like the case of Singapore. Do people in Singapore speak Chinese? They surely do. Do they consider themselves as Chinese? The Chinese population there certainly does! "

 

Please, there are many that do and many that don't.

 

 

"If you want to talk about America, make you know at least something about it.Your statement proves nothing but your ignorant and unfamiliarity with American history.

You know nothing about America's ethicity. Please write something that you actually know about next time.

"

 

as little as  know, its still mountain next to your pithole.

 

"Ethicity is not always equal to nationality like the case with Pakistan and India. Certainly not the US for its ethic diversity. "

If you actually read my post I've already said ethnicity is not nationality, so if you are not disagreeing with it, what are you birching about?

 

"But, in the case of China, the Han culture is China and the minority population is under the Han's rule. "

Right and in America the majority is under the white's rule.

 

 

 

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  Quote warhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:57

"I agree that if Taiwan does not want to be a part of the Chinese State, a war against this island nation would only be interpreted as aggressive. "

 

Then so is the American civil war.

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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:01

Taiwan is not an Island nation. Its full name is the Republic of China. It surely has realized that it can longer conquer the mainland and wants to seek independence.

Reunification of China has been the supreme obligation for all Chinese regimes. It is different from aggression. To the Chinese, the reunification of China is higher than all matters including anything.

America is not a suitable example at all. I guess you only looked at part of what I wrote.

The majority of the US will be latino in twenty years.

I didn't say the Whites were not the majority today. I said the English were not the majority today. As the while population is consisted of all European races.

English is not the official language of the US. It is the most commonly spoken one. The US does not have an official language. Spanish is the second most popular language in the US.

America is like an example of Singapore. Please read what I wrote again, ok?

It's annoying how people choose what to read and what to copy.

It is up to you what you guys think. The peaceful reunification of China is the best solution to the Taiwan issue. But I am saying that it is not possible anymore. A war is the only way out. I don't want to see a war but there is no other way out!

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  Quote warhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:03
You are the one that haven't read my post, you went into those extended spiel when I just stated the fact that ethnicity does not equal nationality. That was all I intended to say, nothing else.
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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:04

American people identify themselves as American nationals. But, they also identify themselves as for example, Germans, Italians, based upon their ethic origin.

I am an American national, too. But the only people who can call themselves American in term of ethicity are the native American.

All I saying that there are people in Taiwan who call themselves half Chinese, half Taiwanese. That's funny and pathetic. It's like a person in Massachusetts call himself "half New Yorker, half Bostonian".

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  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:06
China has no claim to Taiwan, it has never really been a part of China has it. Let's keep in mind that China is less a country and more like a continent. Does Iraq have claim to Kuwait because it used to be a part of Iraq and because they are also Arabs? Let's keep that in mind. I just don't believe that Taiwan should be annexed by China if it overwhelmingly wants to be autonomous.
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  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:11
Originally posted by coolstorm

American people identify themselves as American nationals. But, they also identify themselves as for example, Germans, Italians, based upon their ethic origin.



I'd have to disagree.  All the white people I know, unless they have only recently immigrated consider themselves American.  When asked "What are you?"  They respond, "I'm American."  I have to specifiy that I want their specific ethnic make up to discern their identities.
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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:12

sorry typo

All I am saying here is that there are people in Taiwan idetifying themselves as mixed of half Chinese, half Taiwanese. That's funny and pathetic. It's like a white person in Massachusetts calling himself "half New Yorker, half Bostonian".

It is legitimate to say for example a person is a mixed of English and German bloods. But it is ignorant to say a person is a mixed of London and Berlin blood.

Get the point?

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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:16

"I'd have to disagree.  All the white people I know, unless they have only recently immigrated consider themselves American.  When asked "What are you?"  They respond, "I'm American."  I have to specifiy that I want their specific ethnic make up to discern their identities."

You probably have to hang out with them more often.

They say they are American. That's true. But, they also say they are German, Italian etc. German American. Italian American. Native American are the only American by ethic origin. Among American people, they ask each other what ethic origin they belong to. Of course, to foreigners like u, there's no point of doing so.

When someone from Beijing asks a person from Shanghai, what are you? Would the Shanghainese person say to the Beijing person. "I am Chinese from China"? Of course not. He would say I am from Shanghai.

But to foreigners, he would say "I am Chinese". That's the same concept.

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  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:22
Ummm...Once again I'd have to disagree.  Even if they do identify with those groups they do so only minimally.  They don't really give a damn about their race.  Heck most of them don't even know 100% what they are.  BTW I'm not a foreigner...I'm an American.
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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:24

"China has no claim to Taiwan, it has never really been a part of China has it. Let's keep in mind that China is less a country and more like a continent. Does Iraq have claim to Kuwait because it used to be a part of Iraq and because they are also Arabs? Let's keep that in mind. I just don't believe that Taiwan should be annexed by China if it overwhelmingly wants to be autonomous. "

Taiwan was made a Chinese province during the late Ming dynasty. The last Ming loyalist army stationed on the island of Taiwan after the Manchu took over Mainland China. That's kinda like what's going on now.

Taiwan was made a Chinese province earlier than any states were made a US state.

It was ceded to Japan after military defeat of imperial Qing dynasty by the Japanese.

After WW2, Japan returned the colony of Taiwan to China (The Republic of China) under the Treaty of San Francisco. The Republic of China (Taiwan) that has controlled only the province of Taiwan and part of the Fujian Province with the rest of the province controlled by the PRC after 1949. The Republic of China which was recently taken over by the pro independent party represented all of China including the Mainland until the year 1972 when Mainland China took over Taiwan's role of representing China. Both regimes belong to the same China. The issue is which one is the legitimate government.

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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:30

"BTW I'm not a foreigner...I'm an American"

But I can tell you are definitely not white. Are you one of those who always stick with their Asian folks 24/7?

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  Quote warhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:39

"China has no claim to Taiwan, it has never really been a part of China has it. "

Somebody hand me a belt, my belly is cracking.

 

"Does Iraq have claim to Kuwait because it used to be a part of Iraq and because they are also Arabs?"

Don't even go into it, the international law is a long drawn out process, and to this day the pro separatist will claim the law is on their term while the unifiers will claim the law to be on their term, its all up to interpretation.

" Let's keep that in mind. I just don't believe that Taiwan should be annexed by China if it overwhelmingly wants to be autonomous. "

 

The overwhelmiong do not. The poll shows that the extremeist only make up less than a quarter of the population,  13 percent are hard core chinese nationalists, while the rest consider themselves to be both Taiwanese and Chinese and just like the present day status quo.

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  Quote warhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 14:54
Also, its not the PRC that wants to invade Taiwan, PRC just want the present day status, its the Taiwan ruling party that wants separation over only a name. If China invade, it wouldn't be because its aggressive, it would be because Taiwan declares independence, and no country would want to loose its territory that they consider theirs.
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  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 15:29
Originally posted by coolstorm

"BTW I'm not a foreigner...I'm an American"

But I can tell you are definitely not white. Are you one of those who always stick with their Asian folks 24/7?



Heres how it is for me.  I'm a Korean.  Here are my friends from most to least.  Indian, Chinese(Taiwanese also), White, Korean, Vietnamese.

So meh, I'm about in the middle.
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  Quote coolstorm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 16:55

"Also, its not the PRC that wants to invade Taiwan, PRC just want the present day status, its the Taiwan ruling party that wants separation over only a name. If China invade, it wouldn't be because its aggressive, it would be because Taiwan declares independence, and no country would want to loose its territory that they consider theirs. "

PRC = People's Republic of China. It is the government of the Mainland.

It surely wants to reunify China. I think you made some mistakes here. Did you make up ROC with PRC?

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