Greece+Serbia vs Turkey

all Turkey has to do is unleash its superior air force and bomb all communication systems in Greece.... the rest is pretty much left to infantry and ground troops

look that up in CIA country factbook

vulkan02

I don't see what is so hard for you to understand????

I give you one gun and we are 50 against you with slingshots, who will win????
Of course the one with the advanced tehnology, YOU.

Look up European military budget!!!!!
CIA mentions NOTHING, only manpower, which is totally irrelevant.
If you can't provide a list of how many F-16's and the exact block type, ask!!!!  Some of us can present FACTS, if you don't know the number of Corsairs, again ASK, ships, air to air and air to ground missiles, tank types.....

As I said that is what was is all about.

sorry.. these numbers are from year 2000, and i don't have Serbia, but I don't think they'll make much difference

Greece vs Turkey

population(millions) 10 vs 66
military(thousands) 159 vs 609
reserve(thousands) 291 vs 378.7

2nd gen tanks 1021 vs 1329
old tanks 714 vs 2876

destroyers 4 vs 0
frigates 12 vs 22

modern fighters 156 vs 240
old fighters 287 vs 226

military spending($ billions) 5.89(2004) vs 12.155(2003)

turkey can sink greek with the pee of 70 million also turkish republics in asia can help it is funny to argue this we must think about US turkey war

Edited by esadbodur

Ok, I know that it's for amusement only, but the Greek plans to counter Turkish offensives in any island (populated ones, not rocks in the sea) are based on the following assumptions:

Assumption 1: We have lost aerial superiority. If Turks concentrate their aerial power only in one area, Greek airforce will withdraw and attack somewhere else (various options) to gain a bargaining card and  inflict maximum damage instead of engaging in fruitless dogfights. Islands are sufficiently supplied to defent for a few days by themselves, without any reinforcements from the mainland in troops or materials.

Assumption 2: inflict as many casualties at the beaches and then withdraw the army to the interior, cutting communications and destroying roads. After 5-6 days of fighting NATO and EU will interfere and the fight will stop. As long as there is some Greek army present in the island it cannot be considered as occupied.

Assumption 3. Impossible for Turks to penetrate from Thrace. Instead, Greek mechanized troops, with support from air, can rappidly advance in Eastern Thrace plains and gain ground. Turkish tank forces in the area are far inferior to Greek counterparts. Gained ground in Thrace can/will be used to bargain against a possible lost island and return to the pre-war borders.

Of course all these are on paper (and made public) and there're many things that can (usually will) not go as planned

What is certain, is that both people will suffer and the only ones who will benefit are the arms dealers

 

 

 

Edited by Yiannis

I think technology isnt the most important factor in winning a war. Humanity witnessed it lots of times throughout history.

In such a war, which would really be an example of historical amusement, it is sure that Turkey would succeed. Population is the most important factor to me, and Turkey has a massive young population ready for any war, especially with Greece, since Greece is recognized as an external threat for Turkey.

To invade Turkey is nearly impossible, like to invade Iran, since most of Anatolia is too mountainous, to reach central Anatolia and Eastern Anatolia is very hard, Turkish army is one of the most powerful and well equipped, and especially experienced armies all over the world, and military is compulsory in Turkey. Also our air forces are too powerful, but i cant say the same thing for our navy, since navy and sea wariorship have always been the weakest link in Turkic militaries.

 Turkey has a young, increasing population of 70 million, about 7 times of Greek population, which isnt that young and ready for a war. Also Turkish military has its war traditions and experience of thousands of years, even the words and degrees of military are the same with the system Maodun (Mete Han, a Turkic khan, who ruled Xiong Nu from 201 B.C. until 174 B.C.), Turkish military have been active with dealing with PKK and other stuff, and it is very effective on Turkey and Turkish citizens since it was another Turkic state tradition since ancient times.

About technology, military spending and amount of military stuff, Turkey is again adventageous. In EU, countries usually seperate the biggest amount of national incomes for welfare and health/ education etc., but in Turkey, this is for military. And Turkish army is really well equipped and always populated, ready with the compulsry military missions.

I dont even think I have to mention Serbia as a significant enemy, since they are celebrating the only important war that they won against Ottomans with the help of Russians every years as a national braveary day. And they try to prove themselves not being inferior by destroying old Ottoman bridges and castles. But I am sure that serbia would surrender after two Turkish troops arrive in Belgrad.

Finally, to mention the national unity in Turkey isnt necessary at all. I wonder what would be the reaction of the Turkish population against some Greek soldiers moving to Istanbul from the Greek border, who reacted as creating a patriots army of tens of thousands of Turks in the middle street of Trabzon (Trebizond), a city with a big minority populations, against some people trying to deliver PKK supporter papers, in a couple of minutes. And after a public anouncment of a war btw Turkey and Greece, repeating this clause: "the invader Greek forces ancestors killed your grandfathers and grandmothers", we can be sure that all Turks who can get any kind of knife or sharpened object to his hand would run to the battlefield to die as "shehit"s and go to Heaven...

Edited by Oguzoglu

How are Turkish tank forces in the area far inferior than Greece??... even if they don't have the newer tanks there , they can simply be driven there. Such air support would  only be available if somehow the Turkish airforce is miracously destroyed ...

Well, the Leo 2, Leo 1, Marders, BMP-1, Leonidas,the Apache and the artilery are far superior to anything Turkey has deployed on the other side of Evros river ready to attack.
Add the Hellinic SAM-barrier and Evros can't be penetrated by air either.
Add that, France and Hellas have agreed that Athens would be provided access with the Helios-2 satellite. So everything is "visible" (if you get what I mean)
If you add to the above, the fact that there is only 1 route towards Trace and then Thessaloniki, it makes the passage from Evros very difficult if not impossible.

I've heard all about our equipment, population..... NO ONE mentioned the Kurds (which are the major reason you have a high budget), Armenians and why not? Iran. What happens when you attack and have these guys bringing up hell behind you???

Someone said "my enemy's enemy is indeed my friend and ally"

Originally posted by Aeolus Originally posted by Phallanx Add that, France and Hellas have agreed that Athens would be provided access with the Helios-2 satellite. So everything is "visible" (if you get what I mean) So true!! i read about the Helios-2 satelite and looks like an important factor for Greek military. http://www.menewsline.com/stories/2005/may/05_10_4.html

And we have the satellite Turksat...

im not involving Armenia, Iran, Kurds or anyone else in this historical amusement forum. you keep bringing up other nations . this is just serbia+Grece vs Turkey