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Gando? No! It should be called Yanbian.

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oodog View Drop Down
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  Quote oodog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Gando? No! It should be called Yanbian.
    Posted: 19-Sep-2005 at 04:00

So far, I still don't understand why the SK government requested Chinese to change the traditional Chinese name of ROK's capital form "Hancheng" to "Shouer".  The official explanation of this request seems  very rediculous to me( http://www2.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-01/20/content _410881.htm) At least myself never thought Souel is a Chinese city when I call it "Hancheng".

Well, we Chinese respest the willing of the Korean people. Likewise, Korean including all the Korean guys in AE should stop calling the southeast region of Jilin Province as "Gando". Because its formal official name is "Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture". You can briefly call it Yanbian.

Thank you.

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  Quote jiangweibaoye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Sep-2005 at 13:34
Originally posted by oodog

So far, I still don't understand why the SK government requested Chinese to change the traditional Chinese name of ROK's capital form "Hancheng" to "Shouer".  The official explanation of this request seems  very rediculous to me( http://www2.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-01/20/content _410881.htm) At least myself never thought Souel is a Chinese city when I call it "Hancheng".

Well, we Chinese respest the willing of the Korean people. Likewise, Korean including all the Korean guys in AE should stop calling the southeast region of Jilin Province as "Gando". Because its formal official name is "Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture". You can briefly call it Yanbian.

Thank you.

Oodog

I think it has to do with the way it sounds in Chinese.  When I hear is spoken in Chinese, it sounds like City of Han.  Now, I don't know how it was written in Chinese.  I think a good way to find out is how it was written during the Ming/Qing period.  Ever since the war, there has been name changes everywhere.  I guess South Korea do not want others in China to think that Seoul is a "Chinese" city.  Fair enough.  I would like to know who the city got that name and how is sounds like City of Han when it is spoken in Chinese.  As I said, the way it is written may give us a clue.

Example.  Peking & Beijing.  In Chinese it is all written the same way, but it is spelled differently (Cantonese/Mandarin dialect was the reason). 

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jiangweibaoye View Drop Down
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  Quote jiangweibaoye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Sep-2005 at 13:36
Originally posted by oodog

So far, I still don't understand why the SK government requested Chinese to change the traditional Chinese name of ROK's capital form "Hancheng" to "Shouer".  The official explanation of this request seems  very rediculous to me( http://www2.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-01/20/content _410881.htm) At least myself never thought Souel is a Chinese city when I call it "Hancheng".

Well, we Chinese respest the willing of the Korean people. Likewise, Korean including all the Korean guys in AE should stop calling the southeast region of Jilin Province as "Gando". Because its formal official name is "Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture". You can briefly call it Yanbian.

Thank you.

Oodog,

I also agree with your Gando statment, but its a free country, you can say whatever you want, but Yanbian is the correct term.

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  Quote demon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Sep-2005 at 17:55

So far, I still don't understand why the SK government requested Chinese to change the traditional Chinese name of ROK's capital form "Hancheng" to "Shouer".  The official explanation of this request seems  very rediculous to me( http://www2.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-01/20/content _410881.htm) At least myself never thought Souel is a Chinese city when I call it "Hancheng".

Keep in mind that it was the administration of Seoul, not the government, who asked for it- them being not proficient or aware enough of the history of the name.  I personally won't be bothered having Seoul be called "hancheng", the way New York is pronounced as "Nueva York" in spanish, the way "Nihon" is pronounced "Japan" in english, the way "Netherlands" is called "Holland" in english, the way "United Confederations of Helvetica (something like this)" is called "Swiss," etc etc 

"Han" in Hancheng (It's pronounced as Han - s(e)ong; as a sidenote, during the three kingdom era, it was called Hanyang, and more known that way) is written like this:.  

"Han" as in the Chinese country, is written like this: 

As you can see, they don't look the same; meaning that the two have different meanings despite their pronounciation.

Well, we Chinese respest the willing of the Korean people. Likewise, Korean including all the Korean guys in AE should stop calling the southeast region of Jilin Province as "Gando". Because its formal official name is "Yanbian Korean Autonomous Prefecture". You can briefly call it Yanbian.

When we are talking about Gando/Gendo(Yanbian), we are discussing about this particular region that was named during the conflict era.  Calling it Yanbian would be inappropriate first because we aren't talking about the whole Yanbian province and two because it sounds farfetched to call the conflict according to its current name when the focus is the conflict that has occured years before.

Like you don't call Tang Empire "China" because although Tang predecesses China, it's not entirely China in terms of land and the term China was not used to refer Tang.  The two have different meanings.  Same applies to the situation.

Grrr..
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  Quote I/eye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Sep-2005 at 19:07

no demon.

Han in Hansung or Hanyang both use the Chinese Han.

Hansung comes from Hanyang, and that comes from the Han river, which was called Han river even before Chinese characters started to be used on place names.

so there is no meaning in what the Han in Hansung is, it's just there for pronounciation purposes. you'll find many other 'han' place names written in Chinese with the 'chiense han' character

 

but yeah, Gando and Yianbian are slightly different..
Gando being the Choson land that Japan gave to Qing in early 1900's, and Yianbian being PRC land where many Korean ethnics live

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  Quote oodog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Sep-2005 at 21:44
Originally posted by I/eye

no demon.

Han in Hansung or Hanyang both use the Chinese Han.

Hansung comes from Hanyang, and that comes from the Han river, which was called Han river even before Chinese characters started to be used on place names.

so there is no meaning in what the Han in Hansung is, it's just there for pronounciation purposes. you'll find many other 'han' place names written in Chinese with the 'chiense han' character

That's what I knew when I was in SK.  In fact, the Chinese character "yang", when it found a word with another character referring to a river or mountain, is usually means "at the north of...". For instance, the Chinese city Luoyang, which used to be the capital of the East Han Dynasty, is at the north of the Luo River. Soeal might first be established at some place north to Han River. For that reason it got the traditional name Hanyang (Hanyeong), and later turned into Hancheng when it became a big city and capital of the country.

Originally posted by I/eye

but yeah, Gando and Yianbian are slightly different..
Gando being the Choson land that Japan gave to Qing in early 1900's, and Yianbian being PRC land where many Korean ethnics live

The problem is: I often see some Korean still call that place Gando when they are discussing current issues.

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  Quote I/eye Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Sep-2005 at 05:47
Originally posted by oodog

Originally posted by I/eye

no demon.

Han in Hansung or Hanyang both use the Chinese Han.

Hansung comes from Hanyang, and that comes from the Han river, which was called Han river even before Chinese characters started to be used on place names.

so there is no meaning in what the Han in Hansung is, it's just there for pronounciation purposes. you'll find many other 'han' place names written in Chinese with the 'chiense han' character

That's what I knew when I was in SK.  In fact, the Chinese character "yang", when it found a word with another character referring to a river or mountain, is usually means "at the north of...". For instance, the Chinese city Luoyang, which used to be the capital of the East Han Dynasty, is at the north of the Luo River. Soeal might first be established at some place north to Han River. For that reason it got the traditional name Hanyang (Hanyeong), and later turned into Hancheng when it became a big city and capital of the country.

yes. at first, there is 'Han River' that has nothing to do with Chinese characters.

then, comes a time of 'Hanja-fying' place names, and that 'Chinese Han' is used

then, method of naming takes after the Chinese system, following that 'yang' = flat area to the north of something, etc

so Hanyang, then Hansung.

then a purely Korean word for the capital of Rep. of Korea, 'Seoul'

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