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Can armenians reclaim eastern anatolia??

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  Quote cebeci Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Can armenians reclaim eastern anatolia??
    Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 14:15

it has been ample topics on whether the genocide took place or not... and everyone defends its nation

let's start form the end: assume that turkish government accepts the armenian genocide and gives a political apology

what consequences will it have?

do armenians have automatic right to reclaim the eastern anatolia as a compensation of that genocide

or will this debate cools down and genocide will be remembered just like holocaust is?

without clear-cut political and territorial advantages would armenians support this incident??

history is just a repetation of itself
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  Quote azimuth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 14:41

oh this belongs to intellectual discussion forum.

 



Edited by azimuth
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 15:19

I think there is more to this event than what we are led to believe... There should be an independent and impartial investigation into exactl what happened. But i am really sick of the West and its double standards.

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  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 15:22
Originally posted by Zagros

I think there is more to this event than what we are led to believe... There should be an independent and impartial investigation into exactl what happened. But i am really sick of the West and its double standards.

Zagros it is very easy to explain: "How would you eat a cake, In small pieces or all in one?"
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 15:26

Small pieces of course

I think the British should recognise their genocide of Kurds in the 20s when Winston Churchill savagely ordered the murder of thousands of Kurds by chemical gases.  Winston Churchill should be tarnished as the ruthlessblood thirsty villain he was... Gallipoli and the deaths of hundreds of thousands of allies and ottomans in a pointless operation was also his doing.

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  Quote Mila Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 15:28
It depends on Turkey's national laws, and if this
process is conducted outside of Turkey - on
international law.

But it is possible. Next month Bosnia and
Herzegovina's suit against Serbia and Montenegro
begins. The objective is to find Serbia and
Montenegro guilty of genocide and lesser inclusive
crimes and, when that happens, the Republika
Srpska of Bosnia and Herzegovina (The area
ethnically cleased of non-Serbs during the war) will
be abolished.

So it has to be possible.
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  Quote cebeci Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 15:38

do you mean that internataional treaties, NATO and UN being the first, will force turkey to reopen its east to armenians and in the future (NOT REMOTE I THINK) allow armenia to expand to near kayseri??

is there any prior example of such an incident in international affairs?

history is just a repetation of itself
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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 17:10
Turkey will never have to reopen its eastern border to the Armenians, because there is basically no force which can make them. Basically, countries do what is in their own best interests unless outside pressure is brought to bear on them. I don't know of any force which will commit itself to forcing Turkey to give up big slices of territory, I don't think the Armenians will get back any territory.
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 17:18
I don't think there are enough Armenians to populate it anyway...
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  Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 19:23
Originally posted by ConstantineXI

Turkey will never have to reopen its eastern border to the Armenians, because there is basically no force which can make them. Basically, countries do what is in their own best interests unless outside pressure is brought to bear on them.


     You hit the point right on the spot. I fully agree that this is the only way Armenia will ever regain its western territories, as Turkey (or any nation for that matter) would obviously never give up land on its own. Its mostly populated by Kurds now, anyway. Its unlikely that the lands will be returned, but not impossible.
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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 20:44
The only thing that will allow Armenians with a EU passport (maybe 2 or 3 millions) to move and resettle Turk Armenia will be Turkey entering EU. It will probaly help many other (retired) EU citizens from the north to move to the western and southern coast, inceasing the cost of living and changing the local demography. Greeks of Anatolian ascent, fo course, would also be able to return to their former homelands freely, as will the Turks of Greece origin if that's what they wish. And many Turks and Kurds will have easier to migrate to Germany and other European countries as well.

The Genocide issue is more about clearing up the past. Making peace and honoring the dead.

Though you never know, considering Israel is claiming a land that lost 2000 years ago

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  Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 21:00
Originally posted by Zagros

Small pieces of course

I think the British should recognise their genocide of Kurds in the 20s when Winston Churchill savagely ordered the murder of thousands of Kurds by chemical gases.  Winston Churchill should be tarnished as the ruthlessblood thirsty villain he was... Gallipoli and the deaths of hundreds of thousands of allies and ottomans in a pointless operation was also his doing.

There seem to be an internet conspiracy to frame Churchill for using poison gas on the Kurds.

I did a search engine survey. Every site uses the same partial quote.

"I do not understand this sqeamishness about the use of gas. I am strongly in favour of using poison gas against uncivilised tribes"

What none of them do is finish the quote where Churchill goes on to describe Tear Gas, which is the gas the British used.

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  Quote Artaxiad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jan-2006 at 22:38

Western Armenia will not be delivered to us on a silver plate, even if the Armenian genocide is recognized by the Turkish government. It will be claimed that the perpertrators of the genocide were Ottomans, and not Turks, so the whole Armenian "question" will be forgotten again.

88 years ago, nobody thought that an independant Armenian state will be recreated in its' original historic homeland, after hundreds of years of foreign domination, but it happened. 

50 years ago, nobody thought that Armenia will eventually be independant, but it happened...

Why is it impossible?

 



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  Quote Iranian41ife Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 00:00
Originally posted by cebeci

do you mean that internataional treaties, NATO and UN being the first, will force turkey to reopen its east to armenians and in the future (NOT REMOTE I THINK) allow armenia to expand to near kayseri??

is there any prior example of such an incident in international affairs?

 

the west gave palestine to israel for compensation... so i guess that is an example.

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  Quote cebeci Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 13:33

then crimea should return to turks as a compensation of ethnic cleansing of russians after the crimean war

or karabakh to azerbaijan for reasons surrounding armenian slaughter in early 90's

or western turkey to greece for ever-vanished greek population present before turkish independence war

or west trachia to turks as compensation of ethnic pressure

or parts of nevada and dakota to indians of american shames

whatever... where will we stop?

history is just a repetation of itself
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 13:48

well why not, just have to change their country name. ROK republic of kurdistan.

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  Quote cebeci Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 14:00

ok then.. everybody decides its own favorite territory and get ready for march!!

leave aside the joke and let' be more realistic

the most probable result of such an acceptance will be monetary and armenians could well get a bit bite from turkish budget...

i think the cost will make a total of 2-3 billion dollars which makes every armenian in caucasus a car-holder

history is just a repetation of itself
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 14:04

I think armenians should return easter turkey, but Infact I dont think any of them will return. If any armenian settle turkey, place wont be eastern anatolia but istanbul.

 

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  Quote cebeci Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 14:05

istanbul has no spare seats anymore

only sea remained unsettled

 

history is just a repetation of itself
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Jan-2006 at 14:09

hehe, this is better for armenians isnt it?

By the way, I think there are a lot place at istanbul.

armenians can come, greeks can come, maju can come. But not chinies pls.

 

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