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Maps over Viking Age Scandinavia?

Printed From: History Community ~ All Empires
Category: Regional History or Period History
Forum Name: Medieval Europe
Forum Discription: The Middle Ages: AD 500-1500
URL: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4177
Printed Date: 28-Mar-2024 at 06:23
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.56a - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Maps over Viking Age Scandinavia?
Posted By: EvilNed
Subject: Maps over Viking Age Scandinavia?
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2005 at 14:56
Does anyone have any maps over Viking Age Scandinavia? 760 A.D and forward? If you do, please post them here. I could really use some!



Replies:
Posted By: mord
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2005 at 15:14

Modern maps?  Maps showing the Scandinavian Expansion?  Please specify. 

Thanks,

Mord.



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errr...left turn at vinland?


Posted By: EvilNed
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2005 at 17:04

Doesn't matter if they are made now, or back in the day. As long as they span over Scandinavia, around 700-1000 A.D. Scandinavia, not expansions



Posted By: mord
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2005 at 09:12

I have in front of me a "National Geographic" from May 2000 (Volume 197, No. 5, pages 12 and 13) that has a map of viking movements--that's what I have right now.  However, in a little bit I can probably do better. 

Unfortunately, I can not post any maps for reasons of copyright.  What are you trying to do with the map?

Mord.



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errr...left turn at vinland?


Posted By: EvilNed
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2005 at 16:08

I need the names of settlements, and vaguely where they're located. For example, I know that Birka is near (on a map) modern day stockholm, and that Uppsala existed back then.

Major viking settlements around Scandinavia, basicly. Also viking colonies in the baltics and finland would be great, if you can find them.



Posted By: EvilNed
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2005 at 16:14

Also, do you have any information about Novgorod in the 760's? I read that it wasn't founded until the 800's, but it is believed that another city was at the same place. This older city would basicly just be another ordinary city, and not as powerful as Novgorod grew to be, I'm guessing. Do you know?



Posted By: mord
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2005 at 16:42

In English (I don't read Swedish or Russian), probably the best books are "The Emergence of the Rus,"  "Viking Rus Studies on the Presence of Scandinavians in Eastern Europe" and "Varangian Problems."   You'll find useful information there. 

You're map idea is a good one, but try to get one in Swedish--really.  English translations of Swedish place-names can be inaccurate and messy.   Also, you might try the "Anthrological Index" (online).  A little hard to use, but once you get the hang of the index, there's a wealth of citations there.

As for the Swedish Presence in the East, watch out for the Normanist Controversy--an ongoing annoyance about who ruled what when.  Based upon criticism of the "Russian Primary Chronicle."  BTW, if your looking for archaeological stuff, try searching under the name "Kirpichnickov" or "Kirpicnickov": he seems to have done a lot. 

See you later, late in my day.

Mord.

PS. Do you read Swedish?



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errr...left turn at vinland?


Posted By: Styrbiorn
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2005 at 19:52
What kind of quality do you want? I have a few non-electronic maps, I could fix together a crude-looking one if only info is what you're after. If you want something to rest your eyes on though, I don't think I can help you.


Posted By: ShadowedRealm
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2005 at 02:30
http://medieval.shadowedrealm.com/maps/political.php?pg=2 - http://medieval.shadowedrealm.com/maps/political.php?pg=2

The first map of the page linked to above is a map that includes Canute's holdings in Scandinavia. Unfortunately, there are only a couple of cities (this particular map isn't very detailed), but I figured that something might be better than nothing.


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Posted By: Jorsalfar
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2005 at 07:26
I think that map has errors.Some town names are modern ones and the most eastern part of Norway was not Norwegian before 1177 or something like that.


Posted By: EvilNed
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2005 at 21:13

Thanks for the booktips, Mord! I'll be sure to look for them. I've actually encountered the eastern "conflict" before. Not only is there a question when and where the rus where, but also how they got there. In the russian chronicles it says that the rus were invited and yada-yada-yada (you probably know the whole story).

And yes, I read (and speak) swedish. The "swedish" vikings were the ones to write down the most runes!

Emperor, basicly I'm looking for a a few important settlement names (I know some, Birka, Trondheim etc. etc.) and also who ruled what around 800 A.D. So a very basic map would do, if you have the time. I'd be very grateful!

EDIT: Also, I'm wondering where the most powerful finnish tribes were located around 800-1000. The carelians and the finns, for the most part.



Posted By: mord
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2005 at 09:05
Originally posted by EvilNed

Thanks for the booktips, Mord! I'll be sure to look for them. I've actually encountered the eastern "conflict" before. Not only is there a question when and where the rus where, but also how they got there. In the russian chronicles it says that the rus were invited and yada-yada-yada (you probably know the whole story).

And yes, I read (and speak) swedish. The "swedish" vikings were the ones to write down the most runes!

Emperor, basicly I'm looking for a a few important settlement names (I know some, Birka, Trondheim etc. etc.) and also who ruled what around 800 A.D. So a very basic map would do, if you have the time. I'd be very grateful!

EDIT: Also, I'm wondering where the most powerful finnish tribes were located around 800-1000. The carelians and the finns, for the most part.

Hi ya

Ok, one of the settlements you might to look at is "Staraya Ladoga."  I looked for "ladoga" on the Anthropological Index (online--just use Google!). Here's some citations:

Kochkurkina.  "The burial-moung groups to the South East of lake Lagoda"  Kratkiye soobshcheniya o dokladakh i polevykh issledovaniyakh. (in Russian) (1969), pp 20-27.  With map.

Korzukhina. "A burial mound in the survey area Palkun near Ladoga"  IN THE SAME PERIODICAL AS ABOVE.  (in Russian) (1971) pp 59-64. Illustrated.

Nazarenko. "On the burial ritual in lake Ladoga burial mounds with hearths"  SAME PERIODICAL.  (in Russian) (1974) pp 39-45.

Losinski.  "Staraya Ladoga in the light of recent investigations"  Przeglad archelogiczny (in Polish, with English summary map) (1980) pp 225-238.

Ryabinin.  "The Stratigraphy, layout and chronology of the lower layer in the Staraya Ladoga earthen fortified settlement in the light of recent studies" Sovetskaya Arkheologiya (in Russian with English Summary) (1988) pp 72-88.

Also, try the words Kiev (loads of stuff) and Dnieper (also spelled "Dneper).  Some of the other settlement include Luistari (Finnland), Helgo,  and Sigtuna (though, this is very late in the Viking Age).  Try browsing the periodicals Fornannen  and Acta Archaeologica.

Btw, if you could send me some citations about the Viking Age in Northern Poland, I'd be very thankful.

Mord.



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errr...left turn at vinland?


Posted By: Styrbiorn
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2005 at 09:42
Staraya Ladoga was called Aldeigjuborg by the Scandinavians, you can surely find a lot under that name too. A Russian archaeologist recently found groupings of Scandinavian building s there, but the excavation was promptly made into a parking lot


May I ask what you want this map for?


Posted By: Dawn
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2005 at 11:22

Originally posted by Styrbiorn

Staraya Ladoga was called Aldeigjuborg by the Scandinavians, you can surely find a lot under that name too. A Russian archaeologist recently found groupings of Scandinavian building s there, but the excavation was promptly made into a parking lot


I thought there where very strict rules proventing that in scandinavian countries



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Posted By: mord
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2005 at 13:38
Originally posted by Dawn

Originally posted by Styrbiorn

Staraya Ladoga was called Aldeigjuborg by the Scandinavians, you can surely find a lot under that name too. A Russian archaeologist recently found groupings of Scandinavian building s there, but the excavation was promptly made into a parking lot


I thought there where very strict rules proventing that in scandinavian countries

There are very strict rules about archaeological discoverys in Scandinavia, but this was in Russia.

Mord.



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errr...left turn at vinland?


Posted By: Dawn
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2005 at 17:27
of course  I really must have been asleep this morning when I first read the post

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Posted By: Kynsi
Date Posted: 02-Jul-2005 at 10:43
Originally posted by EvilNed


EDIT: Also, I'm wondering where the most powerful finnish tribes were located around 800-1000. The carelians and the finns, for the most part.



There were three major tribes in Finland that time The Karelians, Jem or Tavastians and Sum

Karelians in the shores of Ladoga mainly the western shores Jem in some what in Tampere - lake Päijänne reagions and Sum living in the Turku and the South West costs of finland.

For more info you should read the excellent essay by wilpuri
http://www.allempires.com/empires/finland/finland.htm - here

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If you keep one eye on the past then you are blind in one eye, but if you
forget the past then you are blind in both eyes -old russian saying


Posted By: EvilNed
Date Posted: 05-Jul-2005 at 16:20

I found some information on the internet about the finnish tribes (as well as that article, thanks Kynsi). Right now, I'm checking out the Anthropological index (Thanks Mord). Takes some getting used to, tho.

When asking other people, I've encountered a question regarding the finnish tribes however... Did they use axes or swords? One person claims that they used axes, since swords were way to expensive for most regular tribesmen to use. The other person claims they used swords. Might be impossible to get a straight answer on that one, tho.

As for northen poland, I know that it was christinized during the viking age, I read something about it once. Alas, I forgot most about it (wasn't really paying attention). But I think I can find that information again!



Posted By: Kynsi
Date Posted: 05-Jul-2005 at 17:43
Originally posted by EvilNed


When asking other people, I've encountered a question regarding the finnish tribes however... Did they use axes or swords? One person claims that they used axes, since swords were way to expensive for most regular tribesmen to use. The other person claims they used swords. Might be impossible to get a straight answer on that one, tho.



In Finland swords have been found exported and domestic but axe would be more popular since it could be used as a tool also. Actually the most used weapon would probably be the spear. There is also a distictive feature in finnish and baltic armament the http://www.warussepat.fi/Evakipuukko.jpg - skarmasaks (väkipuukko in finnish)

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If you keep one eye on the past then you are blind in one eye, but if you
forget the past then you are blind in both eyes -old russian saying


Posted By: Hrodger
Date Posted: 16-Jul-2005 at 06:19
Originally posted by Styrbiorn

Staraya Ladoga was called Aldeigjuborg by the
Scandinavians, you can surely find a lot under that name too.

Editing this post since I was sleeping while reading it and didn't notice he mentioned Old Ladoga instead of Ladoga...

However...
Read more: http://www.vobam.se/Texter/bagrowneva.htm - http://www.vobam.se/Texter/bagrowneva.htm
Old Ladoga: http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staraya_Ladoga - http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staraya_Ladoga


Posted By: the_ancient_lunatic
Date Posted: 01-Aug-2005 at 01:09

Going back to maps:

There is a book called The Penguin Historical Atlas of the Vikings by John Haywood 1995

There are a lot of maps, travel routes, battle sites, sites of old settlements etc.

If you can't find it I can scan the maps for you in trade for information.

 

 



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...jag älskar mina svärd...



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