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DukeC
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Topic: Iran daily holds contest for Holocaust cartoons Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 12:15 |
Originally posted by Seko
Originally posted by DukeC
It shows. |
Though Mila had nothing to do with my most interesting post that you seem to appreciate, I will let her enjoy my limelight for the time being.
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Oops...
My comment still stands, good post Seko.
Edited by DukeC
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Seko
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 12:18 |
Thanks! Heck now lets call back Mila and we could all have a party.
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Jay.
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 12:20 |
So bored of these comic cartoons or whatever threads.
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Samo Sloga Srbina Spasava
Only Unity Can Save the Serb
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TheDiplomat
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 12:40 |
Originally posted by Jay.
So bored of these comic cartoons or whatever threads. |
Same here.
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ARDA:The best Turkish diplomat ever!
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lennel
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 14:55 |
Originally posted by Mila
I'll be very upset if this creates a Europe where both can be published freely from now on.
For me, the perfect outcome would be this:
The courts intervene and decide that the cartoons were needless offensive and fall into the category of those public expressions banned by hate speech laws.
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wouldn't this basically close the door on religious satire altogether?
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lennel
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 15:00 |
Originally posted by Jay.
So bored of these comic cartoons or whatever threads. |
They are a bit tedious at times, but i'm still very much interested. I think alot of this will set policy and precedent for the EU, and really test it.
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Lmprs
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 15:14 |
Originally posted by Jay.
So bored of these comic cartoons or whatever threads. |
Absolutely. Are there no other problems in this planet?
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Zagros
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 16:28 |
Originally posted by Styrbiorn
Originally posted by Zagros
The Muslims were right to protest but not int eh way they did, it was disgraceful.
I have to throw this in (originally posted by Aydin in another thread), the Russian MP, int he following article, makes a good point about the level and organisation of protests/P]
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/february2006/070206atta ckiran.htm
| Zhrininovsky is a clown that want to rebuild the USSR by force and let their 'soldiers wash their boots in the Indian Ocean'. I wouldn't give him any creds. |
Exactly, then he knows something about manipulation, psyops and imperialism.
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The Guardian
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 17:33 |
Originally posted by Maju
Originally posted by TheDiplomat
Both are unacceptable. |
NOOO!
Mocking religious figures is perfectly acceptable. You may not like but you can't say it is unnaceptable...
By doing that you only show that your religion is not ready to live side by side with others and needs a ghetto to survive.
Such affirmations only show the weakness of Islam. Obviously people will stay mocking and manipulating religious elements of Islam and any other religion... if you can't accept that, you can only do one thing: to repress the free people that do it, by either killing, jailing or whatever other repressive method. That obviously only shows how evil Islam is.
So if you don't want your religion to be evil, you better start ignoring the people that use their rights to express on how they feel about Islam.
Or you can kill them and become the new Hitler.
That's pecisely what is happening: the people who dare to toy with Islamic iconography/ideology is being exterminated or persecuted systematically. Islam is showing itself as a very intolerant sect of criminal tendencies.
This is not any question of respect or not respect... we could discuss that if there would not be people threatened and killed for these issues. But under threat, we can only discuss how to supress the terrorist agression against free-thinkers made in the name of Islam.
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Free thinkers huh?What about the very same newspapers not publishing the caricatures mocking christianity-isn't that very hippocrytical?
I mean how long can I walk around with a sign saying "Jesus is a truck headed for the god's whorehouse" anywhere in Europe?I'm guessing 5
This is not free thinking, this is literally disrespect against one's beliefs. If I were a muslim living in Denmark-I'd sew the press saying how much the drawing traumatised me and get them bankrupt.The drawing did not mock a religious figure-it showed Muhammed as a terrorist.Would you like to be drawn as a terrorist?Imagine thos people-whos religious leader(surprisingly one that has actually existed as a real actual person which makes it worse) drawn as a terrorist.
I still can't deny the jewish holocaust(not that it didn't happen or anything please don't get me wrong)-where is the freedom of speech?
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It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up.
&nb
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DayI
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 18:58 |
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Illuminati
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 19:28 |
Originally posted by The Guardian
Originally posted by Maju
Originally posted by TheDiplomat
Both are unacceptable. |
NOOO!
Mocking religious figures is perfectly acceptable. You may not like but you can't say it is unnaceptable...
By doing that you only show that your religion is not ready to live side by side with others and needs a ghetto to survive.
Such affirmations only show the weakness of Islam. Obviously people will stay mocking and manipulating religious elements of Islam and any other religion... if you can't accept that, you can only do one thing: to repress the free people that do it, by either killing, jailing or whatever other repressive method. That obviously only shows how evil Islam is.
So if you don't want your religion to be evil, you better start ignoring the people that use their rights to express on how they feel about Islam.
Or you can kill them and become the new Hitler.
That's pecisely what is happening: the people who dare to toy with Islamic iconography/ideology is being exterminated or persecuted systematically. Islam is showing itself as a very intolerant sect of criminal tendencies.
This is not any question of respect or not respect... we could discuss that if there would not be people threatened and killed for these issues. But under threat, we can only discuss how to supress the terrorist agression against free-thinkers made in the name of Islam.
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Free thinkers huh?What about the very same newspapers not publishing the caricatures mocking christianity-isn't that very hippocrytical?
I mean how long can I walk around with a sign saying "Jesus is a truck headed for the god's whorehouse" anywhere in Europe?I'm guessing 5
This is not free thinking, this is literally disrespect against one's beliefs. If I were a muslim living in Denmark-I'd sew the press saying how much the drawing traumatised me and get them bankrupt.The drawing did not mock a religious figure-it showed Muhammed as a terrorist.Would you like to be drawn as a terrorist?Imagine thos people-whos religious leader(surprisingly one that has actually existed as a real actual person which makes it worse) drawn as a terrorist.
I still can't deny the jewish holocaust(not that it didn't happen or anything please don't get me wrong)-where is the freedom of speech? |
I disagree. Criticizing a religion is acceptable under our laws. Religion is the controlling force for much of the world. Freedom of speech/expression exists to question authority. That's the most fundamental belief that America's founding fathers had. Authority has to be questioned, and kept in check so that it does not overstep it's bounds. Religion is no different. It is an authority, and thus it should be questioned. And if people do not like what it is doing, then it should be criticized. We live in a world of global communications, if someone can't accept that things like this are going to happen, then they need to go ship themselves off to some deserted island. If someone wants to live by thier religious morals and values, then they can, but they have no right to demand that other people adhere to the same morals. We live in the 21st century, not the 14th.
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TeldeIndus
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 22:23 |
Originally posted by Illuminati
I disagree. Criticizing a religion is acceptable under our laws. Religion is the controlling force for much of the world. Freedom of speech/expression exists to question authority. That's the most fundamental belief that America's founding fathers had. Authority has to be questioned, and kept in check so that it does not overstep it's bounds. Religion is no different. It is an authority, and thus it should be questioned. And if people do not like what it is doing, then it should be criticized.
We live in a world of global communications, if someone can't accept that things like this are going to happen, then they need to go ship themselves off to some deserted island. If someone wants to live by thier religious morals and values, then they can, but they have no right to demand that other people adhere to the same morals.
We live in the 21st century, not the 14th.
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There's been plenty of publications that have criticized Islam, the Prophets of Islam critically, and favourably. Here are some for you to read about, and noone has mentioned a whiff of these books to protest them.
- Of more critical studies perhaps the best are D. S. Margoliouth's Mohammed and the Rise of Islam (London, 1905)
- Tor Andrae, Mohammad, translated by T. Menzel as Mohammed, the Man and His Message (New York, 1936)
- F. Buhl and H. H. Schaeder, Das Leben M uhammeds (Heidelberg, 1955)
- Aloys Sprenger's Das Leben and die Lehre des Mohammed, 2nd ed., 3 vols. (Berlin, 1839), and Sir William Muir's Life o f Mohammad, ed. T. H. Weir (Edinburgh, 1923), are full-dress critical biographies of the Prophet
- An attempt at a more favorable evaluation of Muhammad has been made by W. Montgomery Watt in two volumes, Muhammad at Mecca (Oxford, 1953) and Muhammad at Medina (Oxford, 1956).
- Tor Andrae, Die Person Muhammeds in Lehre and Glauben seiner Gemeinde (Stockholm, 1918).
- "For some account of the curious development of the mythical Muhammad, the older book by S. W. Koelle, Mohammed and Mohammedanism (London, 1889)"
Edited by TeldeIndus
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We are not without accomplishment. We have managed to distribute poverty - Nguyen Co Thatch, Vietnamese foreign minister
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demon
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Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 23:39 |
I suppose Iranian cartoonists have great imaginations to illustrate human beings bleed-choking into something funny.
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Grrr..
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Voyager
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Posted: 11-Feb-2006 at 09:48 |
How can Iran sponsor a Holocaust Cartoon contest when their President claims it never happened?
Edited by Voyager
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Zagros
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Posted: 11-Feb-2006 at 09:54 |
Originally posted by DayI
Off topic: Do i see good or has Zagros lost his minds? He has azerbaycan flag!!! The country he hated so much
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I have nothing against FSR Azerbiajan, only some of its politicians and its fabrication of history.
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Zagros
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Posted: 11-Feb-2006 at 09:55 |
Originally posted by Voyager
How can Iran sponsor a Holocaust Cartoon contest when their President claims it never happened? |
Because they (IRI) are a bunch of ideologically bewildered loonatics.
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Behi
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Posted: 11-Feb-2006 at 18:33 |
Letter of President of Iranian Jewish Society to Ahmadi nejad about Holocaust: Parsi: http://www.iranjewish.com/News_F/news_29_03-holocust.htm
نامه رئيس انجمن كليميان تهران به
رئيس جمهور ايران در ارتباط با هولوكاست&n bsp; كشتار يهوديان بدست نازي هاي
هيتلري
حضور محترم جناب آقاي دكتر محمود احمدينژ 75;د رئيس
جمهور منتخب ملت ايران
با سلام و عرض ارادت خالصانه،
آن چه ما را بر آن داشته با همه مشغله و گرفتاري 07;اي شما در حل
مشكلات پيش روي ملت ايران، مصدع اوقات حضرتعالي شويم، مطلبي است كه هفتهها است
افكار مردم جهان و ملت ايران و از جمله جامعه كليميان را به خود مشغول داشته است.
برنامهس 75;زيها و تأكيدات روزانه صدا و سيماي جمهوري اسلامي و
بعضي ديگر از رسانهها 10; گروهي بر افسانه بودن كشتار يهوديان به دست رژيم نازيهاي
هيتلري هولوكاست و به چالش كشيدن يكي از بديهيتر 10;ن و غمانگيز 78;رين حوادث بشري در
قرن بيستم، موجب بُهت و حيرت جهانيان و دلهره و ترس جامعه كوچك يهودي ايران شده
است.
چگونه ممكن است فاجعه جنگ جهاني دوم و وقايع و اثرات آن را كه
موجب نابودي حدود پنجاه ميليون انسان در نقاط مختلف جهان شده و ميهن ما بيش از ساير
نقاط جهان از آثار و عواقب آن لطمه ديده است را از پشت شيشه كدر تعصبهاي روزمره
سياسي، عمدتاً ناشي از فرهنگ سكولار غربي بررسي نموده و جنايات فاشيسته 75;ي هيتلري
را توجيهپذ 10;ر جلوه داد.
چگونه ممكن است اصل اعلام شده در اساسنامه حزب و ارتش نازيها
را مبني بر پاكسازي اروپا از وجود يهوديان را به چالش و ترديد كشيد و تئوري
نژادپرست 1575;نه فاشيسته 75; را فراموش كرد، مگر نميتوان كتاب نبرد من نوشته آدولف
هيتلر و يا نطقهاي موجود گوبلز و هيملر را يك بار ديگر خواند ...؟
چگونه ممكن است اين همه شواهد زنده و انكارناپ 84;ير در كشتار و
نفي بلد يهوديان در اروپا و جنگ دوم جهاني را ناديده گرفت و سخنان چند نفر را با
مواضع كاملاً غيرديني ملاك قضاوت قرار داد ...؟ و حتي بر آن مطالبي غيرواقع افزود و
نتايج دلخواه...! را به گوش شنوندگان و خوانندگا 06; سادهدل رساند.
آقاي رئيس جمهور
ترديد نيست كه جنگ دوم جهاني موجب نابودي پنجاه ميليون نفر از
مردم جهان شده، اين كه شش ميليون و يا يك ميليون از اين پنجاه ميليون نفر يهودي
بودهاند چه اهميتي دارد...؟ آيا به نظر شما نفي كشتار يهوديان ما را به نديده
گرفتن حق و خون پنجاه ميليون انسان نزديك نميكند و ارزشهاي انقلاب اسلامي و
رهنمودها 1610; امام راحل و نظام فكري ديرپا و ارزشمند ايرانيان 48; فداي احساساتي زودگذر و
به شدت سياسي نميشود...؟
آقاي رئيس جمهور
هولوكاست نه تنها افسانه نيست بلكه چون زخمي چركين بر پيشاني
تمدن غرب همچنان باقي است، نگران باشيد كه سردمدارا 06; نئونازي در اروپا كه امروز
خانههاي سياهپوس 78;ان را به آتش ميكشند و محلههاي مسلمانن 88;ين را غارت ميكنند
فردا دامي وحشتناك چون هولوكاست را براي مسلمانان نگسترده باشند.
جناب آقاي دكتر احمدي نژاد
هولوكاست افسانه نيست همانطور كه نسلكشي صدام در حلبچه
افسانه نيست، همانطور كه كشتار مردم فلسطين و لبنان در صبرا و شتيلا به وسيله
آدمكشان شارون افسانه نيست و قتلعام مسلمانان در بالكان و آن چه امروز در
افغانستا 1606; و عراق و سودان ميگذرد افسانه نيست.
جناب آقاي رئيس جمهور
ترديدهاي فراوان وجود دارد كه در جريان هولوكاست 1670;ند نفر از
يهوديان بيگناه جان باختهان 83;...؟ ولي اين ترديدها فقط در تعداد است و نه در اصل
واقعه هولوكاست.
ديگر اين كه صحيح است كه صهيونيستR 07;ها از هولوكاست استفاده
ابزاري نموده و مظلومنم 75;يي كرده و ميكنند و در اين كه در مراحلي افراطيت 85;ين
باندهاي صهيونيست 10; در همدستي با فاشيزمه 75;ي هيتلري به هولوكاست دامن زدهاند
اسنادي وجود دارد.
ولي كشتار يهوديان، كوليها، لهستاني 07;ا، اسلاوهاي مسيحي و
مسلمان به وسيله ارتش نازيها و حتي به وسيله ارتش سرخ جاي كوچكتري 06; ترديدي ندارد.
ما از مظلوميت و خون همه كشتهشدگ 75;ن جنگ دوم جهاني دفاع
ميكنيم كه كشتار سازمان يافته يهوديان در اروپا هولوكاست جزيي كوچك از آن است.
جناب آقاي رئيس جمهور
ما نگران آنيـم كه ارزشهاي انقلاب شكوهمند اسلامـي ملت ايران
در برابر احساسات نژادپرست 75;نه و يا ميهنپر 87;تانه كاذب به سبك رضاخاني ...! در
توجيه كشتار يهوديان اروپا به دست فاشيسته 75; كمرنگ شود و دفاع از حقوق مستضعفان و
استقلال و آزادي كه شعار دشمنشكن امام راحل بوده است به يك معارضه ناحق بيحاصل
مذهبي و نژادي مبدل گردد.
مگر ميتوان يك بحث كارشناسا 06;ه تحقيقاتي در مورد مسائل اجتماعي
را يك سويه و بدون شنيدن نظرات مقابل مورد بررسي و استناد قرار داد و نتيجه آن را
قبلاً اعلام نمود و آن را به گوش همگان رساند...؟
واقعاً حيف است كه فضاي روحاني جلسات جوانان صديق و شرافتمند
حزبالهي به ميدان گفتگويي تبديل شود كه بخواهيم در آن ثابت كنيم تعداد قربانيان
هولوكاست شش ميليون نفر بوده يا به قولي ديگر يك ميليون نفر و ذهن جوانان را به
بخشي از ميراث بيارزش تمدن غرب يعني خشونتها 10; نژادي و مذهبي آلوده سازيم.
آقاي رئيسجمه 08;ر تشكيل سمينارها 10; متعدد در نفي وجود هولوكاست
با اعلام نتايج قبلي آن هيچ دستآورد 10; براي ملت ايران و يا مسلمانان جهان و مردم
فلسطين نخواهد داشت و فقط عقدههاي نژادپرست 75;ن را تسكين ميدهد.
اين نامه را از سر صدق و صفا و دردمندان 07; براي شما نوشتم، شايد
شما خود بتوانيد به هجوم بيسابقه تبليغاتي در رسانهها 10; عمومي درباره نفي
هولوكاست پايان دهيد و به گوش جهانيان برسانيد كه تمدن ايراني اسلامي هرگز پذيراي
افكار نژادپرست 75;نه و نسلكشي به هر دستآويز و بهانهاي نبوده است.
با آرزوي سلامت و سعادت و سربلندي براي رهبر معظم انقلاب،
حضرتعالي و ملت شريف ايران.
با تقديم احترام - ارادتمند
هارون يشايايي
رئيس انجمن كليميان تهران
6 بهمن 84
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Alborz
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Posted: 11-Feb-2006 at 18:42 |
nice...
Edited by Alborz
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" Who so shall worship Ahura Mazda, divine blessing will be upon him, both while living and when dead" Darius The Great
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Zagros
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Quote Reply
Posted: 11-Feb-2006 at 19:50 |
That's actually very good.
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Guests
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Quote Reply
Posted: 22-Mar-2006 at 11:52 |
why danish newspaper didnt press Holocaust cartoon?
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