Turks in Bulgaria (Flame-War Warning)

Originally posted by dorian Bulldog,   Bulgaria is an independent country and the people in this have nothing to do with the Turks.

If I were you I would be more careful with the generalizations. To say that the people in Bulgaria have nothing to do with the Turks is plain wrong. 10% of the population is Turkish.In the North there are Christian Turks - the Gagauz,. Many Turkish words are still commonly used in the Bulgarian vocabulary. So Bulgaria has many things to do with the Turks.

We, the Turks, are an integral part of Bulgaria. Bulgaria would be incomplete without us, we would be incomplete without Bulgaria.


Edited by bg_turk - 24-May-2006 at 18:41

Originally posted by Bulldog I blame the education system and parents

You are putting the blame in the right place. Bulgarian history classes are filled with anti-turkish venom and hatred and it starts at a pretty early age. To pursuade a Bulgarian in their Turkic origins would be to go against years of brainwashing at school.
 
Bulgarian nationhood has been engineered and built entirely in complete opposition to the Turks.It is much easier to unite people when there is one common enemy.  Though this is now changing, deep rooted prejudices are still present and it is often quite easy to explot them for political parurposes.

For example, the fascistocommunist party ATAKA has earned 8% of the national vote just because of its anti-turkish rhetoric. And now their psychopat leader is in parliament.






They held a protest on the 3rd March (Bulgaria's  national holiday marking its creation as a result of the Russian occupation of the Ottoman Empire) and during this protest his supporters burned Turkish fesses and feredjes.
Others such as Petko, chose to express their support for the party from the top of the tree right accross parliament and threatening to beat with a stick the security personel who were trying to bring them down :

Ataka party leader Volen Siderov told the crowd that ethnic minorities such as Turks and Gypsies should not be allowed into the Bulgarian government.

"Let's give Bulgaria back to the Bulgarians," Mr Siderov told the crowd. "Bulgaria is not yet free. Bulgaria is still under Turkish rule."

Loudspeakers broadcast the music from the film Star Wars as the nationalists marched past government buildings

Read more here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4772360.stm


Greeks also seem to be interested in the ATAKA party
http://www.enet.gr/online/online_fpage_text/id=91645180,99535484,12120636
(the Greek state has a history of extending full-support to all antiturkish parties in Bulgaria)




Edited by bg_turk - 24-May-2006 at 19:36

What  you dont believe Petko climbed a tree? Check this out:

http://www.news.bg/article.php?cid=7&pid=0&aid=174554

The title is "3 March -from the tree"

Originally posted by Neoptolemos As for your last sentense, if you keep provoking like this, I fear that you will soon find yourself outside this forum.

This was not a provocation, it was a statement of fact. Greece was the only country in Europe that supported the name-changing campaign in Bulgarian in the 80s.

Originally posted by Neoptolemos Give me a link in English for this name-changing campaign to understand what you are talking about.

This whole thread, and the the other thread "Revival Process" is about that campaign.
http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11996

You stated: the Greek state has a history of extending full-support to all antiturkish parties in Bulgaria. Either prove it (state, full-support, antiturkish) or else you're just provoking again.

Greece supported the Communist government of Bulgaria in its name changing campaign and I already provided a link to the article:
http://www.ethnopolitics.org/ethnopolitics/archive/volume_I/issue_4/petkova.pdf

On p.47 Petkova states:

On the international scene, the US and the UK supported Turkey�s claims. Germany, France, Italy and other EC members recommended that handling the matter in the CSCE, rather than bilaterally with Bulgaria. Greece was the only EC member-state that openly supported Bulgaria. Consequently, Greek-Bulgarian relations improved to such an extent that in September 1986 the two countries signed a declaration of friendship, good-neighbourly relations and co-operation, including provision for bilateral consultations should a threat to the security of either party arise. In Turkey some argued that this was not compatible with the obligations of Greece as a NATO member (L�tem 1999: 7). Despite the international condemnation of the policies concerning the Bulgarian Turks, the Bulgarian government pursued its chosen course.

The  Greek policies towards Bosnian Muslims, Kosovar Albanians and Bulgairan Turks is enough to convince anybody that Greece has a proven track record of an openly anti-muslim foreign policy  not only with regard to Bulgaira , but in the context of the whole Balkans.


Edited by bg_turk - 24-May-2006 at 21:03

Originally posted by Neoptolemos If I understant well, the Greek government stated that they approve Bulgaria's policy. Is that right? Did they take any other measure to support this policy?

It would be foolish to openly support human rights violations. Which government would state that they support the killing of hundreds, the imprisonment of thousands, and the deportation of hundreds of thousands?

This is what the Communist regime had done, and that the Greek government extended full diplomatic support and signed all these friendship agreements with a pariah regime that was completely isolated from the democratic world because of its horrendous human right record (not only against Turks, but against some Bulgarians too), is a clear indication to me that Greece approved of the policies against the Bulgarian Turks. My conviction about the Greek complicitiy is enforced by the fact that she signed all these agreements after the initiation of the campaign, and not before, so the campaign against the Turks and the Greek diplomatic support were clearly related.

And are there are incidents which show that the Greek state offers full support to the antiturkish parties in Bulgaria???

Unlike the Srebrenica Genocide, where Greek nationals took direct part under the encouragement and glorification by the Greek media, I am not aware of any direct Greek involvement in Bulgaria in 1980s. The cold war would have made it impossible for Greeks to enter Bulgaria anyway.

But in any case the Greek diplomatic support in Europe proved crucial for a regime which was isolated and pressed for its human rights record, (not unike the financial and other Greek support for the Milosevic regime).

I do not blame Bulgarians for the actions of the totalitarian regime that was imposed on them, but what excuse does democratic Greece have for supporting a regime that comitted such horrible crimes?


Edited by bg_turk - 24-May-2006 at 22:12

What I've understood is that whatever we say some people don't want to destroy the world which is built in their mind through the years. It isn't worth it.

Originally posted by bg_turk . The cold war would have made it impossible for Greeks to enter Bulgaria anyway.

Edited by Yiannis - 25-May-2006 at 06:50

I won't bother going into detail. Just pointed out the obvious. Anyone who can search for your posts (ever since you joined), with find out for him/her self.

Originally posted by Yiannis Anyone who can search for your posts (ever since you joined), with find out for him/her self.

Anyone who can search my threads will also discover that quite a few of them have been closed by no other but yourself.