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America, the early years.

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DukeC View Drop Down
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  Quote DukeC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: America, the early years.
    Posted: 02-Dec-2005 at 14:27

The early days of America are somewhat obscured by history. For instance George Washington was not the first American President but the sixteenth. From 1776 to 1789 America was represent by the Continental Congress and it's yearly elected president.

Most Americans during the early years placed more importance on states rights and there was active resistance to centralized control(Shay Rebellion, Whiskey Rebellion).

An organization that played an important role in creating the modern American state is the Society of the Cincinnati. This was formed by officiers of the Continental Army with the original purpose of pressuring the Continental Congress for payments they believed they were due. George Washington was its president from 1783 till his death in 1799. Many of the members were delegates to the closed door convention that produced the federal Constitution in Philidelphia in 1787.

Some Americans were concerned about the new organization, chiefly among them Thomas Jefferson. It was a hereditary society and many of it's members were monarchists. This concern was not without cause as the man who presided over it's founding, Baron von Steuben, wrote a letter to Prince Henry of Prussia in 1786 inquiring whether he would like to be King of the United States. Prince Henry declined the offer. 

It was also believed by Jefferson that Washington and the Society of the Cincinnati advanced their own cause over the welware of the rest of the nation.

I'd be interested to hear other views on this period of American history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Society_of_the_Cincinnati

http://www.upress.virginia.edu/books/myers.html

http://www.whiskeyrebellion.org/gwashing.html

  



Edited by DukeC
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  Quote Belisarius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Dec-2005 at 15:24
Washington was in fact the first president under the Constitution. The other presidents before him were under the Articles of Confederation.

The states' rights issue what brought about the Constitution. The Articles of Conferderation ensured strong local government. As a result, the states were disunited. There was a time when each state had its own currency. The Federalists realized that only a nation with a strong central government could become powerful. So, it's really not about how more importance was placed on states' right, but rather because they thought it would work, but it did not.
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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Dec-2005 at 16:13
DukeC

If you go to a library (or a bookstore) in the U.S., the early years of the Republic are better described by Information Overload.  There is so much you can't digest it all.

I disagree on your view of Shays' Rebellion and the Whiskey Rebellion.   These were  both rooted in economic conditions, and although resistance to authority was involved, they were both northern phenomena.  There was much less objection to a federalist, more central form of government in the northern states than in the south.

Of course in the earliest years of the republic, it was by no means certain  that it would survive.  Economic conditions after the dislocations of the war for independence were very tenuous.  How the rural population would react to a new political order was not well known, and a rebellion was the last thing a newborn state needed.  Shays' was more frustration over land values and depressed economy.  The event was crucial in eventual ratification of the Constitution (although a couple New England states passed it by extremely narrow margins).

The Whiskey Rebellion may have been more a resistance to government, but it had to do with  how and if  revenue could be raised....crucial to government.  The economy of the frontier was more a barter economy at this early time.  Farmers existed at about subsistance level, and a tax on their product (whiskey) was onerous.   There was very little specie in circulation at this time, and if  they had any it could not be spared for tax.

(Incidentally, the frontier farmer got a good deal of his crop of corn or rye to his "customer" by distilling it into whiskey -  rodents couldn't eat that and it lasted longer -  and often used it to barter for goods he needed.)

Putting down civil disorder with the characteristic of rebellion was very important as a show of strength for the young country.  Also the rather mild consequences of these two actions (all Shays' insurrectos were pardoned...not aware of any treason convictions in the Whiskey) led to a better understanding of how disagreement with the government would be handled in the absence of being considered treason.  I.e., redress of grievances.

Just some thoughts.

 




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  Quote DukeC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Dec-2005 at 16:37
Interesting, thanks pikeshot.
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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Dec-2005 at 17:58

Originally posted by DukeC

Interesting, thanks pikeshot.

Hope you found it helpful.

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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Dec-2005 at 10:05
Originally posted by DukeC

The early days of America are somewhat obscured by history. For instance George Washington was not the first American President but the sixteenth. From 1776 to 1789 America was represent by the Continental Congress and it's yearly elected president.

Most Americans during the early years placed more importance on states rights and there was active resistance to centralized control(Shay Rebellion, Whiskey Rebellion).

An organization that played an important role in creating the modern American state is the Society of the Cincinnati. This was formed by officiers of the Continental Army with the original purpose of pressuring the Continental Congress for payments they believed they were due. George Washington was its president from 1783 till his death in 1799. Many of the members were delegates to the closed door convention that produced the federal Constitution in Philidelphia in 1787.

Some Americans were concerned about the new organization, chiefly among them Thomas Jefferson. It was a hereditary society and many of it's members were monarchists. This concern was not without cause as the man who presided over it's founding, Baron von Steuben, wrote a letter to Prince Henry of Prussia in 1786 inquiring whether he would like to be King of the United States. Prince Henry declined the offer. 

It was also believed by Jefferson that Washington and the Society of the Cincinnati advanced their own cause over the welware of the rest of the nation.

I'd be interested to hear other views on this period of American history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Society_of_the_Cincinnati

http://www.upress.virginia.edu/books/myers.html

http://www.whiskeyrebellion.org/gwashing.html

  

Is anyone else interested in DukeC's topic?

 

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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Dec-2005 at 11:47

One result of the conditions described by Pikeshott is that American whiskey isn't made from barley.

Tough.

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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Dec-2005 at 15:16
Originally posted by gcle2003

One result of the conditions described by Pikeshott is that American whiskey isn't made from barley.

Tough.

Hey Graham, Bourbon whiskey trumps Scotch any day. 

If you can find it, try van Winkel's 20 year old.



Edited by pikeshot1600
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