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Georgia in Medieval

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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Georgia in Medieval
    Posted: 22-Nov-2005 at 12:56
I think that Georgia is the one of the strongers kingdom of east europe in Medieval.
(I think so and you?)

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  Quote Decebal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Nov-2005 at 13:44
Yes, I think so, from what I know. Can you provide us with more information though, please?
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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Nov-2005 at 13:48
ok firs of all i will upload map of georgia in Medieval. if u want?
but it's on Georgian.

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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Nov-2005 at 04:30
The Holy Trinity Curch in Tbilisi, Georgia. Was built in 1994-2004





And this is the Metehi Church. Built between 1278 and 1289 on the top of a rocky bank of the river Mtkvary (Kura).



I took this pictures in 15.12.2004

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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Nov-2005 at 08:21
Why do you call Kura river as "Mtkvary"?!
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Nov-2005 at 08:23

my friend, you have to upload the pictures to the internet before u can show them to us.

go to www.imageshack.us upload your pictures there, then note the address and write it for us here to see.

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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Nov-2005 at 11:15
Why do you call Kura river as "Mtkvary"?!

It's just Georgian name of Kura - Mtkvari, like Georgia is in English or Gurjistan in Arabian. But Georgia is SAKARTVELO in Georgian language.
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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Nov-2005 at 13:18
Have you ever heard abour Didgori battle? Between Georgians and Seljuk Turks coalition.

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  Quote Sarmata Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Nov-2005 at 22:17
good stuff, id like to learn more about Georgia. In the book "Stalin and his Hangmen" the author compares Poland and Georgia as a way to draw similarities bet ween the Geogrian Stalin and the Polish Dzierzynski: "What brought together these two men of largely incompatible temperament, class, and naitonality? Dzierzynski and Stalin were drawn to each other, as other Georgian and Polish intellectuals and rebels always had been. For Georgians, Poland was a congenial part of the Russian empire for university study or exile. Poles and Georgians shared a tradition of eloquence, a cult of honor, and pride in a heroic medieval age of chivalry. Both nations also believed that they had been chosen by God to defend Christian values-the Poles the Catholic faith and Western culture, the Georgians the Orthodox religion and Byzantine civilization- against the barbarians of the East."
Out of curiousity what would a modern Georgian think of a Polak, good terms? bad terms? Please show the map of Medieval Georgia and tell some facts about the history.
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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 07:50

Georgians have been always good friends of Iranians, there were many great Georgians in Iran such as Alaverdikhan Undiladze, the governor of Persia and the famous general of Shah Abbas the Great.


Allahverdi Khan Bridge, Isfahan

or our great hero Imamgholikhan who defeated the Portuguese and reconquered many southern cities and islands of Iran.


Statue of Imamgholi Khan in Qeshm Island

Georgians still live in Iran, Fardian is in fact a Georgian province in central Iran, there are many Georgian villages and a large Georgian city in this region -> http://www.kartvelebi.com


Mausoleum of a Georgian Princess in Tehran

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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 10:46
OK Sarmata I will upload the maps of medieval Georgia, but the problem is that this maps are on Georgian language and I'm translating them now if u can wait, soon I will upload the English versios, or if u want I will uplad Georgian versions now and English ones when I will finish???

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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 10:56
I'm agree with Cyrus Shahmiri, there is a lot of Georgians in Iran and our President was in Fardian in 2004, also there was a lot of wars between Georgia and Iran, but this battles halped our two cultues to get closer.

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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 13:48
I'm uploading 4 pictures of medieval Georgian soldies, I'm looking beter pictures now. So here you go while i finde beter ones.




I will upload more pics of Georgian soldiers soon.

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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Nov-2005 at 14:17
there is another famous Iranian general of Georgian descendance, Smbat Bagratuni.
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  Quote Georgian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 11:59
The Great Georgian genras are not only in Iran they are in Russia too. From Bagration family, Bagrations are Georgian Royal family.
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  Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Nov-2005 at 16:58
Originally posted by Temujin

there is another famous Iranian general of Georgian descendance, Smbat Bagratuni.


Originally posted by Georgian

The Great Georgian genras are not only in Iran they are in Russia too. From Bagration family, Bagrations are Georgian Royal family.


Smbat Bagratuni was Armenian in origin. It is the exact name of an Armenian king during the middle ages. The Bagratuni family is an Armenian royal family that ruled over Armenia, while another branch of the family ruled Georgia from 809-1810. Georgians simply call them "Bagrations", but their origin comes from the Bagratuni royal house of Armenia.

From Wikipedia:

The Bagratid family first emerged as naxarars, members of the hereditary nobility of Armenia. Their holdings were in the region of Sper, in the Chorokhi valley. As early as 288-301, the Bagratid prince Smbat held the hereditary Armenian titles of Master of the Horse and t'agatir, or coronant of the King.Citation needed

According to Prince Cyril Toumanoff, the earliest Bagratid prince was chronicled as early as 314 AD. In the eighth century, a later Bagratid prince (also named Smbat) revolted against the Arab Caliphate. The revolt was defeated, but was successful enough to set the stage for Georgian and Armenian independence.



From the same page on Wikipedia:

The Bagratid family in Georgia began with the migration of one prince Ashot (780-826) from Armenia.Citation needed He settled in the Armeno-Georgian marchlands at Artanuji (part of the Georgian Principality of Tao-Klarjeti, now in the territory of Turkey).

Ashot I the Great (Ashot I Kurapalate) was the first Bagratid King, the founder of the Royal dynasty. He was recognized as prince of princes by the court at Baghdad in 861, which provoked war with local Arab emirs. Ashot won the war, and was recognized as King of the Armenians by Baghdad in 885.

Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bagratuni

Scholary study has just about proven that the Bagratunis were Armenian. Their entire early history is in Armenia, and they were active in Armenia for almost 500 years before they are even mentioned in Georgia.

Sure, the Bagratunis of Georgia became more Georgian than Armenian, but their origin is in Armenia. This isnt the first time ive heard them called Georgians, which is why i wanted to clear up the confusion.



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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Nov-2005 at 17:22
Bagratuni is a Georgian name, just because they ruled Armenia at a time when there was no Georgia doesn't mean he is not Georgian. Georgian names generally end with an -i or -dze like Bagratuni or Dshugashvili and Shevadnadze or Mikaberidze, while Armenian names end with -ian/yan like Mikoyan or Guderian or Hashemian.
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  Quote Artaxiad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Nov-2005 at 22:49

Most of the Armenian noble families' names ended with ''uni'' - Arshakuni, Bagratuni, Yervanduni, Ardzruni, etc. There were very few names ending with ''ian'' back then, such as Mamikonian. 

Georgian names don't end only with ''i''. They end with ''shvili'', like Zurabashvili, Sahakashvili, etc.

Here are a few maps of interest:

This is when Georgia annexed or vassalized most of the Caucasus. It gave autonomy to the Armenians.

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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Nov-2005 at 05:22

or Hashemian

lol

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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Nov-2005 at 05:33

I have always known Smbat Bagratuni to be Armenian, he crushed a Gok Turuk and Hephtalite invasion in the East with a Sassanian army.

I have been looking for more details on this battle.

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