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demon
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Topic: Who are the Janissaries? Posted: 12-Aug-2004 at 19:08 |
I hear about them in AOK and RON. I just want to learn what's so great about them
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Grrr..
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Tobodai
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Posted: 12-Aug-2004 at 19:15 |
Theyt were warriors of the Ottoman sultan, often taken from European stock and trained in ways of faith and battle. Virtually slaves but treated as princes htey were supposed to be the infantry elite of the Ottomans.
They eventually gained too much power though and in the 1820's I think the sultan tied to get rid of them and it caused this jannisary uprising that alot of poeple died in.
I know there are people here that know more than I about this
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"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
-Alexander Hamilton
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Posted: 13-Aug-2004 at 02:08 |
The Janisarries eventually became an inhibitor of reform. In the early 19th century, they were wiped out with one fell sweep by Sultan Mahmud??
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I/eye
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Posted: 13-Aug-2004 at 13:08 |
an elite group that eventually became inhibitor of reform.. hey that sounds very familiar..
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fastspawn
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Posted: 14-Aug-2004 at 13:30 |
how did the janissaries get to hold so much power? Was any of them
appointed to the highest court positions? I find it unlikely that they
could hold such power over the monarch.
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Beylerbeyi
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Posted: 15-Aug-2004 at 10:43 |
Jenissaries (Tr. Yeni cheri- new troop) were a professional army corps in the beginning, known for their discipline and strict training.
Later (from the 18th century on) their numbers increased but their discipline slacked. They got the right to marry and engage in trade. During peacetime they acted as the police force in Istanbul, and around the palace, so they were always engaged in the Palace affairs. They would revolt frequently to get concessions from the Emperor. They also got a special bonus when a new Emperor rose to the throne, so they had an incentive to depose of any Emperors they didn't like. In order keep their previlages, they resisted the creation of a Western-style modern army during the 18th and 19th centuries, foiling the attempts by reformist Emperors.
Mahmud II, an important reformist (I don't know why he has bad stats in Europa Universalis II) disbanded them by force in 1826.
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ihsan
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Posted: 15-Aug-2004 at 15:53 |
The Janissary Corps or the Yenieri Ocağı were an Ocak (Corp) of the infantry branch of the Kapıkulu Ocakları (Palace Guard Corps).
They were established during the reign of Murd I (he wasn't a Sultn actually, he was only a Beğ; his son, Byezd I started using that title after the victory at Niğbolu [Nicopolis] in 1396) as an infantry bodyguard regiment, as the old military system wasn't enough.
There are many more stuff to write & tell about them...
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kroglu
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Posted: 02-Sep-2004 at 20:49 |
They got the turkish way of Islam. They were ALEVIs like the original turkmens. So, they had european parents, but they got the turkish kulture, the turkish religion and the turkish hart!
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Posted: 03-Sep-2004 at 13:26 |
Originally posted by fastspawn
how did the janissaries get to hold so much power? Was any of them appointed to the highest court positions? I find it unlikely that they could hold such power over the monarch. |
I assume the same way as mameluks in Egypt. A flaw in any personal government is that you need to trust someone to cover your rearguard. At last you become dependant on him. There is nothing you can do to avoid it unless you have a very good personal qualities (what is not easy to find in a hereditary monarchy, when you grow up the heirs in a harem).
As far as I know, janissaires were child Christian slaves, who were educated in the Islam traditions. They were really hard. When a Spanish force conquered a stronghold in the Adriatic Sea they had to kill all of them, since they din't surrender. Sorry, I can't remember the name.
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Dari
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Posted: 03-Sep-2004 at 16:09 |
The Jans were the boogeymen of the Islamic World.
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ihsan
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Posted: 04-Sep-2004 at 16:51 |
Originally posted by kroglu
They got the turkish way of Islam. They were ALEVIs like the original turkmens. So, they had european parents, but they got the turkish kulture, the turkish religion and the turkish hart! |
Just a minor correction: they were Bektashis, not Alevis; even though they never fought for Shi'a Islam, they fought for Sunnism.
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Dari
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Posted: 04-Sep-2004 at 18:25 |
Theres no damn real difference.
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Imperator Invictus
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Posted: 04-Sep-2004 at 20:55 |
A quick question: What was the main source of Christians they recruited
from? was it mainly former Byzantine Orthodox christians, or did it
include others.
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ihsan
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Posted: 05-Sep-2004 at 12:20 |
Originally posted by Imperator Invictus
A quick question: What was the main source of Christians they recruited from? was it mainly former Byzantine Orthodox christians, or did it include others. |
Between 1430 (when the Devirme system was launched) and 1648 (when it was no longer officially used), Christians from Anatolia, Greece, Bulgaria, Serbia, Bosnia and maybe some other places were used as a source for the Acemiolans. Greeks, Serbs, Bosnians (both Christians and Muslims were allowed), Bulgarians and even Karamanlidies (Turkish-speaking Anatolian Christians) were prefered, to my knowledge. However, after 1648, the Devirme was no longer used, though the Crimean Tatars continued to send small numbers of Christian prisoners-of-war to the capital, but I guess they were too small and unimportant in number.
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Dari
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Posted: 06-Sep-2004 at 13:07 |
Jan is the boogeyman of boogeymen known as the Janissaries.
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sephodwyrm
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Posted: 08-Sep-2004 at 01:38 |
Janissaries is the romanized bastardization of the word Yeniceries (sorry I couldn't get the tail) which means the new soldiers. The Yeniceries were actually the brawny boys chosen from the "blood tax" or the Christian recruits that were taught in the ways of Islam. The smart boys will instead serve as court officials, viziers, governors etc.
I read somewhere that Sultan Suleiymann's grand vizier was a Greek (trained from boyhood and was Suleiymann's best friend). However, Hurem (correct spelling?) aka Roxalena had him removed...
Ihsan can give much more accurate history than I can.
Edited by sephodwyrm
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ihsan
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Posted: 08-Sep-2004 at 11:33 |
Hey Chap, welcome back to AE, we'd missed you!
Before 1430, a system called Penik (coming from Persian Panj meaning "Five) was used, in which one out of five prisoners-of-war were trained as guards, very similar to how the Medieval Islamic Ghulms and Egyptian Mamlks were formed; the captives that were in the process of training were called Penikolan. However, the Penik system was abandoned in the early 15th century, largely because 1) Timur's Anatolian Invasion, 2) Ottoman Civil War and 3) Lack of enough captives to train.
So, around the year 1430, a new system called Devirme was introduced. According to this, each year, 1,000 Christian children were collected from their families (there are many accounts of families sending their kids, to assure their sons' positions in the society) and sent to Turkish village. Later, after learning Turkish and becoming Muslim, they were all sent to Istanbul, where they were sent to two places: 1) the Kapkulu Ocaklar (Palace Guard Corps) and 2) the Endern (Palace School). The Kapkulu were selected from physicially strong youngsters whereas the intelligent were selected into the Endern. The ones sent to the Kapkulu Ocaklar were called Acemiolan during their military training and following a ceremony named Kapuya kma, they were sent into the various corps among the Kapkulu. The Endern students were, however, trained heavily on many subjects, incluiding literature, horseback riding, administrationship, archery, javelin-throwing and many other things I can't remember now. The graduates from Endern either became members of the Kapkulu Cavalry (normally, Acemiolans could become Kapkulu Cavalries, but some students of Endern were also allowed) while most of them became Vezrs (Viziers - Ministers) and other high-ranked beurocrats; the best of them rose up to become Vezr-i zms (Prime Minister, also called Sadrzm or Sadr- zm).
I read somewhere that Sultan Suleiymann's grand vizier was a Greek (trained from boyhood and was Suleiymann's best friend). However, Hurem (correct spelling?) aka Roxalena had him removed... |
Yes, Vezr brhim was a Greek from Western Anatolia, he was Sultn Sleymn's childhood friend, they grew up together at Manisa as best friends. brhim later became the Sadrzm but as time passed, Sleymn's wife Hrrem Sultn (Roxolane/Roxolana) grew jealous of his power and made up false claims about him, such as him planning of de-throning Sleymn and becoming a sultan.
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Abyssmal Fiend
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Posted: 08-Sep-2004 at 12:07 |
Originally posted by ihsan
The Janissary Corps or the Yenieri Oca were an Ocak (Corp) of the infantry branch of the Kapkulu Ocaklar (Palace Guard Corps).
They were established during the reign of Murd I (he wasn't a Sultn actually, he was only a Be; his son, Byezd I started using that title after the victory at Nibolu [Nicopolis] in 1396) as an infantry bodyguard regiment, as the old military system wasn't enough.
There are many more stuff to write & tell about them...
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That just PROVES he's the same Ihsan from the old AE. Just the fact that he knows so damn much about them. Lol.
And I'll take a page out of his book and say that alot of Jannissaries were converted from non-muslim beliefs, and trained. Mainly to brain-wash them, I'd suspect.
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Di! Ecce hora! Uxor mea me necabit!
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Abyssmal Fiend
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Posted: 08-Sep-2004 at 12:08 |
And anyone who's read the Demon Wars Saga by Bob Salvatore should notice the incredible likeness of Behren's Chezhou-Lei elite warriors to being replicas of the Jans.
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Di! Ecce hora! Uxor mea me necabit!
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Dari
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Posted: 12-Sep-2004 at 22:34 |
SovietJesus...that's one f**ked up name.
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