Israel army launches Gaza assault
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Topic: Israel army launches Gaza assault
Posted By: Jay.
Subject: Israel army launches Gaza assault
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 21:17
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The Israeli army has begun a ground offensive in southern Gaza to try to gain the release of an Israeli soldier by Palestinian militants.
Israeli aircraft earlier bombed bridges and a power plant in the Gaza Strip. Cpl Gilad Shalit was abducted by Palestinian militants during a raid on an Israeli post near Gaza on Sunday. Israel had warned of a massive military assault if he was not freed and its tanks have been massing along the border with Gaza for several days. It is unclear how many troops are being used in the incursion, launched from the Kerem Shalom crossing near southern Gaza. The assault on Gaza marks Israel's first major incursion into the territory since it withdrew its soldiers and settlers last year, ending almost 40 years of occupation. 'Limited operation' The Israeli forces are reported to have taken up positions near the town of Rafah, shortly after passing Gaza's disused international airport. The Associated Press news agency quotes Palestinian witnesses as saying the soldiers were moving under the cover of tank shells. Palestinian militants anticipating an Israeli assault have been erecting barricades and preparing hideouts and ambush positions. A spokeswoman for the Israeli armed forces said they had not encountered any resistance from the Palestinians. Israeli military officials have been quoted as saying Prime Minister Ehud Olmert had backed a "limited operation" targeting the "terrorist infrastructure". Militants' demands Hours before the ground assault, the Israeli jets attacked three bridges and a power plant in the Gaza Strip. The Israeli military confirmed that the first strike on the bridge was aimed at stopping Palestinian militants from moving Cpl Shalit. The strike on the plant plunged much of Gaza into darkness. It is not yet clear if there were any casualties. The soldier was captured when Palestinian militants burrowed under the Gaza border and attacked an Israeli army position, killing two soldiers. Israel has rejected the militants' demands for Palestinian women and children held in Israeli jails to be freed in exchange for information about the soldier. Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5123262.stm ------------- Samo Sloga Srbina Spasava Only Unity Can Save the Serb |
Replies:
Posted By: Illuminati
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 23:17
| Hamas and fatah were on the verge of recognizing Israel's to exist, which would help lead to a possible two-state solution. I'm curious to see fi this ends that progress or not. |
Posted By: Mila
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 23:19
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I think Israel should recognize Palestine's right to exist as well, you know... as part of the peace process.
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Posted By: Illuminati
Date Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 23:44
| Olmert has said he is in support of a two-state solution, I think that shows he recognizes that the Palestinians have a right to exist. Hamas are the ones who have refused to go forward into negotiating a two state solution, which I think si the only solution since neither side is ever going to give in and let the others have 100% control over the area. |
Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 03:52
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well Israelis don't want peace, peace to them means they would have to take off their illegal settlements, and means their access to fresh water will be less,
if Palestinians kept compromising their rights and their lands for the sake of peace , Israel will find ways to take more lands and insure more Illegal Israelis are planted in the future Palestinian state.
still we did not see what is the "Palestinian state that Olmert recognizes", their wall already ate huge parts of the west bank, the Jordan river is next i guess.
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Posted By: Ponce de Leon
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 11:09
| Good luck to both sides this will be an excellent world cup match! |
Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 12:45
Israel evacuated Gaza a year ago and for it's reward has had rocket attacks, bombings and now this recent incident.
It is Hamas that does not want peace. Peace would deny that august organization its justification to be. Hamas "refuses to recognize Israel's existence."
 Ah yes. The Palestinian fantasy dimension where Israel can be wished away, as that population lives off handouts from people who they would like to kill. The whole concept of a "Palestinian State" is a cruel joke perpetrated by Arab governments for decades to serve their own purposes.The IDF not having planned for this contingency seems most unlikely. As far as the Hamas leadership in Syria, I wonder if they watched "Munich."
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Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 13:27
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I think the sooner Israel comes to an end the better, it 'may' lead to a more harmonious middle-east. It is an illegal colony established by one superpower and kept in place by another.
There is no possibility of a two state 'solution'. It is an urban myth. I would like to see a coherent person draw out state boundaries for the two states.(agreeable to both sides). ------------- |
Posted By: cattus
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 13:52
| Agreeable to both sides.. have you read the charter of Hamas? |
Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 13:58
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Firstly, I am not talking about Hamas but the Palestenians. BTW, have u 'seen' the charter of the Israelis. ------------- |
Posted By: Kalevipoeg
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 14:03
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Just for the record, is this again one of those attacks where the
casualty costs will be: "7 children and 1 grown Palestinian male, perhaps a mean guy" ------------- There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible than a man in the depths of an ether binge... |
Posted By: cattus
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 14:33
lol ..tell us about the charter of the Israelis. |
Posted By: Illuminati
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 16:54
that doesn't matter. The Palestinians elected Hamas. Their charter is now one in the same. |
Posted By: Illuminati
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 16:58
but the situation seems to be getting mroe intense. Israelie jets jsut staged an incursion into Syrian Ari Space and were fired on by Syrian air defenses. Obviously, it's in reponse to the fact taht Syria has been a long-time supporter of Hamas
http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2006-06-28T202358Z_01_L28502390_RTRUKOC_0_US-MIDEAST-ISRAEL-SYRIA.xml&pageNumber=0&imageid=&cap=&sz=13&WTModLoc=NewsArt-C1-ArticlePage2 |
Posted By: flyingzone
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 18:07
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Hundreds of Palestian children and women are imprisoned by Israel and nobody talks about that. Now this Israeli SOLDIER, not a civilian, was captured and the whole world is paying attention to him.
I am not saying that I don't feel sorry for this soldier but Israel is involved in a military conflict with the Palestinians, so there will always be captives. It is a warlike situation there.
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Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 18:24
No!, my Dear Cattus, don't LOL and kindly tell us what you know of the Israeli charter. BTW, i know nothing of the Hamas charter, y, because it is a secondary issue and not the root cause of the problem. ------------- |
Posted By: Mila
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 18:39
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All I'm willing to do is to continue to support those working for peace. There is a group of retired Israeli women known as the Checkpoint Watchers; I watched a documentary about them not a week ago and one scene has stayed with me. At one checkpoint in the West Bank, away from the border, an Israeli woman is talking to the camera while they walk towards the Israeli soldiers. She's explaining that the army claims checkpoints within Palestinian territory are designed to stop the movement of militants within the region but she believes they're just designed to create hardship. When they get to the checkpoint, there's a woman with two small children locked up in a portable-toilet-sized "interrogation center" (cage). She asks them how long they've been there in Arabic and the mother's face just lights up. They translate "Two hours" but don't translate anything else, even though they keep talking for a few more sentences. The Israeli woman goes over to the soldiers and makes a fuss, why are they still being held, etc. The soldier lets them out, the Palestinian woman hugs the Israeli woman, takes her business-style "Checkpoint Watch" card, and then leaves. Then in a scene later in the documentary, it's a dark room and the Israeli woman is filming herself and she explains she just got a letter from the Palestinian woman and she translates a little bit, and then she says, "And I have to read you this part, she writes: There are more among the Jews than just Zionists and Settlers. I cannot support any retalliation against Israel's illegal cities knowing it could affect someone as you." That's the kind of people I choose to support. ------------- |
Posted By: flyingzone
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 18:49
I also saw a different documentary with a similar theme produced by a Montreal filmmaker. The title of that documentary is "The Other Zionists" and I think they talk about the same group of retired Israeli women.
http://www.theotherzionists.com/ - http://www.theotherzionists.com/
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Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 19:28
Sadly, they have neglegibile political weight in Israeli politics. The profane reality is in your face Zionism.
I was watching the news( Sky News) and it was said in the typical pro-israeli bias that the "Israeli airforce was bombing the bridges in case the hostage was sneaked out". I guess the Israelis bombed the power stations because they didnt want the hostage to be tortured by electricution. The water pumping station because they thought someone may fill up a bath in attempt to drown the soldier.
Sky News, in the extreme stupidity of its correspondent showed the millitary hardware massing outside Gazza waiting, in the form of some 40 bulldozers. The idiot could not tell the difference between a bulldozer and a millitary vehicle. It completely mocked the intelligence of the audience as to the intent and purpose of that amassment.
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Posted By: docyabut
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 23:40
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Israeli Defense Minister Amir Peretz told a brief news conference Wednesday he had approved new operations in northern Gaza to stop the firing of those rockets into Israel. Rockets burn in Rafah after an Israeli airstrike.
http://www.cnn.com/ - http://www.cnn.com/
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Posted By: docyabut
Date Posted: 28-Jun-2006 at 23:54
| There would have been a two state 'solution' long time ago when the UN offer the Palestinians a state, Israel took the offer , but the Palestinians did not. I am not saying what is wrong or right, however you` d think the people would be tried after all of the years of killing of their children, and would want to make a better life for them in the future by some solution of peace and living. |
Posted By: cattus
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 03:28
Just to make it clear,docyabut, it would probably be more accurate to say that Arabs turned down the offer. Palestinians as we call them today did not come about until the mid sixties.
Here, read it. As you will see, Hamas will only agree to the boundaries that you asked for until the Israelis get 0%. http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/mideast/hamas.htm - http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/mideast/hamas.htm |
Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 06:08
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Cattus Whcih part didnt you understand, it is of secondary importance, y, because palestenian land was forcefully colonized by Zionists, bringing in jewish settlers from all over the world for the settlement program. It is a very basic issue of land, misappropriation of Palestenian land. The palestenians although not in a position to halt or reverse this trend, have not really accepted it either. Y should they? I wouldnt mind peacefully coexisting with you, if you gave me half of your house and the use of your car. I am sure you wouldnt want me to have 0% of your assets, provisions or utilities. ------------- |
Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 08:07
The Arab states, some with vast oil wealth, have done nothing to found a Palestinian "state" or in fact to support the Palestinians. They have, for the most part, insured keeping the Palestinians in the condition they have been in in order to deflect their own populations from internal problems and from broken promises. It's ALL Israel's fault, don't you see? All the problems of the Middle East are the fault of someone else...Jews; America; Europe.
Very convenient, that. Why is it that Palestinians have had to be financed by welfare from Europe and (of all places) from Israel? Where is the wealth of the medieval Saudi-Wahabbi kingdom? All that Islamic charity? Oh, I forgot. Islamic charity goes for jihad these days.
What about non-Arab Palestinian supporters? What about all that oil revenue Iran is booking? Oh, how forgetful of me! That goes for Hezbollah, and for nuclear masturbation. None left for Palestinians.
What a load of crap.
It is no wonder that the conception in the West is of a malfunctioning set of Middle Eastern cultures, wallowing in violence, unable to accomodate modern ideas, unwilling to acknowledge the reality of Israel, and able to contribute only hatred and religious superstition to the world.
Too bad. I doubt that any change is possible, and the IDF will have to continue to kick ass when the interests of Israel are impacted.
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Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 08:07
yea before the mid sixties Palestinians were in mid russia.
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Posted By: cattus
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 12:34
The terminology 
Yep, I guess so. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5122822.stm - Hamas resists Israel recognition ..evidently there is simply no room for an Israeli state whatsoever. |
Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 12:47
Israel IS an accomplished fact with the ability to protect herself. There may no longer be any room for the Palestinians if that soldier is not returned. Their pretend state will never be more than scattered refugee camps, remaining unfunded by all their oil soaked "brothers."
According to Google, the 18 year old hitchhiker has been found dead.
And I think the heads of Hamas in Syria are now walking dead men. Mossad knows how to approach problems like them. I wish we were not as squeamish as we are about such things.
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Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 12:53
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As an additional thought, if Assad does not wake up and smell the coffee, there may be "regime change" in Syria as well as Iraq. One Israeli military operation at a time. There is no longer any Soviet regime to threaten intervention, and Syria has no friends. Syria has done nothing but undermine the Iraq operation anyway, and the Assad family has only survival as a policy, so they need something else to occupy their attention for as long as they last.
All this futility in trying to accomodate for the last 40 years has, and is failing. The Israelis may have decided that the only possibility for a resolution is an imperative to destroy Hamas. Hezbollah and the Teheran monkey men may be getting a message as well.
I don't see anyone buzzing Olmert's residence with sonic booms. Oh, and who is it who HAS the nukes?
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Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 17:54
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In another thread that was closed as redundant, one forumer asked why there was "collective punishment" of Palestinians in the destruction of power facilities, etc. in the current military action in Gaza.
Who voted for Hamas? If those people want to avoid the consequences of spitting in the face of forces far stronger than themselves, they need to have greater care in the political representatives they elect. Hamas, as so many other Arab "political" movements, has no backing other than the outraged editorials of leftist journalists. Their military weapon of choice is to convince people to kill themselves so that leadership can continue to live pampered existences far from the scenes of conflict. Pathetic, really.
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Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 20:19
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I hear the chicken hawks fluttering their wings again. If there is one thing that i have learned from the Spanish episode, starring the Moors, is that the process of colonization is reversible. I dont think that israel is going to last 800 yrs. EDIT:Disregarding the Arab impotence, it may be said that the powers that have kept the cronies in power in Arab lands are the very same forces that have kept this Mediterranean 'colony' in existence. Therefore one shouldn't expect them to voice concern for the Palestinian, unless they can draw political mileage from it. BT, Hamas is severely infiltrated by mossad agents. So the israelis are well aware of all the intrigues of Hamas and have the capability i would argue to shape thier own, if need be. ------------- |
Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 21:02
Er, what exactly did you say here?
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Posted By: cattus
Date Posted: 29-Jun-2006 at 23:26
Exactly, if these kids are harmed.. who will be blamed? 
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Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 01:51
its there hunderds of years before "mid sixties", that land is called Palestine and people living in it called Palestinians and that included the Jews and the Christians.
yea sure Israel has the "right" to protect it self and its people according to the West, and ignoring that SO DOES the Palestinians has the right to defend themselvs, clearly the Israelis dont give a damn about Palestinains security, the palestinians civilians deaths are double the Israelis/
and for your information Palestinians dont have a state and they are already living in a scattered refugee camps, so basically they dont have much to lose.
intersting how Israel take more lands into its control and inject Jewish sattelments in the West bank and Golan hights each time its "Protecting" it self.
not to mention them lying about the WMD they have.
the Crusades Occupied that land for more than 100 years and iam sure there were times they thought they will be there forever, Israel is there for 58 years, so still around 40 years for them to break the cursades record
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Posted By: cattus
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 03:49
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As I said, the Palestinians as we call or know today is a modern construct. This national identity did not exist before the state of Israel. A people called Palestinians have never controlled that region nor have ever had any collective ownership of that land. But ofcourse this does not change that there are people that have families that have lived in the area for centuries on both sides.
How does Israel, whether you dislike it or not, deal with Hamas which wants 100% of that land. Land that is not all theirs? |
Posted By: Leonidas
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 05:52
lets not infer that the isreali's have been equally living in that space with arabs for a equal amount of time, as far as i know before all off these modern 'contructs' there was only ever a marginal jewish presence and a very large arabic presence. Nor is the land been divided along those lines.
how do the palistinians deal with a country that wants the best bits for itself? |
Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 07:34
Palestinians are people who live in a land called Palestine. that land is known as Palestine for hundreds of centuries. how can this be a modern construct lol.
its like Egyptians are the people living in Egypt, modern or ancient they are Egyptians because they live in Egypt and they identify themselves as people from that land.
its not a matter of ethnicity,
even if you have a "theory" about who are Palestinians, i don't think that would in anyway support the current state of Israel, Hebrews who became Jews know that they were slaves in Egypt and they conquered Palestine and ruled in it for around 400 years and then became slaves again but in Babylonia, so the "control" factor is irrelevant and not a reason for anything that would support the current state of Israel which is not a Hebrew nation, its a Jewish nation speaks Hebrew.
they say their origin from their ( the truth they think God gave them this land), in the orgin thing they also believe that their father is Jacob whos father is Issac whos father is Abraham who was BORN IN IRAQ.
so both the origin and the God gave them that land factors are irrelevant because the origin isn't true as they know that Abraham was born in Iraq ,but try to make sound like its their origin to the west, the God gave them that land is also unacceptable to the secular modern west ( but really Israelis believes its their land because God said so not because they invaded it 3000 years ago and controlled it for the first 400 years)
to make it simple Palestinian for the Palestinians whatever their religion or ethnicity, Arabs, Hebrews, Muslims, Christians and Jews.
Turks who converted to judaism has no right to that land, people who left that land 1000s of years ago has no right to come and claim others land, if so then Irish Americans can go to ireland and take the lands of the people living their and say we were here before, the same goes with south Americans the same goes for many other nations.
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now about Hamas,
Hamas just had control over the government in a Democratic election approved by the UN, Hamas is willing to negotiate peace while the arrogant Israel and its allies refused on the bases that hamas is Terrorist organisation do not recognise Israel and wont drop their weapons.
well i see that they have full rights to do so, since Israel has been stealing their lands and controlling their lives for the past 50 years and Do no recognise any state called Palestine and bring its tanks and weapons into Palestinians land anytime they want, destroy schools, houses and refugee tanks " looking for terrorist", well if they are looking for terrorist they should look at a mirror.
and don't look at what hamas want as black and white, they know and saw how fatah for tens of years compromised their lands and rights and still did not get any state, at the contrary they lost land.
they have not much to lose really, STILL they are willing to negotiate and Israel is NOT.
again Israel don't want peace, peace to them means less land and less control which is not their goal, Gaza became tiny piece of land with high construction of Palestinians, the west bank "project" is not finished yet , they have more chances to steal and occupy more land so peace now is not what they are looking for.
they got a peace treaty with Egypt by giving back Sinai peninsula, Egypt is big and in the short run Israel wont be able to keep up with them, so to be secure from that side they made the treaty, Syria is smaller and weaker and the location of the Golan Heights is important since from it you can see all Israel, they don't and wont give the Golan Heights back even if that is the only way peace can be achieved with Syria.
so Peace is not an option Israel as a zionist government want , not yet still lots of land to take and people to exhaust and weapons to develop.  -------------
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Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 08:25
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Azimuth:
Your comment, above to mine, seems to validate my contention that all bad things in the Middle East are blamed on someone other than the peoples of the Middle East.
Your post immediately above seems also to do a hell of a lot of justifying on the part of terrorists. As far as Syria, screw them until they have a government with whom it is worth making peace.
All Arab outrage aside, Israel exists, is a strong power in the region, and you must deal with that. Neither Hamas nor any of the rest of those idiots are going to "push the Jews into the sea" or "wipe Israel off the face of the Earth."
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Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 08:56
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well "push the Jews into the sea" and wiping stuff are pure BS, Hamas isnt looking forward to do that nor Iran, they are against a Zionist regime not Jews as ethnicity.
if the Jews of Palestine wanted independence they could had it with an area they are majority in, which is tel aviv.
and how can Israel gained the "power ( including WMD)" without the West ( who are not people of the Middle east), so yea people out side the middle east are the one to take big part of the responsibility of whats happening in it. don't you think so?
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about Syria
Its part of their land occupied by Israel and they want it back, very simple and straight forward give them their land and they will have peace. easy.
Israel which is the most powerful and the one with the full support of the US, will act as the strong part and wont give the Golan heights back because simply from it Israel is exposed literally.
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Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 09:01
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As far as the absolute culpability of the West, no, frankly I do not think so. We will disagree on that point.
The Golan was the place from where Syria and their creatures shelled Israeli kibutzim (kinda like Gaza). Assad and his regime are unlikely to get it back - ever. When Syria has a responsible government like Jordan and Egypt, more likely, I think. No peace is possible with ASSad.
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Posted By: Dampier
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 13:33
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Frankly neither of these groups are very nice (as Britain found out when we ruled the place). I'm going to support the innocent civiloians and ignore the rest of these idiots. ------------- 
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Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 16:29
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The zionist 'colony' is the realization of the European dream of ridding it self of the Jews. The sooner this is accepted the better. THIS IS WHY WESTERN NATIONS WANT THE ACCEPTANCE OF ISRAELI STATE AT ALL COST AND WOULD BEND OVER BACKWARDS TO KEEP THE STATUS QUO, BECAUSE THE FAILURE OF THE ZIONISTS IS THEIR OWN FAILURE.
The Zionists never thought they were going to be as lucky as they got, reaching their goal so quickly. Initialy they had sought collective temporal refuge in which to amass the jewish diaspora, while continuing with their efforts towards the ultimate goal of creating a state in Palestine.
Towards this initial effort, lands were sought far and away, some of the proposed destinations were Uganda('the Uganda proposal'), Canada, Australia, Current day Iraq, Libya, Angola, Texas. this was done with the blessings of the respective overlords of the respective regions.
There was the "Madagascar Plan" to permanently settle all european jews to island of Madagascar, although the idea was seized upon by Himmler, it is said that the idea was concieved by French/Poles/British. The speculation ended with the Balfour Agreement. "Culpability" is an understatement. ------------- |
Posted By: Dampier
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 18:46
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Not entirely....if you remember Palestine was always a tricky area and to be fair all the Jews there were a pain in the ass. Its not actually anti semitism. -------------
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Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 20:15
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If it is not anti-Semitism, what is it?
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Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 20:19
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anti-Zionist
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Posted By: pikeshot1600
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 20:48
A smoke screen. Anti-Zionist = anti-Jew.
Those who hate Jews are anti-Semites just like Nazis or Imperial Russian pogromiki.
A resentment of a culture that has failed against a culture that has succeeded.
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Posted By: azimuth
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 21:34
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how anti-zionist = anti-jew ?
there are jews who are against zionist ideas. so are they jews who are anti jews?
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Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 21:48
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Halevi, who posted here for a while, is an example of a Jew who dislikes
the zionist ideals. In fact he said so himself in one of his posts.
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Posted By: docyabut
Date Posted: 30-Jun-2006 at 22:29
| So its really all about religion, not the fact that the people all came from the same stock. |
Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 01-Jul-2006 at 09:22
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Thoughtless comments. You obviously have got no idea what you are talking about. You dont even know who semites are and who aint.'Pro-zionism or zionists' allways try to equate "Anti-Zionist = anti-Jew" which is the real "smoke screen". Fact of the matter is that jews have been around for thousands of years and zionist are a recent invention, therefore jews/judaism does not equate to zionism. Moses was not a zionist but a Jew. King Soloman was not a zionist but a Jew. Jesus, Moses, Mohammed, Abraham were all semites. "Those who hate Jews are anti-Semites just like Nazis or Imperial Russian pogromiki."
Those who hate jews are jew-haters, not anti-semites. the semites are more than just jews, infact most semites are non-jews. It could be argued that anti-semitism is a defining feature of zionists.
Cultures evolve and co-exist, they dont fail or succeed.
Basic facts:
Not all Jews are zionists. Not all zionists are Jews. There are christian zionists too. ( although their agenda is different)
"What's the number one item on the agenda of the Christian Right? Abortion? School Prayer? No and No. Believe it or not, what's most important to a lot of conservative Christians is the Jewish State. Israel: Its size, its strength, and its survival. Why? " http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/60minutes/main524268.shtml - http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/60minutes/main524268.shtml http://www.theocracywatch.org/christian_zionism.htm - http://www.theocracywatch.org/christian_zionism.htm "As a Christian Zionist, I believe that Israel's withdrawal from Gaza--and U.S. support for it--defies God's will." http://www.beliefnet.com/story/172/story_17275_1.html - http://www.beliefnet.com/story/172/story_17275_1.html
more
http://www.beliefnet.com/story/151/story_15165_1.html - http://www.beliefnet.com/story/151/story_15165_1.html "The members of the Christian Coalition of America are some of the most passionate defenders of Israel in the United States. There's just one catch: they want to convert all Jews to Christianity. Matthew Engel reports on an unholy alliance" http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,820528,00.html - http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,820528,00.html Most Jews in palestine are not semites. Jews were in Palestine before the colonization by the zionists.
6000 jews were present in 1525 in the ottoman state more came in from the end of the spanish claiphates including the donmeh escaping purges in Iberia. Here is a list of immigrations since late 1800: http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Immigration/immigtoc.html - http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Immigration/immigtoc.html
I personally dont need a smoke screen, i am openly anti-zionist. ------------- |
Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 04-Jul-2006 at 06:42
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"Hamas, which advocates Israel's destruction, does not want to lose face by freeing Shalit without getting something in return. Israel says it does not want to set a precedent that could lead to more abductions. "
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/04072006/325/deadline-looms-israeli-hostage-gaza.html - http://uk.news.yahoo.com/04072006/325/deadline-looms-israeli-hostage-gaza.html
Looks like it is developed into a battle of wills. Hamas had asked the millitant to release him, previously. It might not happen now. ------------- |
Posted By: malizai_
Date Posted: 07-Jul-2006 at 13:06
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Here are some selective passages from an analysis of the issue by Jonathon cook. "Under questioning from presenter Jon Snow of Channel Four news on the reasons behind Israel's bombing of Gaza's only power station -- thereby cutting off electricity to more than half of the Strip's 1.3 million inhabitants for many months ahead, as well as threatening the water supply -- Zvi Ravner denied this action amounted to collective punishment of the civilian population.
Rather, he claimed, the electricity station had to be disabled to prevent the soldier's captors from having the light needed to smuggle him out of Gaza at night. It was left to a bemused Jon Snow to point out that smugglers usually prefer to do their work in the dark and that Israel's actions were more likely to assist his captors than disadvantage them."
"The Alice Through the Looking Glass quality of Israeli disinformation over the combined siege and invasion of Gaza -- and its widespread and credulous repetition by the Western media -- is successfully distracting attention from Israel's real goals in this one-sided war of attrition."
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As Israel keeps all eyes directed towards the suffering in Gaza, it is starting to make significant moves in the West Bank and Jerusalem. It is preparing for the much-delayed evacuation of a handful of illegal West Bank hilltop settlements -- known in Israel as "outposts" -- demanded as the first stage of the implementation of the almost-forgotten US-sponsored peace process called the Road Map. "These outposts are tiny, often just a few caravans. It will be much to Israel's advantage if the world fails to examine too closely the miserly act of evacuating these places, which doubtless will later be presented both as Israel having made a huge sacrifice for peace and as having satisfied its side of the Road Map's conditions." "In yet another dose of Alice in Wonderland, Israel's policy of making hostages of these MPs was referred to as "arrests" by the Western media. Few bothered to report that the MPs are being deprived of even their most basic rights, such as meeting with their lawyers.
As the four Jerusalem MPs' lawyers have argued, it is a nonsense that Israel allowed these Hamas politicians to stand in the recent elections and now, after their victory, it calls their membership of the party "support for terrorism". It is also a disturbing sign of how easily Israel will be able to begin ethnically cleansing East Jerusalem of its Palestinian inhabitants using the flimsiest of excuses." read the whole article here-->
http://www.jkcook.net/Articles2/0254.htm#Top - http://www.jkcook.net/Articles2/0254.htm#Top
Another great article on the media spin.
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