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Meanings of Colors in Central Asian Cultu
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Turkoglu View Drop Down
Pretorian
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Posts: 176 		  Quote Turkoglu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Meanings of Colors in Central Asian Cultu
    Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 11:40
In central asian culture colors determine the directions:

Black (Kara in Turkish) = North
White (Ak in Turkish) = West
Red (Kızıl in Turkish) = South
Blue (Mavi in Turkish) = East
Yellow (Sari in Turkish) = Centre

I'll give some examples, you're going to understand easly the relation between colors and directions.

Some geographical names:
Black sea (Karadeniz in Turkish)
Mediterannean Sea (Akdeniz in Turkish)
Red Sea (Kızıldeniz in Turkish)
Yellow River (Sari Nehir) a river in China
(deniz: sea) (river: nehir)

Old Turkic state & empire names:
White Huns (Ak Hunlar in Turkish)
Blue Turks (GokTurks, gok actually means sky, and the sky in blue)
Yellow Uighurs (Sari Uygurlar)
KaraHans (Karahanlilar)
Golden Horde (Altin Orda, altin means golden it's like an upgrade of yellow )
Akkoyuns (Ak Koyunlular)
Karakoyuns (kara koyunlular)

This is my small research
please correct me if ı'm wrong.


Edited by Turkoglu

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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 15:03

Originally posted by Turkoglu

In central asian culture colors determine the directions:

Black (Kara in Turkish) = North
White (Ak in Turkish) = West
Red (Kzl in Turkish) = South
Blue (Mavi in Turkish) = East
Yellow (Sari in Turkish) = Centre

this is not completely accurate, the colours don't correspond to compass-directions but simple directions, like left, right, front and rear, thats why the Mongol Blue Horde was int he west and white Horde was in the east, it's a matter of standpoint, not geography.



Some geographical names:
Black sea (Karadeniz in Turkish)
Mediterannean Sea (Akdeniz in Turkish)
Red Sea (Kzldeniz in Turkish)
Yellow River (Sari Nehir) a river in China

that's however just coincidence and has nothing to do with Steppe color code.
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Posts: 316 		  Quote Bashibozuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 11:52
No it isn't. "Kzldeniz" isn't related with Turkic colors for directions, but for example the Turkish flag is "red", as a direction of southwest, or simply west.
Garibim, namima Kerem diyorlar,
Asli'mi el almis, harem diyorlar.
Hastayim, derdime verem diyorlar,
Marasli Seyhoglu Satilmis'im ben.
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Posts: 1919 		  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 09:37
Originally posted by Temujin

Originally posted by Turkoglu

In central asian culture colors determine the directions:

Black (Kara in Turkish) = North
White (Ak in Turkish) = West
Red (Kzl in Turkish) = South
Blue (Mavi in Turkish) = East
Yellow (Sari in Turkish) = Centre

this is not completely accurate, the colours don't correspond to compass-directions but simple directions, like left, right, front and rear, thats why the Mongol Blue Horde was int he west and white Horde was in the east, it's a matter of standpoint, not geography.



Some geographical names:
Black sea (Karadeniz in Turkish)
Mediterannean Sea (Akdeniz in Turkish)
Red Sea (Kzldeniz in Turkish)
Yellow River (Sari Nehir) a river in China

that's however just coincidence and has nothing to do with Steppe color code.

 
That what I found weird to .
 
btw blue= mavi you could also say gk(rengi) sKy(color)
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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Posts: 521 		  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 12:16
Originally posted by Turkoglu

In central asian culture colors determine the directions:

Black (Kara in Turkish) = North
White (Ak in Turkish) = West
Red (Kızıl in Turkish) = South
Blue (Mavi in Turkish) = East
Yellow (Sari in Turkish) = Centre

I'll give some examples, you're going to understand easly the relation between colors and directions.

Some geographical names:
Black sea (Karadeniz in Turkish)
Mediterannean Sea (Akdeniz in Turkish)
Red Sea (Kızıldeniz in Turkish)
Yellow River (Sari Nehir) a river in China
(deniz: sea) (river: nehir)

Old Turkic state & empire names:
White Huns (Ak Hunlar in Turkish)
Blue Turks (GokTurks, gok actually means sky, and the sky in blue)
Yellow Uighurs (Sari Uygurlar)
KaraHans (Karahanlilar)
Golden Horde (Altin Orda, altin means golden it's like an upgrade of yellow )
Akkoyuns (Ak Koyunlular)
Karakoyuns (kara koyunlular)

This is my small research
please correct me if ı'm wrong.
I think this should be titled 'Meaning of Colors in Turk Culture'.  Anyway, some mistakes with the chart you made, white=south, red=west, and yellow, I never heard of yellow having a meaning like this so I don't know if that's right or not.  Turkey's flag is red because they're the most western Turk nation and East Turkistan's flag is blue because they're them ost eastern Turk nation.
For Turks, the homeland isn't Turkey, nor yet Turkistan. Their country is a vast, eternal land: Turan!
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 15:23
Black (Kara in Turkish)  Khara in Mongolian
White (Ak in Turkish) = Tsagaan/ Chagaan in Mongolian
Red (Kızıl in Turkish) = Ulan in Mongolian
Blue (Mavi in Turkish) = Kok in Mongolian
Yellow (Sari in Turkish) = Shar in Mongolian
 
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 16:01
Originally posted by Feramez

I think this should be titled 'Meaning of Colors in Turk Culture'.  Anyway, some mistakes with the chart you made, white=south, red=west, and yellow, I never heard of yellow having a meaning like this so I don't know if that's right or not.  Turkey's flag is red because they're the most western Turk nation and East Turkistan's flag is blue because they're them ost eastern Turk nation.
 
its not Turks colour, Iranian Nomads already used that, it predates the first mention of Turks for almost a millenia. and most Central Asian states from Ukriane over Kazachstan to Mongolia have (light) Blue flags because Blue is the sacred colour of the whole Steppe region.
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Posts: 1919 		  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2006 at 01:01
Blue is the color of the sky the ever blue sky Tengri. there old God
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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Posts: 735 		  Quote The Charioteer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2006 at 01:38

Thats interesting, because its almost identical to ancient Chinese use of colors for determination of directions, that is

central=yellow

east=blue

west=white

south=red

north=black

this tradition originated from ancient Chinese philosophy of "five elements"

(see:Correlations between the five elements and other categories )
 
also has relation with concept in ancient Chinese astronomy
(see:Mythology, four mythological animals)
 
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Posts: 1919 		  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-May-2006 at 05:16
yeah i red it in a feng shui book once
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2006 at 16:03
Originally posted by The Charioteer

Thats interesting, because its almost identical to ancient Chinese use of colors for determination of directions, that is

central=yellow

east=blue

west=white

south=red

north=black

this tradition originated from ancient Chinese philosophy of "five elements"

(see:Correlations between the five elements and other categories )
 
also has relation with concept in ancient Chinese astronomy
(see:Mythology, four mythological animals)
 
 
it IS identical, it is just unknown if this was a Chiense invention adopted by Steppe Nomads or vice versa...however it is still a mystery why the Blue Horde was West and the White Horde was in the East...
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Posts: 28 		  Quote MING-LOYALIST Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2006 at 22:13
Originally posted by Temujin

 
it IS identical, it is just unknown if this was a Chiense invention adopted by Steppe Nomads or vice versa...however it is still a mystery why the Blue Horde was West and the White Horde was in the East...
 
Could it be that it signified left and right rather then east, west.
 
Well since the ancient times the XiongNu and the Chinese viewed the world in opposite directions.
 
Chinese faced North while the XiongNu faced South.
 
Not to mention in XiongNu times instead of east and west they had left and right.
 
 
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Posts: 781 		  Quote barbar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2006 at 22:27
 
This colour designation was not necessarily adopted from one another. It could be a phenomenum parallely appreared. Due to the necessity for the usage of different coloured flags for the troups in different positions. Also the colours for the directions were not always fixed. AFAIK, Qara (black) was used for west, Sariq (yellow) for east in some Turkic tribes.  
 
In many Turkic langugages, Kok is used for blue instead of Mavi.  
 
Yellow river (Huang he) in China, was given this name, because the colour of the water is yellow, which flows through the Huangtugaopo (Yellow soil plateau).
 
  
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2006 at 15:37
Originally posted by MING-LOYALIST

 
Could it be that it signified left and right rather then east, west.
 
Well since the ancient times the XiongNu and the Chinese viewed the world in opposite directions.
 
Chinese faced North while the XiongNu faced South.
 
Not to mention in XiongNu times instead of east and west they had left and right.
 
 
 
I agree, this seems most logical.
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Posts: 735 		  Quote The Charioteer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2006 at 17:32
Originally posted by barbar

 
This colour designation was not necessarily adopted from one another. It could be a phenomenum parallely appreared. Due to the necessity for the usage of different coloured flags for the troups in different positions. Also the colours for the directions were not always fixed. AFAIK, Qara (black) was used for west, Sariq (yellow) for east in some Turkic tribes.  
 
In many Turkic langugages, Kok is used for blue instead of Mavi.  
 
Yellow river (Huang he) in China, was given this name, because the colour of the water is yellow, which flows through the Huangtugaopo (Yellow soil plateau).
 
  
 
This concept existed quite early in China, XiShuiPo site at PuYang city in HeNan province unearthed earliest Chinese astronomical map, by then they had already used dragon(Azure dragon) to represent east, while tiger(white tiger) to represent west. The site is dated to 6500 years ago. belong to late Yangshao period.
 
And there is archaeological evidence to exhibit subsequent inheritance of this ancient concept to the spring-autum period. As from the discovery of marquis Yi of Zeng state(a state which was ruled by Ji clan, which belong to Zhou household), on the coffin is a lacquered painting of astronomical map, with a format similar to the one found at XiShuiPo site, that is the Azure dragon to east, while the white tiger to west, its dated to 6th century B.C.


Edited by The Charioteer - 01-Jun-2006 at 18:22
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Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2006 at 17:40
I actually read this somwhere
 
 
In ancient times the Turkish people described the four parts of the world with four colors: the North - in black color; the South in red color; the West- in yellow (white) color. The East consisting of never ending fields and deserts was always described with green color.
 
Pay Attention:
"Hey Navoi do not worry of yellow, red and green, your gazels have grown into red, yellow, green".

Using the different colors of his gazel that is to say, using markings of the world's parts as South, West, East which go in par with each other in one gazel of Navoi I would like to challenge for "solidarity, unity of all nations".
      What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
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