'Household Regiment'
Printed From: History Community ~ All Empires
Category: Regional History or Period History
Forum Name: Medieval Europe
Forum Discription: The Middle Ages: AD 500-1500
URL: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=17735
Printed Date: 28-Apr-2024 at 01:14
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.56a - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: 'Household Regiment'
Posted By: rider
Subject: 'Household Regiment'
Date Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 03:26
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Reading Lord Montgomery's 'Concise History' I faced a unit of the Byzantines, of which I had never heard before. It didn't give precise name but a later passage suggests that they might have been called 'the Household Regiment'. The unit description (without a direct reference to the name) was something like this. This unit was created by Belisarius. They made war on horses, were heavily armoured; every man had a bow, darts, lance and sword. Each had to be highly skilled in the use of each of the four weapons. It told me as well, that when they charged, they first had to shoot three arrows and then revert to the lance or take some more enemies out with the darts. Can anyone provide more information about this unit or perhaps pf their true name, if the 'Household Regiment' is false? Thanks, |
Replies:
Posted By: Tar Szerénd
Date Posted: 10-Feb-2007 at 03:41
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Hi!
Maybe they were the scholai, or the excubitas or the biglas.
(most of the byzantian heavy cav. were fighting and armoured like persian and avarian horsemen, so the using of the bow (perhaps the 3 avarian tipes)in heavy armour, together with the long and the short lance in battles is not surprising)
TSZ
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Posted By: rider
Date Posted: 11-Feb-2007 at 09:07
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I don't think so. The book clearly said that Belisarius created them and they were different from normal soldiers.
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Posted By: Tar Szerénd
Date Posted: 11-Feb-2007 at 12:20
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Hi!
Yes, different, in the 6. century. But after that time they became a common type. Until the 10-11. cent a lot of kataphraktes-like units used the bow and lances (mainly without shields).
TSZ
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Posted By: Hyarmendacil
Date Posted: 11-Feb-2007 at 13:32
| Why can't they be Belisarius's boukellarioi? After all, their weapon combination seems fairly typical for the better-trained Byzantine cavalry of the time. Maybe the difference lay in their organization or their place in the command structure rather than in their tactical role. |
Posted By: Praetor
Date Posted: 12-Feb-2007 at 04:12
Whatever they were they were not the Scholae as the reforms which
turned this and many other "bodyguard" units into crack proffesional
forces had not taken place at this time. In fact during the reign of
Justinian the Scholae was more a club for the wealthy sons of Senators
and the like, Justinian even once amused himself by putting the unit on
the active duty roster and observing the panic of its members Based on my very limited knowledge of the issue I would agree with Hyarmendacil that they were the his bucellari, Belisarius "household troops" these elite calvalrymen lived at thier comanders personal expense. They seem to meet all the criteria including the name. ------------- |
Posted By: Byzantine Emperor
Date Posted: 14-Feb-2007 at 00:40
I was going to ask if the author provided a name for the unit in transliterated Greek (the Greek name in the Roman alphabet). Is "Household Regiment" all that Montgomery gave?
This is along the lines of what I am thinking. But we have to remember the transparency of Byzantine terminology as time progressed, i.e. names do not often correspond with realistic functions. However, this is early enough, in Justinian's time, that I think the term might still correspond with the function. The Scholai and Boukellarioi are both plausible in this case. From Montgomery's description of their equipment, it seems that they were more suited for use on the field than for guard duty at the palace. the armament sounds very similar to Kataphraktoi, at first glance. I will check the sources that I know of for more details. ------------- http://www.allempires.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=12713 - Late Byzantine Military http://www.allempires.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=17337 - Ottoman perceptions of the Americas |
Posted By: rider
Date Posted: 14-Feb-2007 at 13:35
I will present the text from:
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Posted By: Tar Szerénd
Date Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 06:08
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Hi!
In the 460's and 480's some of the proto bulgars (mainly kutrigursand saraogurs(white-ogurs)) were settled down in Moesia by the greeks. Maybe they were those "huns". Or huns:-)
Or hun vasall akatirs.
TSZ
TSZ
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Posted By: Hyarmendacil
Date Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 13:53
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There! Personal training by Belisarius himself, and the reference to "Belisarius's own Household regiment" makes a very strong case for them being Belisarius's personal boukellarioi. I wish we had more information on the original rendition of the term translated as "cuirassier," though, since somehow I fancy a connection between it and clibanarii. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 14-Apr-2007 at 09:57
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I heard of Belisarius's 'Household' Regiment, from a book called 'Count Belisarius' by Robert Graves, explained them the same way as the book you listed. ------------- |
Posted By: Praetor
Date Posted: 16-Apr-2007 at 03:14
I would like to make the case for the bucellarii stronger by qouting
two references to them by Adrian Goldsworthy in the chapter on
Belisarius in his book "IN THE NAME OF ROME":
and again about the bucellarii:
As you can see they were a highly trained, elite calvalry unit owing allegiance to Belisarius as thier personal benefactor. The only thing that concerns me is that there is no reference to darts......but then again the unit only recieves a passing mention in my book, perhaps someone else posseses a more detailed source. Regards, Praetor. ------------- |