Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Japan's island issues with its neighbors
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12
Author
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
lirelou View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel


Joined: 26-Mar-2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 528 		  Quote lirelou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Japan's island issues with its neighbors
    Posted: 06-Nov-2012 at 08:46
Nick
[/QUOTE]Ah yes, the same motive for Bush's illegal war with Iraq. As always, one side has oil or mineral reserves and the other side wants to take it[/QUOTE]

Hmmm, First, are there any proven oil or mineral reserves in these islands, or is it merely suspicion based upon geological surveys? Second, if Bush's war was about oil, what were the tangible benefits of that war for the United States?  Unlike these islands, Iraq was hardly uninhabited, and it does cover some strategically important terrain. To my way of thinking, from a military perspective these islands aren't worth much to China without Taiwan.
Phong trần mài một lưỡi gươm, Những loài giá áo túi cơm sá gì
Back to Top
heyamigos View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai


Joined: 31-Aug-2012
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 126 		  Quote heyamigos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2012 at 06:02
The Japanese are already beginning to see negative outcomes of this issue.  Their economy has entered into a recession and business in China has plummetted.  In their place will most likely be American, European South Korean, Taiwan/Hong Kong/other overseas Chinese investors.  The American car companies certainly are willing to take the place of the vacated Japanese.  Above all, Chinese themselves should start learning to make their own products/innovation.  They own Volvo.  Why not ask the brilliant people at Volvo to make mass-produced cars that is affordable and able to sell in a vast Chinese market?
 
Japanese shot themselves in the foot this time.  They should realize, from a moral standpoint, they lost WWII and caused must destruction in China.  Giving away a couple uninhabited islands is not asking for too much?  Now they have angered the Chinese consumer (not just the Chinese govt.) and forced the population there (some say Hong Kong and Taiwanese are planning to avoid/boycott Japanese goods too) to participate in the blockade of Japanese products.
 
Revenge through economics is just the first step.  Next depends on what the collective Chinese masses want.
Back to Top
lirelou View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel


Joined: 26-Mar-2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 528 		  Quote lirelou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Nov-2012 at 14:19
First of all, whatever damage the Japanese caused in China pales when compared to the damage that the Mao years did. Of course, unlike the Japanese War Machine, no one in the Chinese government of the time purposely set out to cause famines. Rather they ignored the growing signs and continued to report industrial figures their bosses wanted to hear, proving only that incompetence can be more deadly that intent. The Cultural Revolution, however, did have some intentions behind it, and is a murkier swamp whose disasters can only be laid at the feet of the Party in power. Fat chance of that, so Japan is the easier target. 
  
Second, the Japanese economy has been falling for quite some time. At the same time, GDP per capita has risen, primarily among an aging population. 

Finally, the Chinese have no legal argument to those islands other than: We're the biggest fish in this sea, so we take what we want.

Below is an excerpt from an article in The Economist:  

[Quote: Stunned as both Japanese producers and retailers are by the outbursts, there may be a sting in the tail for China. In contrast to 2005, the previous time anti-Japanese riots flared, China is not the only fast-growing, well-populated, low-cost market around. Back then, Japanese firms hedged their China risk with a “China-plus-one” strategy, implying that they would find an extra Asian supply hub, such as Thailand. Now, that has grown into a wider “China-plus” strategy, because their options these days have widened to include Indonesia, Myanmar, Vietnam, Cambodia, the Philippines and India.

As China’s wages rise and its economy slows, analysts say the risk that multinational supply chains may find alternative locations is something the government may want to think about the next time it lets vandals loose in the name of nationalism. Japanese businessfolk, meanwhile, might try harder to gag their clumsy nationalist politicians, who sparked the row over the islands in the first place.  /End quote]

http://www.economist.com/news/business/21564891-businesses-struggle-contain-fallout-diplomatic-crisis?zid=306&ah=1b164dbd43b0cb27ba0d4c3b12a5e227


Question for you heyamigos: "If the Japanese had won World War II, would they have been right from a morale standpoint? What does winning or losing have to do with the destruction and grief they caused? Is not the moral standpoint irrespective of success?
Phong trần mài một lưỡi gươm, Những loài giá áo túi cơm sá gì
Back to Top
heyamigos View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai


Joined: 31-Aug-2012
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 126 		  Quote heyamigos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Nov-2012 at 03:10
^They could not have totally beaten/conquered the Chinese, that is why they marched on to fight in other areas of Asia.  The Chinese were just too numerous and stubborn in their resistance.  Had they had the same training and weaponry as the Japanese, they would have been beaten back
Back to Top
lirelou View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel


Joined: 26-Mar-2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 528 		  Quote lirelou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Nov-2012 at 12:24
In re:  "^They could not have totally beaten/conquered the Chinese, that is why they marched on to fight in other areas of Asia.  The Chinese were just too numerous and stubborn in their resistance.  Had they had the same training and weaponry as the Japanese, they would have been beaten back"

As for Japan being incapable of totally beating the Chinese, I would submit that they had a far better chance of doing so than the Manchu horsemen did. And we all know that history.

As for the second part of that, I presume you mean that if the Chinese had had the same training and weaponry as the Japanese, then they (the Japanese) would have been beaten back.

Probably not. What the Chinese Nationalist Army lacked was leadership. Its quality across the board was not uniform. Too many deals had been cut to bring recalcitrant war lords and their armies into the fold. Chiang Kau-shek did not enjoy the same level of control that the Communists later did. Had the Japanese put all their effort into China, and ignored the Americans, they would have prevailed, possibly to lose at a later stage to the Communists 
Phong trần mài một lưỡi gươm, Những loài giá áo túi cơm sá gì
Back to Top
Centrix Vigilis View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor
Avatar

Joined: 18-Aug-2006
Location: The Llano
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7392 		  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2013 at 10:58
update: China to Survey Disputed Marine Territories for Natural Resources
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

Back to Top
lirelou View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel


Joined: 26-Mar-2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 528 		  Quote lirelou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2013 at 18:53
Regarding Japan's claim, I did see a statement from their consulate in the U.S. stating that prior to the Sino-Japanese war, Japan had claimed the islands based upon the fact that they were uninhabited, i.e., Terra nullis (?). 
Phong trần mài một lưỡi gươm, Những loài giá áo túi cơm sá gì
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.125 seconds.