Author |
Share Topic Topic Search Topic Options
|
Guests
Guest
|
Quote Reply
Topic: Why invincible Mongol Empire was defeated? Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 10:50 |
Main reason of the invincible Mongol Empire's defeat was the mongols are always fighting amongst themselves. And all mongol lords wanted to be a khan. Mongols envied our mongol's success and possessions.
Example:
1. Mongol clans before Genghis always fighted amongst themselves.
2. Amongst mongol clans.
3. Amongst Jochi and Chaghatai
4. Ogodei and his son Guyuk
5. Amongst Batu and Guyuk
6. Amongst Berke and House of Batu
7. Amongst Kublai and Arigh Boke and etc.
But Genghis was different, he united all stubborn mongols and nomads. Then defeated other empires.
|
|
Heraclius
Chieftain
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1231
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 16:03 |
No empire or army is invincable, both can merely go through a period of dominance over its enemies, neither the dominance nor empire last forever.
|
A tomb now suffices him for whom the world was not enough.
|
|
Serge L
Baron
Joined: 03-Aug-2004
Location: Italy
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 485
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 16:13 |
I think the diffusion and perfectioning of firearms reduced and eventualy eliminated the advantages of their war techniques
|
|
Drunt Ba'adur
Janissary
Joined: 18-Mar-2005
Location: Neutral Zone
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 04:06 |
Originally posted by Serge L
I think the diffusion and perfectioning of firearms
reduced and eventualy eliminated the advantages of their war techniques
|
The real mongol empire was defeated before the use of firearms by infantry
The Mongol Empire was never really defeated, but it began to decadence because some reasons. Here some of them:
-Mongols didn't have enough manpower to control all the Empire
-The descendants of Temujin fought among themselves(you just have to look Guyuk-Batu, AriqBoke-Kubilai, GoldenHorde-IlKhanate...
-Mongol Empire was several times divided in different Khanates (and the kuriltai was powerless after Kublai)
-Mongol war tactics were used by their enemies (you can see that in the Ain-Jalut battle)
-Mongol Empire by the time of Kublai(if you consider her dynasty being
the Mongol Empire) was no longer mongol. It was a new chinese dynasty
with mongol sovereigns and a mongol army(I'm not sure if the army was
almost all based in original mongol army, but I'm doubtful. Probably it
was heavly based in chinese infantry)
-The Empire is too big. You just can't control an empire from Caucasus to Korea
-...
Edited by Drunt Ba'adur
|
|
gok_toruk
Arch Duke
9 Oghuz
Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 10:01 |
I agree with Heraclius... just for a period of time, an empire's able to rule over enemies (or other nations). Our ancestors defeated because their time was up, due to the problems they faced above mentioned by Falco and Drant Ba'atur.
|
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
|
|
Maju
King
Joined: 14-Jul-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6565
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 15:34 |
Why invincible Mongol Empire was defeated? |
Obviously beause it wasn't invincible
|
NO GOD, NO MASTER!
|
|
Omar al Hashim
King
Suspended
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5697
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 21:25 |
The Mongol Empire, broke up
because of infighting after Genghis Khans death. The various mongol
Khanates, were often never defeated but gradually blended into the
conqured populations. The last fragment of the mongol empire, the
Mughal Empire was overthrown in 1857 by the British.
|
|
Drunt Ba'adur
Janissary
Joined: 18-Mar-2005
Location: Neutral Zone
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 21:54 |
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim
The Mongol Empire, broke up
because of infighting after Genghis Khans death. The various mongol
Khanates, were often never defeated but gradually blended into the
conqured populations. The last fragment of the mongol empire, the
Mughal Empire was overthrown in 1857 by the British.
|
I think the last 'mongol heir'(and that would be very doubtful) died a
few time later. It was a sovereign of Bukhara or some city near there
and I think that we shouldn't consider Babur dynasty a heir of Mongol Empire
|
|
Omar al Hashim
King
Suspended
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5697
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 22:20 |
Originally posted by Drunt Ba'adur
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim
The Mongol Empire, broke up
because of infighting after Genghis Khans death. The various mongol
Khanates, were often never defeated but gradually blended into the
conqured populations. The last fragment of the mongol empire, the
Mughal Empire was overthrown in 1857 by the British.
|
I think the last 'mongol heir'(and that would be very doubtful) died a
few time later. It was a sovereign of Bukhara or some city near there
and I think that we shouldn't consider Babur dynasty a heir of Mongol Empire
|
When did the Russians get control of Central asia? Oh, wait, Bukhara
was a dependency until soviet times so your probably right.
Babur and his decendents always considered themselves Mongols, and at
the time of conquest Indians considered Babur to be a mongol. I just
put a big post on the thread about the maps about it.
|
|
BigL
General
Joined: 30-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 817
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 08-Feb-2006 at 19:49 |
Mongols lost due to climate vietnam syria and india all too hot for them
|
|
Omar al Hashim
King
Suspended
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5697
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 08-Feb-2006 at 21:07 |
After Timur captured Delhi he left because his troops didn't like the climate
|
|
Guests
Guest
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 09-Feb-2006 at 10:07 |
Originally posted by BigL
Mongols lost due to climate vietnam syria and india all too hot for them |
Sorry, the temperature in Mongolia, average range in winter -30C (-22F), in summer 27C (80F). Our capital is coldest capital in the world.
That's why mongol people didn't afraid of those climate.
|
|
Maju
King
Joined: 14-Jul-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6565
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 09-Feb-2006 at 10:45 |
But if you're used to dry cold, you may hate the humid hot of India.
|
NO GOD, NO MASTER!
|
|
BigL
General
Joined: 30-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 817
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 09-Feb-2006 at 16:51 |
It was the diseases in vietnam and burma which killed mongol men combined with the humidity which killed horses in places like india.Mongol horses dont like the humidity but love the dry areas
|
|
Esquire
Immortal Guard
Joined: 18-Jan-2006
Location: Canada
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 02:51 |
Originally posted by Heraclius
No empire or army is invincable, both can merely go through a period of dominance over its enemies, neither the dominance nor empire last forever. |
This first entry sums it up....everything else are just details. (In the second half of the 20th C & likely first half 21st C the United States was/is the "nvincable" empire....someone else will then take over. This is what History teaches.)
|
|
gok_toruk
Arch Duke
9 Oghuz
Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 08:17 |
Oh Maju, my English is not good; could you please tell me what all those funny smilies are?
Take care...
|
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
|
|
gok_toruk
Arch Duke
9 Oghuz
Joined: 28-Apr-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1831
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 10-Feb-2006 at 08:23 |
By the way, freedom of speech is respected anywhere in the world; but to its limits... you shouldn't offend people by your word.
Now, it's not only about Politics. It's also about my brother Falco...
|
Sajaja bramani totari ta, raitata raitata, radu ridu raitata, rota.
|
|
Heraclius
Chieftain
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1231
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 12-Feb-2006 at 07:16 |
Originally posted by Esquire
Originally posted by Heraclius
No empire or army is invincable, both can merely go through a period of dominance over its enemies, neither the dominance nor empire last forever. |
This first entry sums it up....everything else are just details. (In the second half of the 20th C & likely first half 21st C the United States was/is the "nvincable" empire....someone else will then take over. This is what History teaches.)
|
Exactly, sooner or later a new power will rise and America will decline, a new period of dominance will then be ushered in by an apparently *invincable* power. It goes in cycles and will remain that way for aslong as there are empires or global spheres of influence like what America has.
|
A tomb now suffices him for whom the world was not enough.
|
|
ArmenianSurvival
Chieftain
Joined: 11-Aug-2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1460
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 13-Feb-2006 at 03:14 |
Originally posted by BigL
It was the diseases in vietnam and burma which killed mongol men
combined with the humidity which killed horses in places like
india.Mongol horses dont like the humidity but love the dry areas |
Also their sinew bows didn't have the same power or accuracy in the more humid areas around the Indus.
|
Mass Murderers Agree: Gun Control Works!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Resistance
Քիչ ենք բայց Հայ ենք։
|
|
Mangudai
Consul
Joined: 09-Aug-2004
Location: Sweden
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 368
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 13-Feb-2006 at 13:12 |
Also, after decades of endless campaigns and fighting the mongol numbers must have dwindled. Battle-casualties and deaths from desease must have finished off a significant part of all the nomad warriors, and then the numbers of born children must have been affected dramaticly as the men were away for years and women were left alone
The effects of small nations embarking upon huge and costly campaigns can be illustrated by the Swedish campaigns in the 17th and 18th centuries, where a great deal of all adult males died and the population shrunk as a result of the otherwise often quite successful wars.
|
Nu guhk go mis leat meahcit, de lea mis dorvu dn eatnam alde
Ossfok i s kringest sturwekster sttliger. Summer v kulluma i riktit finer!
|
|