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Boztorgay
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Topic: European Press shows solidarity with threatened Danish cartoonist Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 15:55 |
So what? Islam is a religion, a set of ideas and beliefs, that cand freely by analysed and taken with humor.
you call this bomb carton analyses or humor? err, look it again. |
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I see it stupid; i'm not fond of cartoon humor; too old maybe . . . but i say you that they have freedom to make what they want on their paper. You punish them by not buying not with the ukaz! True is, that in the light of historical facts that i recalled already, Mohamed fit pretty well in what describe the term "terrorist". To attack the vital caravan of your brothers (fellow tribesmen) and to kill them, only because they mocked you, that's terrorism: attack of civilians that never did you any harm.
Edited by Boztorgay
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Il n'y a que les imbciles et les huitres qui adhrent - Paul Valry
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Voyager
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:00 |
Originally posted by Mortaza
Am speaking with walls or what? I already said that a nation can not apologise for the actions of a newspaper. There is freedom of press in the West and interference of a government is not acceptable.
my friend, do you realy believe this?
You hypocrite. If you want to boycott Danmark, boycott everything, not just cheese.
Infact my country still dont boycott(Turkey) anything, but I dont understand why should they boycott benefits?
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Speaking with you is a waste of time. I suggest a boycott to Mortaza by other members of this Forum.
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Mortaza
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:03 |
Voyager that freedom of speach thing is realy absurd. Infact when westerns want, they can easily silence people(exp anti-jewish things, or banning armenian genocide discussion)
So this is giving taste of pumpkin.(Kabak tad vermek) a turkish proverb.
Dont need to play us.
And still I dont see why they should refuse benefits, Danish can revoke them, If they are so angry.
By the way, Dont boycot me!
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Boztorgay
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:09 |
Originally posted by Mortaza
Voyager that freedom of speach thing is realy absurd. Infact when westerns want, they can easily silence people(exp anti-jewish things, or banning armenian genocide discussion)So this is giving taste of pumpkin.(Kabak tad vermek) a turkish proverb.Dont need to play us.And still I dont see why they should refuse benefits, Danish can revoke them, If they are so angry.By the way, Dont boycot me! |
In a way, mortaza, you are right: there is a sort of fanaticism in west too, that is trying to mute anyone that want to speak about some sensitive subjects. I oppose this trend. But you should know that your right to deny bluntly holocaust, mean that if you have no valid arguments, you have to pay for that pure rasism or antisemitism. If no argument, that's what it remains . . . Having freedoms suppose having responsabilities too.
Edited by Boztorgay
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Il n'y a que les imbciles et les huitres qui adhrent - Paul Valry
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Mortaza
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:12 |
But you should know that your right to deny bluntly holocaust, mean that if you have no valid arguments, you have to pay for that pure rasism or antisemitism.
Antisemitism? I think painting a bomb over a prophet(who represent 1 billion people) is complately anti-something.
Or do you only know word "antisemitism"
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Voyager
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:14 |
"Moderate" Muslim leaders are already threatening the West with terror attacks because of the cartoons ( http://news.ft.com/cms/s/52cb6026-9418-11da-82ea-0000779e234 0.html). The blackmail is getting better and better. And the Turkish leader in the same article called for a limit of press freedom. And there are people who say that Turkey in the EU is going to be a bridge between the West and Islam. What a joke...
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Mortaza
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:18 |
And the Turkish leader in the same article called for a limit of press freedom. And there are people who say that Turkey in the EU is going to be a bridge between the West and Islam. What a joke...
Infact even atheist in Turkey think, this cartoons are attack to muslims. Infact most people are ready for boycott, but I think noone want to ignite fire.
If you mean, becoming a bridge, we should accept this insults, thank find a new bridge.
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arch.buff
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:20 |
Originally posted by Mortaza
You have no reason to punish no one.
No but they have no reason to attack my prophet too. We are even.
So what? Islam is a religion, a set of ideas and beliefs, that cand freely by analysed and taken with humor.
you call this bomb carton analyses or humor? err, look it again.
Ya? How? Acting like a saudi king or muburak?
Well not this way
I just want to know,what Arabs would do if they were being by the rest of the world attacked like Hellas before the Olympics!
Not likely, trust brits, russia and china.
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Is this what Muhammed taught?
Dont show peace, just get even
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Boztorgay
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:22 |
Originally posted by Mortaza
But you should know that your right to deny bluntly holocaust, mean that if you have no valid arguments, you have to pay for that pure rasism or antisemitism.
Antisemitism? I think painting a bomb over a prophet(who represent 1 billion people) is complately anti-something.
Or do you only know word "antisemitism"
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I'm trying to understand the devastation that this cartoons produced to your souls, but as atheist, is hard. You know: between the european nations and islamic nations there is a mentality gap of some hundreds years. Some stupid people, the kind I've spoken of above, tried to deny that, tried to say "no" with the hope that saying change the reality; they are too platonist in their mental setup . . . (people of english language or french, read anne-marie delcambre, islamologue, PhD in islamic justice system and historian! The christians some centuries ago, told to copernic and galileo: speak and write what you want, but don't attack our dogmas!" Unfortunately, some times, that's impossible.
I don't know what to say more . . . . I can only hope, or pray to my inexistent god, like the idealists, that this world still has a chance.
Edited by Boztorgay
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Il n'y a que les imbciles et les huitres qui adhrent - Paul Valry
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Voyager
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:24 |
Originally posted by arch.buff
Is this what Muhammed taught?
Dont show peace, just get even
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Forgive and forget is for Christians, not for Muslims.
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Mortaza
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:24 |
Is this what Muhammed taught?
Dont show peace, just get even
Uh what has this relation with islam?
You are talking like we are realy good muslims and only follow islam perfectly. We are following our anger.
Infact It is discussible If Islam permit so high boycot, after all alot innocent will suffer from this.
Edited by Mortaza
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Mortaza
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:27 |
I'm trying to understand the devastation that this cartoons produced to your souls, but as atheist, is hard. You know: between the european nations and islamic nations there is a mentality gap of some hundreds years. Some stupid people, the kind I've spoke of above, tried to deny that, tried to say "no" with the hope that saying change the reality; they are too platonist in their mental setup . . . (people of english language or french, read anne-marie delcambre, islamologue, PhD in islamic justice system and historian! The christians some centuries ago, told to copernic and galileo: speak and write what you want, but don't attack our dogmas!" Unfortunately, some times, that's impossible.
I don't know what to say more . . . . I can only hope, or pray to my inexistent god, like the idealists, that this world still has a chance.
As I said, even turkish atheists(at least theones I know) call this cartoons as insult. I agree mind of west and east is different.
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Boztorgay
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:30 |
Originally posted by Mortaza
I'm trying to understand the devastation that this cartoons produced to your souls, but as atheist, is hard. You know: between the european nations and islamic nations there is a mentality gap of some hundreds years. Some stupid people, the kind I've spoke of above, tried to deny that, tried to say "no" with the hope that saying change the reality; they are too platonist in their mental setup . . . (people of english language or french, read anne-marie delcambre, islamologue, PhD in islamic justice system and historian! The christians some centuries ago, told to copernic and galileo: speak and write what you want, but don't attack our dogmas!" Unfortunately, some times, that's impossible.
I don't know what to say more . . . . I can only hope, or pray to my inexistent god, like the idealists, that this world still has a chance.
As I said, even turkish atheists(at least theones I know) call this cartoons as insult. I agree mind of west and east is different. |
That's no wonder for one that knows european history: the laws of blasphmey were very recently abandoned, and in fact, in some "glorious" democracies of west, they survive in a form or another.
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Il n'y a que les imbciles et les huitres qui adhrent - Paul Valry
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Mortaza
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:34 |
That's no wonder for one that knows european history: the laws of blasphmey were very recently abandoned, and in fact, in some "glorious" democracies of west, they survive in a form or another.
Infact they are much worse books in Turkey which attack islam and muslims.(Even prophet himself)
Point is bomb, and stupity of cartoons.
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Boztorgay
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:36 |
Originally posted by Mortaza
That's no wonder for one that knows european history: the laws of blasphmey were very recently abandoned, and in fact, in some "glorious" democracies of west, they survive in a form or another.
Infact they are much worse books in Turkey which attack islam and muslims.(Even prophet himself)Point is bomb, and stupity of cartoons. |
As said already, hurting or not, from historical point of view, they (the cartooners) are protected with valid historical arguments; i listed just one, from a long list . . . i hope that for the sake of image of islam here, on the forum, you want me not to elaborate very much.
Edited by Boztorgay
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Il n'y a que les imbciles et les huitres qui adhrent - Paul Valry
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ulrich von hutten
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 16:59 |
Lord (admin) be mercy
give brain to the people !!!!!!
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Dream208
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 17:03 |
If the European had the freedom to draw insulting cominc, shouldn't the Muslims also had the freedom to burn flag/boycotting to insult back? You gain what you sow; if the muslim act is considered intolerent and childish... maybe it is the reaction toward European's intolerent and childish joke?
Sometimes I don't think "freedom" should be the supreme measurement of everything. Politic, or at least the foreign relationship part of it, was try to creat peace and mutual-cooperation between different states. If certain act would cause instability, hatred, and further conflict, it should be condemned regardless it was against "freedom of press" or not. Since it caused harm to other more important issues.
Edited by Dream208
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ulrich von hutten
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 17:06 |
or at least
only one brain cell
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ulrich von hutten
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 17:16 |
Originally posted by DayI
boycott is childish, also that disrespecting of
otherones religion is childish and unacceptable and not excusing of
that accusion is also childish.
Its get worser and worser for both sides, people need to talk. |
and with the ray of hope on the horizon
to multiply in a wondrous way
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Boztorgay
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Posted: 02-Feb-2006 at 17:25 |
If the European had the freedom to draw insulting cominc, shouldn't the Muslims also had the freedom to burn flag/boycotting to insult back? You gain what you sow; if the muslim act is considered intolerent and childish... maybe it is the reaction toward European's intolerent and childish joke? |
No one oppose the freedom of muslim to boicott or flagburning; that's even an old "tradition" in islamic countries . . . . is a stress diminishing activity of choice there.
Sometimes I don't think "freedom" should be the supreme measurement of everything. Politic, or at least the foreign relationship part of it, was try to creat peace and mutual-cooperation between different states. |
That's natural, brother, from p.r.c. perspective is totally right.
If certain act would cause instability, hatred, and further conflict, it should be condemned regardless it was against "freedom of press" or not. Since it caused harm to other more important issues. |
Well, i begin to unerstand why democracy and science were born in west and not in china . . . the chinese people simply love more the "stability" of opression and lies, than the instability of freedom and truth.
Edited by Boztorgay
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Il n'y a que les imbciles et les huitres qui adhrent - Paul Valry
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