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Topic: Biggest Empires Posted: 10-Apr-2005 at 23:21 |
Originally posted by rider
Originally posted by Hardel
Originally posted by Imperatore Dario I
Bah, the Mongols. Successful only for a time, and then disappeared from history. At least the British Empire continued to thrive, and the British continued to prosper, bringing so much of the world to its knees, and making her neighbors shake their legs. Comparing the British Empire to the Mongol Empire, in terms of power, influence, wealth, and culture, definately the British Empire is better! |
All neighbours of Mongol empire feared from it.Did Pruss,France,Russian afraid from Brits?
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Actually many times it did. And after the mongols were your neighbours, there was nobody in those neighbouring lands to fear, only the Russians made a longer stand against the mongols.
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I don' t mean to insult you, but your quote is the most laughable one on this page. The Russians and the rest of the Europeans that the mongols encountered made the SHORTEST stand of all. The Mongol European campaign was one of its fastest and most successful of all, requiring only a couple of years in total. Taking place simultaneously as the China campaign, the European theater of war was where the Mongols practically invented the "Blitzkrieg" as it is known in modern times. In CONTRAST, the mongol invasion of China was one of its most sluggish campaigns, spanning over 4 decades!! In the end, it was NOT the mongol military machine that conquered much of China, but the mongols did it through shrewd politics implemented by the cunning Kublai Khan. (Addendum: There was no unified "China" at this time, but a fractured land of several empires and dynasties) If you want to know more, I highly recommend a great book that is also a New York Times bestseller:
Genghis Khan and the Making of the Modern World --- by Jack Weatherford. c. 2004
It's perhaps the most highly acclaimed book on Mongol history to date. You should check it out on Amazon.com. I'm surprised that you haven't read it, it's been published for more than a year! Much of the information that I wrote above were not just from this book (though this book covers the subject more beautifully and comprehensively than many others before it), but well known in most other source of Asian history as well. I'm equally surprised that a lot of people who apparently don' t know much about WORLD history outside of their little corner of interest choose to make such bold and sweeping statements as "So and so was the biggest empire, owned the best lands...blah, blah, blah!! If you don't know much beyond your own little sphere of awareness, please don't make grandiosely foolish statements or rankings.
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rider
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Posted: 11-Apr-2005 at 02:02 |
And I am not trying to protect myself but at 1270's Russians had aswell many statesa and I think you misunderstood 'the longer stand' part, for Mongols never conquered the upper states of Russia, as Novgorod...With Kiev, that is entirely a different thing and that fell quickly.
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Posted: 11-Apr-2005 at 20:26 |
Originally posted by rider
And I am not trying to protect myself but at 1270's Russians had aswell many statesa and I think you misunderstood 'the longer stand' part, for Mongols never conquered the upper states of Russia, as Novgorod...With Kiev, that is entirely a different thing and that fell quickly.
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The "upper states" of Russia that you mentioned were very insignificant principalities at that time and were thus not part of the Mongol objective at all. So it's pointless to say that they "made a longer stand" (against what?). However, what the Mongols wanted and successfully conquered were the most important Russian kingdoms and principalities, including Kiev, which was considered the political and religious center of the Slavic world. This was consistent with the pattern of Mongol conquests, whereby they were always aimed at the most powerful, important, wealthy civilizations of their time in whichever region of the world they invaded. For all practical purposes, the minor "upper states" that you mentioned didn't matter at all in the larger realm of Russia. As a case in point, a year after the fall of Kiev, the entry for 1242 in the Novgorod Chronicle referred to Batu Khan of the Mongols as Tsar Batu, literally meaning Caesar Batu and signifying his united rule over all of Russia. The fact that the Mongols didn't burn down Novgorod and a few other minor peripheral territories hardly mattered and was of no consequence to their rule over Russia for the next 3 centuries. In a similar vein, the Mongols also never conquered "all" of China, either. This applied to the areas of southern China in the tropical zone. Yet, in talking about their legacy in China, you never hear anyone bringing up those minor details that mattered little in the larger scheme of things.
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Posted: 13-Apr-2005 at 16:23 |
mongol empire and abbasid asid empire
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Posted: 03-May-2005 at 01:22 |
Isn't the Brittish Empire the biggest and most influential. Britain was
a economic superpower but the Mongols just had alot of land
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ArmenianSurvival
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Posted: 06-May-2005 at 16:47 |
At one point the British controlled roughly 25% of all the land on
earth. That is the biggest empire in history, landwise, and probably
economically too. The Mongols had the largest continuous
land empire on earth, because all their lands were connected, while the
British had overseas colonies. I think the Mongol Empire was the 3rd or
4th largest empire ever, and i know the USSR was in the top 5.
Edited by ArmenianSurvival
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Mass Murderers Agree: Gun Control Works!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Resistance
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Perseas
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Posted: 06-May-2005 at 19:33 |
From Sunday Times Magazine of 24/4/2005.
"Listomania"
The Men Who Conquered The Most Miles
Genghis Khan (c1162-1227): 4,860,000 sq miles, including northern China, Mongolia, southern Siberia and central Asia.
Alexander the Great (356-323BC): 2,180,000 sq miles, including southern Balkan peninsula, Asia Minor, Egypt and the entire Middle East.
Tamerlane (c1336-1405): 2,145,000 sq miles, including most of the Near East.
Cyrus the Great (c600-529BC): 2,090,000 sq miles, including the Median Empire, Babylonia, Assyria, Syria, Palestine, the Indus Valley and southern Turkistan.
Attila (c406-453), King of the Huns: 1,450,000 sq miles, encompassing most of central and eastern Europe and the western Russian plain, but not Gaul.
You can find it also here:
http://www.ehistory.com/world/ListPreviewOnly.cfm?LID=43& ;PreviewOnly=yes&public=yes&track=front
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warhead
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Posted: 11-May-2005 at 18:49 |
The list is incomplete, and wrong, especially regarding to the last few. I can name dozens of people that conquered more than Cortez.
And I also don't know the meaning of this "conquerer" Genghis certainly didn't conquer all that territory by himself. Is it simply the leading general?
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Khashayarshah
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Posted: 07-Nov-2006 at 16:30 |
The mongolian was the largest empire before the handgun, the achemanian
empire was the first world empire, and the egyptian empire was the
longest lasting, lasting over 3000 years.
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Hellios
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Posted: 07-Nov-2006 at 18:47 |
The British Empire, later called the British Commonwealth, later called the British Commonwealth of Nations, later called the Commonwealth of Nations, was a 53 country confederation of nations.
Edited by Hellios - 07-Nov-2006 at 18:51
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TMPikachu
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Posted: 07-Nov-2006 at 19:39 |
Originally posted by Anger_Management
Isn't the Brittish Empire the biggest and most influential. Britain was
a economic superpower but the Mongols just had alot of land
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and alot of influence. When you make it safe to travel from Italy to China, alot of ideas and technology will be moving around.
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Posted: 07-Nov-2006 at 22:11 |
Originally posted by warhead
The list is incomplete, and wrong, especially regarding to the last few. I can name dozens of people that conquered more than Cortez.... |
If you mean Cortes founded the Spanish Empire you are wrong. He just conquered Mexico. Actually Pizarro conquered more land than Cortes.
But if you add all those conquest you fill find not many Empires were as widespread, except for the Portuguese and British Empires.
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Posted: 08-Nov-2006 at 05:18 |
Technically, the Australian Indigenous Aborignals had a monumental (but may I say uncontested and predominantly worthless - in terms of surplus and resources available - ) land mass within their control. The tribes may not have officially been united, but they were still recognised as the same peoples. Of course not the biggest empire in history - if you can call it an 'empire' - but certainly a significantly sized piece of land under the control of a people!
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Dalsung Hwarang
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Posted: 09-Nov-2006 at 19:37 |
I wouldn't count the Mongolian Empire... But without them I think the Han China or the Roman Empire.
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Posted: 13-Nov-2006 at 20:51 |
Yup,British take 25 percent population and land into his pocket,but he never conquered and defeated a superpower that time.Unlike British empire,Mongol defeated all superpowers that time.By the way,ppls and land ruled by England are uncivilized African and south-eastern asians.
Originally posted by Mixcoatl
Originally posted by Sleeker
the Mongolian Empire. |
When the Mongolian Empire was at its largest it had already fallen apart in different states, therefore it's not one empire. The biggest Empire ever was the British Empire (in 1923). The British empire occupied 25% of world territory.
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think
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Posted: 14-Nov-2006 at 03:02 |
Yeh the British only battled people with spears
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Posted: 27-Nov-2006 at 19:07 |
The Indians had gunpowder and firearms, so did the other colonial powers from which the British took territory.eg. The Spanish and Portugeuse. They did not ONLY battle people with spears! They were usually heavily outnumbered by those 'spear wielders' anyway, plus, the gun was not a massively decisive piece of technology at this stage. In addition, this topic is not about HOW the empires were acquired, but the eventual comparative size of the empires...
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souljahofgod
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Posted: 16-Dec-2006 at 10:22 |
the biggest empires ever (ancient times) were . and i think this is in right order:
1.Mongol empire 12,800,000 sq. miles
2.the chinese empire 4,300,000 sq. miles
3.Persian empire 2,382,000 sq. miles
4.Seljuq turk empire 2,300,000 sq. miles
5.Roman empire 2,200,000 sq. miles
6.Macedonian empire 2,100,00 sq.miles
thats right i think...
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Hellios
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Posted: 16-Dec-2006 at 13:26 |
Originally posted by souljahofgod
1.Mongol empire 12,800,000 sq. miles
2.the chinese empire 4,300,000 sq. miles
3.Persian empire 2,382,000 sq. miles
4.Seljuq turk empire 2,300,000 sq. miles
5.Roman empire 2,200,000 sq. miles
6.Macedonian empire 2,100,00 sq.miles |
1. The vastness of the ancient Mongol Empire is really impressive.
2. In the case of China, just the country itself is enormous, so what was the surface area of the empire beyond ancient China?
3. Persian Empire - good pick, souljahofgod. Probably my favorite empire, because of the wide scope of cultural diversity through its history. Of the many Persian empires, my favorites were the Median Empire, Achaeminid Empire, Seleucid Empire, and Parthian Empire. The Sassanid Dynasty also of course, but maybe the Parthians would've been able to resist the Arab invaders more.
The Persian Empire(s):
4. Yeah, the Seljuks. Please tell me if this is more or less right:
"The Seljuks were nomads from the steppes near the Caspian Sea that converted to Islam around the 10th century. Approximately 70,000 Seljuk Turks were purchased as slaves to fill the ranks of the Islamic army of the caliph of Baghdad. These slaves were converted to the Sunni branch of Islam. In 1055 they became the real power behind the caliph in Baghdad and began extending their rule. Their leaders took the title "sultan," meaning "holders of power." By 1100 they controlled most of Anatolia (taken from the Byzantines), Palestine, the lands surrounding the Persian Gulf, the holy cities of Arabia, and as far east as Samarkand."
"In 1071 the Seljuks achieved a stunning victory over a Byzantine army at Manzikert in modern Turkey that led to Turkish occupation of most of Anatolia. At nearly the same time, they successfully captured Jerusalem from its Egyptian Muslim rulers. These two events shocked the Byzantines, the Papacy, and the Europeans. The result was the Crusades that carried on for the next 200 years."
"The Seljuk Turks were worn down by the recurring wars with the Crusaders, even though they were successful ultimately in regaining control of Palestine. They were threatened simultaneously by the activities of the Assassins, a heretical sect of Islam. Internally, Islam entered a period of introspection because of the popularity of Sufi mysticism. During this period of exhaustion and weakness, they were attacked suddenly by the Mongols and collapsed. Baghdad fell to the invaders in 1258 and the Seljuk Empire disappeared."
5. Yesh, the Romans, but also the Byzantine Empire.
6. I agree about Alexander's Empire; he tried to Hellenize a big area.
Edited by Hellios - 16-Dec-2006 at 13:53
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Posted: 16-Dec-2006 at 18:48 |
Originally posted by Khashayarshah
The mongolian was the largest empire before the handgun, the achemanian empire was the first world empire, and the egyptian empire was the longest lasting, lasting over 3000 years. |
Actually, the first known world "Empire" was ruled over by Sargon The Great of Akkad.
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