European Press shows solidarity with threatened Danish cartoonist

Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth hmmm then why you are re-acting? as far as i know your PM is making statments everyday about this issue. why dont you guys go on with your lives and leave us protest and do whatever we are doing  ? Hey, no! Why don't YOU guys go on with your lifes and leave us drawing cartoons and do whatever we are doing? We were fine till some bedouin jumped from nowhere to tell us how we should live and what can we publish in our media!

well dont expect us to sit down and watch. we ( many muslims) were offended and insulted and potryed as terrorists. so we have been insulted.

so we are protesting, supprized?

Denmak says they dont/cant do anything, SO you said all you have to say and had nothing else to add, DO YOU?

no you dont?  ok then Ignore us and leave us protest and boycott  until the issue gets cooler by itself by time.

dont know why the danish PM keep repeating himself each time, WE know and understood what he is saying. but not convinced and want to protest to show that we dont accept such insults.

we have the right to do so.

we are not convinced about what the danes ( and many other euorpeans) are saying

and they are not convinced of what we( many muslims and non-muslims) are saying.

so NO solution here so far. exactly like the palistinain/Israeli issue.

just ignore us till this cools down, that if you dont want to change what you call "freedom of expression"

iam just wondering why the Danish government these days are saying "There was no Burning of the Quran took place in Denmark" if that freedom of expression why you are saying it didnt happen?

if the Quran was burned and pissed on, what would the Danish Government say? nothing? because its freedom of expression? then if it didn't happen why denying it in away like " NO NO it didnt happen".

they are contradicting themselves here, exatly like that newpaper who said that "not all the pictures in the net were published, and the newspaper wont publish them" 

why not? isn't it freedom of speach?

 

Edited by azimuth

Oh...Danemark...vikings ,rolligans,free cartoons..
what a country!

Originally posted by DayI Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth hmmm then why you are re-acting? as far as i know your PM is making statments everyday about this issue. why dont you guys go on with your lives and leave us protest and do whatever we are doing  ? Hey, no! Why don't YOU guys go on with your lifes and leave us drawing cartoons and do whatever we are doing? We were fine till some bedouin jumped from nowhere to tell us how we should live and what can we publish in our media! Maju if you believe in freedom of express, just put one of these cartoons on youre sig or youre avatar, why not if you believe in or you support that danish cartoonist? Just put it and i will believe in what you are believing in.

I don't like the cartoons but I support the right to publish them.

I've been thinking in placing the Mohammed-bomber as avatar... but really I prefer to keep the salamander. The avatar and the signature represent me and I don't feel represented by those cartoons. I just defend the right to exist and be published without the authors, editors, etc. being threatened for it.

I don't have to agree with what you say to support your right to say it.

Originally posted by azimuth [QUOTE=Maju] [QUOTE=azimuth]   iam just wondering why the Danish government these days are saying "There was no Burning of the Quran took place in Denmark" if that freedom of expression why you are saying it didnt happen? if the Quran was burned and pissed on, what would the Danish Government say? nothing? because its freedom of expression? then if it didn't happen why denying it in away like " NO NO it didnt happen".

 

The Danish Government didn't say they can't brun the Quran, they are just trying to calm down the masses in Damaskus and Beirut.

The reason why the mobs went crazy was that people were recieving SMS's claiming that the Danes were burning the Quran on the streets in Copenhagen, so the only thing the Danish Government wanted to say that it is false that such thing has happened - It is simply a diplomatic maneuvre to avoid misinformation, which can (and already has)worsen the situation.

 

But you have a point about the fact that the entire case has shown that there are some major differences in the opinions about the freedom of speech etc. And at the moment it is difficult to find a solution when we really do not agree.

I think that both sides realize that but the major problem at the moment is in my eyes the fact that the conflict is being escalated by groups that can use the conflict to shake the governments in Libanon and Syria.

The burning of the embassies are probably more a result of domestic politics in Libanon and Syria than a result of the conflict...

Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth hmmm then why you are re-acting? as far as i know your PM is making statments everyday about this issue. why dont you guys go on with your lives and leave us protest and do whatever we are doing  ? Hey, no! Why don't YOU guys go on with your lifes and leave us drawing cartoons and do whatever we are doing? We were fine till some bedouin jumped from nowhere to tell us how we should live and what can we publish in our media! well dont expect us to sit down and watch. we ( many muslims) were offended and insulted and potryed as terrorists. so we have been insulted. so we are protesting, supprized? Denmak says they dont/cant do anything, SO you said all you have to say and had nothing else to add, DO YOU? no you dont?  ok then Ignore us and leave us protest and boycott  until the issue gets cooler by itself by time. dont know why the danish PM keep repeating himself each time, WE know and understood what he is saying. but not convinced and want to protest to show that we dont accept such insults. we have the right to do so. we are not convinced about what the danes ( and many other euorpeans) are saying and they are not convinced of what we( many muslims and non-muslims) are saying. so NO solution here so far. exactly like the palistinain/Israeli issue. just ignore us till this cools down, that if you dont want to change what you call "freedom of expression" iam just wondering why the Danish government these days are saying "There was no Burning of the Quran took place in Denmark" if that freedom of expression why you are saying it didnt happen? if the Quran was burned and pissed on, what would the Danish Government say? nothing? because its freedom of expression? then if it didn't happen why denying it in away like " NO NO it didnt happen". they are contradicting themselves here, exatly like that newpaper who said that "not all the pictures in the net were published, and the newspaper wont publish them"  why not? isn't it freedom of speach? Yes, we also have the right to burn teh Quran. It's like Rockefeller: he hired great Mexican muralist Diego Rivera to make a mural for his main industry. He made a total apology of Workers' Power (Rivera was Marxist) and Rockefeller, after paying fo his work, got it destroyed. So, of I pay for a copy of the Quran... I can burn it. You can feel outraged if you wish...

yes you can burn it but if you do that in public or taking pictures of it and show it to us, then teh big probs begins for you...

I think you dont get whats expression of freedom at all, burning is something else then making cartoons of it?

Edited by DayI

Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by DayI Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth hmmm then why you are re-acting? as far as i know your PM is making statments everyday about this issue. why dont you guys go on with your lives and leave us protest and do whatever we are doing  ? Hey, no! Why don't YOU guys go on with your lifes and leave us drawing cartoons and do whatever we are doing? We were fine till some bedouin jumped from nowhere to tell us how we should live and what can we publish in our media! Maju if you believe in freedom of express, just put one of these cartoons on youre sig or youre avatar, why not if you believe in or you support that danish cartoonist? Just put it and i will believe in what you are believing in. I don't like the cartoons but I support the right to publish them.

So muslims around the world didnt liked the cartoons and protested (not the burning issue, thats not protest thats an attack).

I've been thinking in placing the Mohammed-bomber as avatar... but really I prefer to keep the salamander. The avatar and the signature represent me and I don't feel represented by those cartoons. I just defend the right to exist and be published without the authors, editors, etc. being threatened for it.

I don't have to agree with what you say to support your right to say it.

So i dont also have to agree with what you say to support youre right to say it. Afterall it means freedom of expression

Originally posted by DayI [QUOTE=Moller][QUOTE=Moller][QUOTE=azimuth][QUOTE=Maju] [QUOTE=azimuth]   Btw are a you real danish or danish by freedom of speech?

I am Danish - Born here, living here and everything

Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth Originally posted by Maju Originally posted by azimuth hmmm then why you are re-acting? as far as i know your PM is making statments everyday about this issue. why dont you guys go on with your lives and leave us protest and do whatever we are doing  ? Hey, no! Why don't YOU guys go on with your lifes and leave us drawing cartoons and do whatever we are doing? We were fine till some bedouin jumped from nowhere to tell us how we should live and what can we publish in our media! well dont expect us to sit down and watch. we ( many muslims) were offended and insulted and potryed as terrorists. so we have been insulted. so we are protesting, supprized? Denmak says they dont/cant do anything, SO you said all you have to say and had nothing else to add, DO YOU? no you dont?  ok then Ignore us and leave us protest and boycott  until the issue gets cooler by itself by time. dont know why the danish PM keep repeating himself each time, WE know and understood what he is saying. but not convinced and want to protest to show that we dont accept such insults. we have the right to do so. we are not convinced about what the danes ( and many other euorpeans) are saying and they are not convinced of what we( many muslims and non-muslims) are saying. so NO solution here so far. exactly like the palistinain/Israeli issue. just ignore us till this cools down, that if you dont want to change what you call "freedom of expression" iam just wondering why the Danish government these days are saying "There was no Burning of the Quran took place in Denmark" if that freedom of expression why you are saying it didnt happen? if the Quran was burned and pissed on, what would the Danish Government say? nothing? because its freedom of expression? then if it didn't happen why denying it in away like " NO NO it didnt happen". they are contradicting themselves here, exatly like that newpaper who said that "not all the pictures in the net were published, and the newspaper wont publish them"  why not? isn't it freedom of speach? Yes, we also have the right to burn teh Quran. It's like Rockefeller: he hired great Mexican muralist Diego Rivera to make a mural for his main industry. He made a total apology of Workers' Power (Rivera was Marxist) and Rockefeller, after paying fo his work, got it destroyed. So, of I pay for a copy of the Quran... I can burn it. You can feel outraged if you wish...

 

sure i have no doubts about that, infact ive seen some sent to me, anyway

as you said you can brun it, also you can sh*t and piss on it too, your "freedom of speach support that"

and also we have the right to protest get outraged or whatever we feel,

the question is why would you care???

the same to the danish government, keep doing what you doing draw what you like burn/sh*t/piss on what you want.

why you care about what others think?

isn't that the point you are making? "we can do whatever we like as long as the rules allow it and we dont give a sh*t about whoever gets offended"

 

so Maju why you and the danes care? obviously you guys think that muslims are bunch of idiots who are retarded enough and making problems in the world all the time ! so why you give a sh*t what they think?

security? increase your security and you will prevent any harms .

 

 

the point iam making here is that you did what it is ok for you to do, we protested and got provoked.

you told us why you guys are insulted about? its ok to do that in here (denmark)

we say no we dont accept such insults, and dont expect us to just sit down and wach, We will protest and we are protesting.

 

now since you said what have to say and we said what we said,  NO changes happened to your rules, they why you guys keep talking about it???

confused or what?

 

keep beliving in what you beliving in and we will keep beliving in what we belive in.

 

after all its not like Muslims and Secularists were Best friends before this.

 

Originally posted by azimuth Originally posted by Cezar It seems that for the muslims the issue is: "We cannot tolerate such an offense". Ok, I'm cool with that. So can you tell us: What kind of offense will you tolerate? Or what you really mean is We cannot tolerate any offense! you are talking like its the first time Euro press offended muslims, nothing like this happened. also why you ask what muslims can/cannot tolerate? you are not going to make adjustments to your rules, would you? no? then why asking?

Why not asking? Is the question offensive?

How do you know if I can't make adjustments to my rules if you don't tell me what am I to adjust. I don't know, and reading the Quran doesn't make it clear to me. So I'm asking muslims. Since you seem to be muslim, why don't you tell me. What kind of offense can you tolerate?

Maju, you're doing a good job here. Sadly I can't keep up.

Why it is that people cannot distinguish between protesting and demonstrating non-violently, and threatening to kill or maim - or even killing and maiming - is totally beyond me.

Of course Muslims have every right to be offended and outraged if they're not adult enough just to ignore this kind of stuff. No-one I think objects to that whatsoever. Nor to their expressing it in any kind of legitimate manner.

But the only thing that justifies violence is defence against violence. Guerilla wars against occupying troops are perfectly justifiable. Killing people because they offended you isn't.

This at bottom is not really a freedom of speech issue. It's a violence is evil issue.

I pointed out before that the Muslim Council of Great Britain agrees with this position (though they believe the cartoons should not have been published). They have specifically asked that the police arrest and prosecute the people who carried banners in London calling for violence against the cartoonists and their publishers, and that they be treated as copmmon criminals.