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Top 5 Greatest British Leaders
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Posts: 2537 		  Quote Mosquito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Top 5 Greatest British Leaders
    Posted: 14-Feb-2006 at 17:19

1. Oliver Cromwell

2. William Gladstone

3. Winston Churchill

4. Benjamin Disraeli

5.William Pitt, the Younger
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How can you not put Victoria on the list? No-one is even mentioning her!
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Posts: 5711 		  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Feb-2006 at 20:48

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim

How can you not put Victoria on the list? No-one is even mentioning her!

Though she presided over the peak of British power, I am not sure anyone can attribute the greatness to her personally. Often she was more of a stable and respectable figurehead while it was her Prime Ministers who decided Imperial policy.

I've always found it interesting that the British Empire began under a woman, peaked under a woman and ended under yet another woman.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Feb-2006 at 23:00

Nobody mentioned

Lawrence Dellaggio
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Posts: 952 		  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Feb-2006 at 09:14
Originally posted by Steve

Nobody mentioned

Lawrence Dellaggio

You mean Martin Johnson......
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Posts: 105 		  Quote Cunctator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Feb-2006 at 22:21

Pitt the Elder (built the empire)

Churchill (model of moral courage)

Elizabeth I (should be called "the Great" -- if we can include strictly English monarchs in this list)

Henry VIII (he set England on its path of development)

Thatcher (restored the "great" to Britain)
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Posts: 0 		  Quote bobjr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2008 at 05:44
No particular order:

-Winston Churchill
-Alfred the Great
-Cecil Rhodes
-Queen Elizabeth I

Honorable Mention:
-Benjamin Disraeli
-Charles II



Edited by bobjr - 09-Jun-2008 at 05:46
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2008 at 07:00
Well tecnically you can't add anyone from before 1707 and after 1801 since Britain only came into being in the former and was abolished in the latter to be replaced by the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland.
 
And using British as a synonym for English is bound to get howls of protest from welshmen, Scots and Irish (of the 6 counties type). I remember a few years ago in uni I went to a football match of England (i think it was at Anfield v some south American country) with a friend; an uber patriotic ulsterman, and when they started playing "God save the Queen" the guy started yelling out loud "that thoh UK anthum ya baastards".
 
Or thats what I think he said, always struggled to understand him.
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Posts: 591 		  Quote Peteratwar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2008 at 08:16
Originally posted by poirot

My Top Five:

My least favorite Briton: Winston Churchill

 
Out of interest why ?
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Posts: 171 		  Quote Chookie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2008 at 19:49
Originally posted by Sparten

And using British as a synonym for English is bound to get howls of protest from welshmen, Scots......


Seconded, thirded and fourthed...... This is the type of  thing which really upsets us. It's a good bit more insulting than  calling a Southerner  (US type) a Damnyankee.......

Originally posted by Sparten

and Irish (of the 6 counties type).


A large percentage  of the inhabitants of Ulster consider themselves to British before Irish.
For money you did what guns could not do.........
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 06:31
I take it that you also disapprove of playing the UK anthem at England football games. I think it was at some footballl tournament where one of the other home nations objected to England getting the UK anthem (and flag).
 
 
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Posts: 171 		  Quote Chookie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 19:09
Originally posted by Sparten

I take it that you also disapprove of playing the UK anthem at England football games. I think it was at some footballl tournament where one of the other home nations objected to England getting the UK anthem (and flag).


Not at all - I disapprove of the so-called UK anthem. As far as I am concerned the English can have it.

Why? Because of it's history. God save the King/Queen became popular in England during the last Jacobite rising when a Jacobite army of approximately 5,000 - 6,000  invaded England.

The last verse of GSTQ is a racist diatribe:-

Lord grant that Marshal Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
And like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush.
God save the Queen!
For money you did what guns could not do.........
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 19:34
Which is never sung iirc.
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Posts: 200 		  Quote Travis Congleton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 20:10
Just when I think American history [oh ho-hum 200+ years of it] is all messed up, I get to hear the Isle of the Brits' problems in history.
 
I love it.  Wink
 
Only have a top 4:
 
1. Winston Churchill
2. Elizabeth I
3. Victoria
4. Margaret Thatcher
 
 
I love some of the arguments as to why people shouldn't be considered either.  Its like George Washington shouldn't be considered because he was only President for the 13 colonies...   opps!  I mean, 13 states.
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Posts: 603 		  Quote DSMyers1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 20:13
My top 5, ignoring the English/British deal:
 
1. King Alfred the Great
2. Queen Elizabeth I
3. Winston Churchill
 
then a big gap and
 
4. Arthur Wellesley, Duke of Wellington
5. Henry VII
 
After that come:
William III
Henry V
Horatio Nelson
Robert Clive
John Churchill, Duke of Marlborough
William Pitt the Elder
Æthelstan
Henry I
Henry II
Oliver Cromwell
Edward III
Edward I Longshanks
Sir Francis Drake
Edward, the Black Prince
 
I guess I need to research all these PMs more.
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Posts: 171 		  Quote Chookie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 21:21
For someone who has stated that he will ignore the "English/British deal" you managed to pick one Dutchman (William III) one Anglo-Saxon monarch who died centuries before England existed as a nation (Alfred the Great b. 849 died .899). The rest, other than Longshanks and Elizabeth Tudor are a job lot of minor historical figures.
For money you did what guns could not do.........
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Posts: 603 		  Quote DSMyers1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 21:58
Originally posted by Chookie

For someone who has stated that he will ignore the "English/British deal" you managed to pick one Dutchman (William III) one Anglo-Saxon monarch who died centuries before England existed as a nation (Alfred the Great b. 849 died .899). The rest, other than Longshanks and Elizabeth Tudor are a job lot of minor historical figures.
 
I know William III was Dutch by birth, but I consider his reign in England instrumental in England's rise to dominance.  I have him listed here because of his qualities as a leader of the English.
 
Alfred the Great, king of the West Saxons, was acknowledged king over the Angles and Saxons (considered "England" at the time); the first to claim the title of "King of England" was Offa in 774; after him Egbert united England in 829.  After Athelstan, who united all of Britain under his crown (d. 939), the title of King of England was the primary title used.  I don't know what you consider England as a nation, but I think Alfred is close enough.
 
Those figures aren't minor; many are overlooked when evaluating leaders.  As discussed in my Top 100 Leaders thread, I look for leaders who change the course of their nation for better--changing the trajectory of the nation.
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Posts: 651 		  Quote Richard XIII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jun-2008 at 22:06
Queen Elisabeth I - the start
Queen Victoria - the pick
Winston Churchill - revival
Oliver Cromwell - wisdom
Sir Francis Drake - the spirit
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...the rest are details."

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Posts: 646 		  Quote Mughal e Azam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2008 at 05:12
1. James I - created the British Empire
2. Queen Victoria - ruled at the height of Empire
3. Benjamin Disreali - great/savvy Prime Minister
4. Winston Churchill - also great Prime Minister
5. Oliver Cromwell


Edited by Mughal e Azam - 16-Jun-2008 at 05:12
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Posts: 818 		  Quote Panther Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Jun-2008 at 06:44
My personal picks.
 
1.) Queen Elisabeth I (Her spy network gave her an extreme edge against her rivals.)
2.) Oliver Cromwell (The Lord Protector of the so called short lived Republic. It was a nice try!)
3.) William Pitt (The leading British statesmen of his times.) 
4.) Queen Victoria (I don't know why, but i've liked her ever since i married my wife. Hmmm..)
5.) Winston Churchill (Alot of english speaking politicans since... want to be like him, and always fall far short.)
 
 
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