Originally posted by Sidney
According to the Timaeus;
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Plato's timeline is thus;
Founding of Athens c.9590 C
Founding of Sais c.8590 BC
Atlantis invades and conquers most of Europe and Africa
War between Athens and Atlantis preserved in Sais records.
Athens triumphant and liberates countries under Atlantian rule.
Athens is destroyed by earthquake and Atlantis sinks beneath the sea.
It is clear from this that Plato never recorded that Atlantis was destroyed 9000 years before Solon, but placed the destruction of Atlantis after the foundation of Sais (ie after c.8590 BC0.
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But this is contradicted in the Critais;
1. Plato records that Critais tells Socrates; -
"Let me begin by observing first of all, that nine thousand was the sum of years which had elapsed since the war which was said to have taken place between those who dwelt outside the Pillars of Heracles and all who dwelt within them; this war I am going to describe."
This is confirmed later; -
"Many great deluges have taken place during the nine thousand years, for that is the number of years which have elapsed since the time of which I am speaking;"
Critais was speaking c.410 BC, so here Plato is saying that the war between Athens and Atlantis occurred c.9410 BC. This directly contradicts his earlier timeline.
2. Plato records Critais saying;
"In the days of old the gods had the whole earth distributed among them by allotment. There was no quarrelling; for you cannot rightly suppose that the gods did not know what was proper for each of them to have, or, knowing this, that they would seek to procure for themselves by contention that which more properly belonged to others."..."Hephaestus and Athene, who were brother and sister, and sprang from the same father, having a common nature, and being united also in the love of philosophy and art, both obtained as their common portion this land [Athens],"..."And Poseidon, receiving for his lot the island of Atlantis."
He is thus saying that Athens and Atlantis were founded at the same time - when the gods were apportioned land (ie in 9590 BC)
But Plato also records Critais saying regarding the various kings and states under Atlantean control -
"All these and their descendants for many generations were the inhabitants and rulers of divers islands in the open sea; and also, as has been already said, they held sway in our direction over the country within the Pillars as far as Egypt and Tyrrhenia."
"For many generations, as long as the divine nature lasted in them, they were obedient to the laws....but when the divine portion began to fade away, and became diluted too often and too much with the mortal admixture, and the human nature got the upper hand,...[then] they were full of avarice and unrighteous power."
So the war between Athens and Atlantis occurred many generations after the gods had set up their countries (for, according to Critais, the gods don't argue). This contradicts Plato's Timaeus timeline - for if Athens and Atlantis were founded together then the date for the war c.9410 BC (c.180 years later) is not the 'many generations' that Plato represents.
4. In Timaeus Plato records that Athens and Atlantis were destroyed on the same night - Athens sinking beneath the ground and Atlantis sinking beneath the sea. However in Critais he records that - "Atlantis, which, as was saying, was an island greater in extent than Libya and Asia, and when afterwards sunk by an earthquake, became an impassable barrier of mud to voyagers sailing from hence to any part of the ocean.", but records of Athens - "For the fact is that a single night of excessive rain washed away the earth and laid bare the rock; at the same time there were earthquakes, and then occurred the extraordinary inundation, which was the third before the great destruction of Deucalion."
Here Plato is saying that Athens was flooded, contradicting the other narrative that it was swallowed up by the earth.
The part that does agree however is the one that says the war with Atlantis occurred after Sais was founded;
3. Plato tells us that the Egyptians recorded the names in the history of Athens while ancient Athens still survived, because - "the early Egyptians in writing them down had translated them into their own language". This had to be while ancient Athens still existed because after Athens was destroyed "any survivors [of the destruction], as I have already said, were men who dwelt in the mountains; and they were ignorant of the art of writing, and had heard only the names of the chiefs of the land, but very little about their actions." Critais' narrative therefore had to have been preserved while the Athenians still knew their history, and so before the war, if not the destruction, of Athens and Atlantis.
Critais' timeline seems to be;
Athens and Atlantis founded.
Many generations later Atlantis becomes corrupt and avarice.
Sais is either founded before the war, or before the destruction of Athens.
Athens and Atlantis go to war in c.9410 BC
Athens leads the war (and defeats Atlantis?)
Athens is flooded and Atlantis sinks beneath the sea.
Edited by Sidney - 13-Feb-2014 at 19:00