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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Pan-Aryanism
    Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 19:42

I think it is time for some Pan-Aryan movement. What do other Iranians think of this proposal.

Our culture has been steadily bastardized at the hands of Turkic, Mongol, Arab, and Western invaders.

Each of these groups has held onto their own culture because of their unification movements. My ideas may seem extreme, but not when you compare them to Pan-Arabist who want to label the Persian Gulf to their liking and who want to spread Islam and Arabic around the world. NOt when you compare them to the British who colonized and bastardized half the world. Not when you compare them to the Turks and their Pan-Turanid movements. Not when you compare them to the Americans and what they're doing to Iraq.

I believe for Iran to exist and Iranid peoples to prevail we need a Pan-Aryan movement. Screw our different groups, Gilanis, Mazanderanis, Persians, Kurds, Qashqai, Azeris, Armenians, Baloochis, Daris, Tajiks, Ossetians, and other Iranian descended groups need to come together to form one peoples. My opinion anyways.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 20:11

I have no desire to be a part of any such dangerous, racist and divisive movement. 

I would only support an organisation that promoted cultural and economic harmony between all Central Asian States, Iran, Turkey, Caucasus and Kurdistan.



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 00:00
Originally posted by Zagros

I have no desire to be a part of any such dangerous, racist and divisive movement. 

I would only support an organisation that promoted cultural and economic harmony between all Central Asian States, Iran, Turkey, Caucasus and Kurdistan.

You miss understand me. In no way am I supporting racism or divisiveness. But rather to promote the unification of Iran's peoples.

Tell me who else today supports Iran's history, culture, and legacy. One thing is damn certain Iran's government right now is more interested in the history of Ali and Hussein than that of Iran.

And do you expect the west to pic up the tab? Guess again. I have lived here and have taken numerous courses on ancient history, Iran is glossed over, given very little attention. They make the Iranians seem like despotic kings over here in the USA.

Nor do I advocate racism. All peoples would be welcome in Iran and treated with respect, as is our culture to do so. But one thing we will not do is let other nations tread all over us as they have and still do!

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 00:18
about the persian gulf, the Persians did change the name of that gulf as their liking too what makes it so hard to get when Arab states who have the larger area of that gulf deciding to change it to their liking?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 00:20

It has historically been called the Persian Gulf. I doubt Arabs would like it if we called the Arabian sea the Persian Sea. Not that I want to but you get my drift...

And the USA has a larger coastline on the Gulf of Mexico, but that has been its historical name

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 00:46

well iam not saying its historically hasnt been called Persian for a long time, we all know that.

But it had different names before that and the persian changed it simply because they had the power to do so.

this Gulf had one of the oldest civilizations in the world and for sure they called this gulf with a name.

anyway i understand why would the Iranians around the world wont like this change, but then its only practiced in the Arabic countries and dont know if all are calling it Arabian Gulf , AFAK its called Arabian in the Arabic States on it.

back to the topic

what would be the map of this Pan-Aryan union?

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 01:27

It would include all peoples descendant of Aryan, Iranid tribes and who wish to preserve their culture like the ppls I listed above. I guess ppls in this union would come from Iran, Afghanistan, Tajikistan mainly, also maybe Azeris and Armenia.

Like I said I dont mean as in a racist, hating pan-Aryanism, but rather to preserve Iranian culture. Much the way Pan-Arabist or Pan-Turanists have worked to promote their culture.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 02:32
Apart from the Idea(I think the same for Pan-Turkists) I think name of it is a bit wrong.I know many European and American racist groups using the name Aryan or Arian as well mostly those who proud of being white and Christian.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 10:08
Originally posted by PrznKonectoid

I think it is time for some Pan-Aryan movement. What do other Iranians think of this proposal.

Our culture has been steadily bastardized at the hands of Turkic, Mongol, Arab, and Western invaders.

Each of these groups has held onto their own culture because of their unification movements. My ideas may seem extreme, but not when you compare them to Pan-Arabist who want to label the Persian Gulf to their liking and who want to spread Islam and Arabic around the world. NOt when you compare them to the British who colonized and bastardized half the world. Not when you compare them to the Turks and their Pan-Turanid movements. Not when you compare them to the Americans and what they're doing to Iraq.

I believe for Iran to exist and Iranid peoples to prevail we need a Pan-Aryan movement. Screw our different groups, Gilanis, Mazanderanis, Persians, Kurds, Qashqai, Azeris, Armenians, Baloochis, Daris, Tajiks, Ossetians, and other Iranian descended groups need to come together to form one peoples. My opinion anyways.

I'm agree with you wholeheartedly.We must set up a Pan-Iranian organization in all the Iranic-inhabited lands.

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 13:48

Pan Iranism will not work.
 
For the following reasons:
   
 
Ex-Colonial nations consist of:  Iran, Afghanistan, Southern Caucasus, Western & Southern Pakistan, 60% of Iraq, Portions of Turkey, Portions of Uzbekistan, little Tajikistan, little portion of Turkmenistan, little portion in Qyrghizstan, and little portion of China.
 
1.  All these nations, have borders that do not represent their historical lands.  
 
2.  All these nations have split from each other for a very long time (some even before Colonial thrust).  
 
3.  They do not ALL share the same culture, let alone the same language.  
 
4.  Most of these nations have tried to create a national unity but have had many difficulties ranging from ethnic squabbles, to bad governments, foreign interference, to isolation (being landlocked/sanctioned).
 
5.  When countries lack a strong & powerful national identity (given or coerced to them by their foreign agitators before them), they turn to the only thing that unifies them, which is not race, but RELIGION, (ie Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran).  Race (ie. Iranian/Aryan) does not define a person, culture does.  And culture varies from Baghdad to Kabul, even from Shia to Sunni.
 
However, historically, Religion is the only thing that unites Muslims (the predominant religion of Iranian speaking peoples across the world.)  From solidarity with the Palestinians, to the sacrilege of Qurans in Afghanistan by US troops.  Muslim Iranians across the world listen to how their religion is being attacked by the West.
 
Religion is a much more hotter and burning identity than being an Iranian.

 



Edited by Afghanan
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 14:31
& in completion of Afghanan:
6.don't forget England had tremendous effort to make this border & make problem between this pepole.
they can't forget their effort simply

7. First make Iranian Nation.
what Reza shah did (&now is totally destroyed) & then think to others
unify South of Iran with North with West with East with Center of Iranostamble();
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 17:25

I agree with Aryan, first we have to unify our own Iran and send the mullahs to the hell, where they came from.

We don't need no pan iranist or pan aryanist or pan whatever. We can establish greater cultural ties with another Iranic nations. Let our universities work together on research for our Cultur and history and publish them, especially they have to publish their researchs for western people.

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 23:49
Originally posted by Afghanan

Pan Iranism will not work.
 
For the following reasons:
   
 
Ex-Colonial nations consist of:  Iran, Afghanistan, Southern Caucasus, Western & Southern Pakistan, 60% of Iraq, Portions of Turkey, Portions of Uzbekistan, little Tajikistan, little portion of Turkmenistan, little portion in Qyrghizstan, and little portion of China.
 
1.  All these nations, have borders that do not represent their historical lands.  
 
2.  All these nations have split from each other for a very long time (some even before Colonial thrust).  
 
3.  They do not ALL share the same culture, let alone the same language.  
 
4.  Most of these nations have tried to create a national unity but have had many difficulties ranging from ethnic squabbles, to bad governments, foreign interference, to isolation (being landlocked/sanctioned).
 
5.  When countries lack a strong & powerful national identity (given or coerced to them by their foreign agitators before them), they turn to the only thing that unifies them, which is not race, but RELIGION, (ie Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran).  Race (ie. Iranian/Aryan) does not define a person, culture does.  And culture varies from Baghdad to Kabul, even from Shia to Sunni.
 
However, historically, Religion is the only thing that unites Muslims (the predominant religion of Iranian speaking peoples across the world.)  From solidarity with the Palestinians, to the sacrilege of Qurans in Afghanistan by US troops.  Muslim Iranians across the world listen to how their religion is being attacked by the West.
 
Religion is a much more hotter and burning identity than being an Iranian.

 

That is exactly my point! the borders have no historical significance. If we do not come together or at least consolidate what we have we will keep being divided into smaller and smaller nations. The Kurds want to break away from Iran, even though they are Iranid, tomorrow it will be Baloochi, later the Gilani.

Religion is crap means of identification. Religion splinters into so many groups. DO you really want Iran split between the sh*tes, Dervishes, Sunnis, Christians, Zoroastrianism, Bahai, and Judaism? Not to mention the many sects within each religion and sub-religion.

This culture is a modern phenomenan designed to split us apart. AND IT IS WORKING.

During Cyrus the Great's reign do you think the Persian, Sagartians, Medians, Hycranians, or Arians had exactly the same culture? No but they shared a heritage.

Also if we come together think how better we could preserve and save our history, and how much more power our peoples would have. If we dont have the ambitions to do big things, how are we even going to solve Iran's current issues with these mullahs?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 03:06

 when I'm drunk specially with  vodka and "mast khiar" , I listen Shahram Nazeri , Iraj, Haydeh and I cry for Iran.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 03:26
Originally posted by Saka

 when I'm drunk specially with  vodka and "mast khiar" , I listen Shahram Nazeri , Iraj, Haydeh and I cry for Iran.

Andak Andak Maeparastam..........

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 03:44

just to remind you guys this part of the forum is in English lanuage and if you wish to use any other languages you must provid an english translation.

 

moved to intellectual forum.

 



Edited by azimuth
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 03:56

Originally posted by azimuth

about the persian gulf, the Persians did change the name of that gulf as their liking too what makes it so hard to get when Arab states who have the larger area of that gulf deciding to change it to their liking?

chera in kos sher migeh?

why dont we change the whole world for arab liking. Wasn't the Red Sea once called the Arab Sea. Why do you have to change Persian one. Is this anti-persian sentiment, I think so.

anyway, I wonder what would Japanese do if China decides to change Sea of Japan to Sea of China, how about America changed Gulf of Mexico to Gulf of Texas. I wonder what the Mexicans would do. Lets change the Indian Ocean to the Arab ocean.

Khalij Al-Fars. does it hurt you when you say Fars?

anyway, I dont support Pan-aryanism. I dont want to bring myself to such a low position and become like one of these Arabs and pan-arabism.

"Who so shall worship Ahura Mazda, divine blessing will be upon him, both while living and when dead" Darius The Great
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 04:06

Well Iranian culture is official lost, reading peoples comments. There is nothing lowly about Iranid peoples uniting together to preserve their culture. I mean, yes I want the Persian Gulf to remain the Persian GUlf, but that is only a name.

So many stupid people do not care to save Iranian culture, or create Iranian unity, yet they get all mad over the name of the Persian Gulf. I agree it should be Persian Gulf, but this is only one aspect.

Also look at the name itself. we are Persian, not Fersian. Likewise it is Pars, not Fars. Fars is the Arabic version because Arabs do not have a "P." So while ur all pissed about it being changed, as am I, u still want it named after the Arabic derivative.

BTW Azimuth do you know if Khallij is an Arabic-derived word, because if it is then that would be a real irony. Khallij-e-Fars



Edited by PrznKonectoid
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 04:12

huh!

what is "chera in kos sher migeh?"?

what did i say in the post just above yours about the language? plz provide translations otherwise it will be edited.

about the Persian/Arabian Gulf.

as i said Persian changed from its older name  ( did it hurt them to pronounce the old names of the gulf )

now Arabs decided to change it from the persian one. so they are doing like the persian did.

you want to change other places and called persian? do so dont think anybody will force you not to. its a matter of acceptance and agreement between the nations so far the Persian Gulf is much well known than the Arabian one.

the Arabian gulf is used in the Arabic states only i guess.

also it will be pronounced Al Khaleej Al Farisi Not Khaleej Al Farisi. and yes Khaleej is an Arabic word for Gulf.

and FYI the Sea of Japan is also known as Korian Sea.

 



Edited by azimuth
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Nov-2005 at 07:33
Originally posted by Azimuth

as i said Persian changed from its older name  ( did it hurt them to pronounce the old names of the gulf )

Ok, can you introduce sources??
& so, Well, if we changed name [we did not], Does it hurt Arabs, to say Persian gulf???

& the same goinig here in this site, You couldn't accept Iranian History Topic
http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7062&a mp;PN=1&TPN=2

& you are touching hot point, & making nationalist war here
then as moderator will ban all of us by this rule:
6. Nationalism, derogatory remarks to national or ethnic groups, jingoism, bigotry, racism, political propaganda. (see below)

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