Kemal Ataturk

Hundred of thousands of Kurds have been assimilated already; around 3.000 villages have been wiped off the map, leaving almost 400.000 Kurds homeless. Not to mention the time you get in prison for saying your true nationality, and the treatment you get ...

I've barely touched the surface, my brother. When you take away their homes, rape their women and kill their men - even insignificant animals would take up arms and fight for their rights. Don't you think ?

I made this thread to understand why he was unpopular among regular muslims, not Kurds - that I already knew too well.

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi I respect your opinion, but Ataturk, with Kemalist secular governments and the military, constrained and weakened Islam greatly. 97% of the Turkish population are Muslim, whereof only 20% practicing. Why? Why Turkey has to stick to Islamic values? He abolished the religion-based establishments due to the regressive impact of an highly islamic tradition on the society. I myself find that choice pertinent.

Islam, this absurd theology of an immoral Bedouin, is a rotting corpse which poisons our lives. Mustafa Kemal Ataturk

Religion is a lifestyle, I don't understand how the same muslim who believe in Allah also praise Ataturk - doesn't make sence to me.

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi Set aside that Kemal replaced the Shariah law with the European legal codes. Set aside that Kemal replaced the Islamic calendar with the Gregorian calendar. Set aside that Kemal replaced the Arabic script with the Latin script. Set aside that Kemal closed all religious schools. Set aside that Kemal banned traditional clothing. Those actions were necessary in order to move forward… So why do you ardently stand up against the movements of a necessary enlightenment ?

These were a nessecity, the rest wasn't. I'm not against a movement of enlightment, I'm against how Ataturk implemented this "enlightment" of his.

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi But taking control over tens of thousands mosques, and replacing the current imams with “government friendly” imams led to the fact that mosques were to used to preach according to the Ataturk’s dictates and were also used to spread the Kemalist ideology. He, by no means, ruled over the local mosques. He just straightened them up for the well-being of the fresh state.

He prohibited Islamic traditions, practices and religious activites - that's more than "just straighten up". Islamic influence on social shperes were also prohipited.

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi I’m not totally sure but I think the Muslims suffering the most, besides Kurds and Armenians, were the Sufi Muslims who got their monasteries confiscated and rituals outlawed. Your above statement simply adds up to the prohibiton of freedom isn't factual at all.

Human rights reports show something else ... 

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi I’ve done some research regarding Ataturks reforms since I started this thread, as you may have known, and some of the reforms Kemal put into practice during his “westernization” were deeply disturbing. Ordering Muslims to use the Turkish word Tanri instead of Allah, and replace the name of the 5 time prayers and the call for prayers with Turkish names? What?! I understand calling Kurds “mountain Turks” (unlike sea and jungle Turks), but that fact that he DID put these reforms into practice in a country were the majority of the inhabitants are Muslims? Not the mention that he changed many mosques into museums. I must admit that your sheer hatred against Atatürk stands out prominently. He tried to remove/reduce the notable influence of religious values over the population to avoid irreversible revolts against the brand new system of himself.

But revolts were still made, by those capable of doing so. The rest were either too weakened or displaced to an desert place. Remember 1925, 1930 and the of aerial bombarments of civillians ?

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi Kemal was a military genius in every way, and he did as a matter of fact found the modern Turkish state – but not though peace, equality of freedom of speech like the European countries – but though suppression, massacres and massive human rights violations. Are you aware of the condition of the Ottoman Empire at that time? Do you think it is easy to reunite an entirely fragmented nation? It takes more than you think it does to forge many seperate partitions of a dissolved nation into a solid one once again. You have to go through the darkness (name it whatever you want) to reach up for the light. Atatürk called the shots to catch up on his task.

He built a house upon a totally destroyed basement. You got to clean up the basement first.  What you're doing is simply adding up the poor positives.

Originally posted by Hypocrisy Originally posted by Azadi As long as Turkish military and the state bureaucracy are infiltrated with Kemalist/secularists and act as the guardians of Ataturk’s reforms and work to preserve Kemalism and weaken Islam – Turkey will be a torn country. That's why we have a popular investigation called "Ergenekon". The state is currently purged off the unwanted bureaucrats who protect those reforms..

Until now not much has been done, one leaves - another one takes his place.

Btw, I don't want this thread to turn into Kurd vs turk chickfight like in many other forums. I asked a question, it got answered. Thanks.

A.

Hundred of thousands of Kurds have been assimilated already; around 3.000 villages have been wiped off the map, leaving almost 400.000 Kurds homeless. Not to mention the time you get in prison for saying your true nationality, and the treatment you get ...

I've barely touched the surface, my brother. When you take away their homes, rape their women and kill their men - even insignificant animals would take up arms and fight for their rights. Don't you think ?"

Dont make terorist propoganda here. This is the lies and propgandist sources used by pkk/kongre gel terroist organisation.

İm in turkey living here from my born. Peoples can talk which language they want. Look the streets , cafes other places you will see that. İ have kurd friends they talk too. lots of childrens dont know turkish but know kurdish before go to the schools in east anatolia. So how can kurdish be banned. İts a lie used by terroists.

Hundresds of thousand Turks assimilated by kurds. lots of cities populated by turks at the start of Turkis republic now mostly populated by kurdish ones.

İ will give an example from myself. my surname is balabanli. balabanli beloging to avşars who is one of oguz tribes. we comed anatolia with the other oğuz tribes, and go the bulgaria at 1550s. They turned back to anatolia at 1887-1888 Ottoman Russia war. (like most of Turks in bulgaria , macedoania). Some of balabanli go to the thrace, some of them east anatolia. ı come from who go to thrace. But now other ones who got other way they speak kurdish and know themselves kurd. they assimilated by kurds there. So we cant talk a assimilation of kurds. Because its not.

Abuot villages and homeles kurds. Who do it. İ clearly know it. Pkk teroristes. Pkk a terroist organnization who is poltical aim to seprate the Turkey and found a free kurdistan. 
How pkk founded? İts first offansive start on kurds. They killed most of the kurds to fear hem. They killed which kurds rezist and not support their organization. Whats their firs big attemp ? tehy killed 30 civilians ina a bus. They burn down the villages who dont support them. Killed, kidnapped childs and womans. ı can show lots of photogrph  who civilians killed by pkk teroristes.

The PKK is listed as a terrorist organization internationally by a number of states and organizations, including the United States,^[6] United Nations,^[12] NATO^[12] and the European Union.^[12][13] The organization is listed as one of the 12 active terrorist organizations in Turkey as of 2007 according to the Counter-Terrorism and Operations Department of the Turkish police.^[14] Turkey labeled the organization as an ethnic secessionist organization that uses terrorism and the threat of force against both civilian^[13][15] and military targets for the purpose of achieving its political goal.

Activities of the Kurdistan Workers Party by Region[38][39]
Target	Activity Category		Turkey	Northern Iraq	Western Europe
Government	Demonstrations/Protests[38]
	Riots[38]
	Kidnapping[38]
	Assassination[38]
	Sabotage[38]
	Chemical warfare[notes 1]
	Bombing Attacks[38]	Post/Train/Power
		Police
		Outposts
	Armed Attacks[38]	Military
		Police
		Village Guards
Civilian	Kidnapping[38]
	Assassination[38]
	Bombing Attacks	Villages
		Touristic Facilities[38]
		Commercial Units[38]
Organized Crime	Extortion[40]
	Drug Trafficking[41]		Transit	Transit	Destination
	Human Trafficking[41]		Origin	Origin

İn turkey kurds or other peopes have same rights. No differences between. we haved kurd president, prime ministers. Lots of parlimenter,s in our parlimnt today.

So dont believe this terorist propogande.

Biji Tirkiye!