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Is the majority of westerners uncomfortable with Islam?

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Decebal View Drop Down
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  Quote Decebal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Is the majority of westerners uncomfortable with Islam?
    Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 00:22
Are westerners uncomfortable with Islam? I would say that the great majority of them are. The ones who are christians, are uncomfortable with muslims over religious differences, and over a mutual enmity which has lasted for almost 1500 years. The ones who are secular, may pretend that they are comfortable with Islam, but I would argue that most of them are not. Islam is a religion which controls every facet of a person's life, and I think that most secular westerners are very uncomfortable with that type of religion. Even though you always hear western politicians proclaiming that Islam is not a violent religion, and it is not politically correct to say otherwise, I think that most westreners believe that the reverse is true and they are intimidated by Islam (secretely or not).

Discuss.
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  Quote strategos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 00:25
Islam, in my mind, can be peaceful with christianity. But, I believe muslims can follow 2 paths of there profit Muhammad, peaceful, as in his early days, or violent, as he is when he gains an army, and does acts that I can say are not peaceful. Both paths are ligitament. One I can be more comfortible with than the next. The ones that yell, "Death to the West, Death to America/Israel", are not the ones im comfortible with. The ones that are peaceful, although no one such ethnicity/religion is fully peaceful, as long as they try there best..

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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 00:49
I fully agree with you, Decebal. For historical reasons mostlaicist westerners have supported and still support anti-imperialists fights and have admired for instance the Palesitinian liberation struggle or the Saharaui one as well. So it can't be said that we are anti-Arab or anti-Muslim.

Still, we, laicists, who are uncomfortable with most Christian attitudes, can't think different regarding other religions, specially one that, taken to the letter, is misoginic and considers its right to intervene in society, state and law more than any other that I know of. Unlike Christianity, Islam and Judaism started as state-religions and much of their basic doctrine is normative. Judaism has gone through 2000 years of non-statism, becoming filtered and "westernized". But Islam has not passed through any simmilar proccess: only loss of sovereignity for brief periods and literalist interpretations of the Quran seem to be the rule in most cases.

Just imagine having to live in ancient Israel, where you could be stoned to death for having said Yaveh or being adulterous... with some (today too common) interpretations of Islam is the same.


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  Quote Illuminati Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 00:51
I am not comfortable with anything that controls every facet of your life. It would be okay if everyone had the ability to choose to follow Islam, and didn't have to fear the law if they decided to live their lifes in un-Islamic ways, but thats not the case.  Its not Islam's fault, but rather the social and political climate in many parts of the Middle East.

I would feel the same about Christianity if the Middle East was Christian.

Edit: I would like to add in that think religion is the root evil. Too many bad things are done on behalf of religion. Currently, I feel more nervous about the spread of Islam than I would if Christianity was spreading but I should acknowledge that all religions are what I feel nervous about


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  Quote ill_teknique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 01:01
^^^^^ there we go talking like they know Islam.  Islamicity.com

not jihadwatch.com
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  Quote Gubook Janggoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 01:22
I'm Catholic and a Westerner.  I love Islam and if I wasn't Catholic, I'd probably choose to be Muslim.

Islam's a great religion.
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  Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 02:11
Originally posted by illuminati

The social and political climate in many parts of the Middle East do not give people that option.


Ya, but for the most part that is an exaggerated belief among many westerners. My parents lived in Saudi Arabia for 5 years, the country where they supposedly "oppress Christians", and they said they were never once treated differently for being Christians. The only thing that you cant do when youre a Christian in Saudi Arabia is visit Mecca. Thats about it. I have relatives in Lebanon and Jordan as well, and they never say anything bad about where they live or how they are treated. Dont know too much about the other countries but those 3 places are a-okay.
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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 02:50

I am totally and completely uncomfortable with Islam, but no more uncomofortable than I am with Christianity or Judaism.  All three of these religions seek to control every faucet of someones life and thus appeal to people who are not emotionally idipendant or self reliant.  We know these Abrahamic faiths create massive social discord when unleashed on people unfamiliar with their tenents and are so absolutist as to sanction unproductive and uneconomic inquisitions and persecutions. 

I however am not uncomfortable with non Abrahamic faiths, but they are still dangerous if they effect public policy more than logic and reason.

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I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 03:39
I think most Westerners do see Islam as a theat to their existence, more because of it's refusal to conform to Western social change in comparison to some of the Christian Churches. For Christians Islam is often a strict faith which deviates from the teachings of Christ and has traditionally been an enemy. For many secularists Christianity can be repugnant at times, but is considered a lesser evil.

Christianity in the West is usually a religion which you can enter and exit without too much trouble, though I do understand that in some Christian countries to abandon a Christian way of life may have negative consequences being dished out by society. But isn't it considered illegal to say no thanks to Islam once you are a Muslim, with the prescribed punishment of being stoned to death if you abandon that faith? I am asking an actual question here as I am not certain about that as a fact. If that is the case many in the West would view Islam as being less free and more authoritarian a religion than Christianity.

One thing that concerns many people in the West is Sharia law, which insists on implementing punishments and recognising crimes as defined by medieval standards e.g. stoning has already been mentioned. Though not practiced in all Islamic countries, it still occurs. Such practices are considered antiquated and cruel by Western standards of justice, so of course Westerners are worried that such a legal code is espoused in Islamic countries.
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 03:42

isn't it considered illegal to say no thanks to Islam once you are a Muslim, with the prescribed punishment of being stoned to death if you abandon that faith?

Even Ottomans time there were atheists, So I think this is not a rule of islam.

 



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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 03:47
Ok, again I am not trying to offend anyone, it is simply that I chose to give myself a secular education so my understanding of theological issues can be lacking in some areas. I give the best answer to the question I am able to with the limited knowledge available. Can anyone else shed a little more light on the topic?
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  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 04:03

No, I  am not offended. I heard it also, some muslim country(Dont know  their name) do it. But I dont think, It is a law of  seriah.

 

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  Quote azimuth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 05:09

 

well a muslim leaves Islam is called "Murtad" and under the Law ( Shareia) Murtad's punshiment is Death. But there are many conditions on that Law to be practiced ( i dont know all of them). and Most of the Cases these conditions are not applied so it is not Practiced not only these days but from the early days.

and if the conditions did meet these days i dont think any country would've applied the punishment as per the Law.

and the Stone to death thing is not for every "crime",  AFAIK its only for a Woman or a Man who committed Adultery and they are married to different people and there are 5 eye witnesses to the Adultry. and other conditions.

other than that there are no Stone to death punishment,

and No Cutting hands for stealing too  this hand cuttin as a punishments has lots of conditions which are very very rarely meet.

i dont know is it the media or is it what many people "want to hear" to assist their hate toward others.

or may be just lacke of knowledge.

 

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  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 05:17
Although I feel uncomfortable with any form of organised religion, be it Islam, Christianity or Hinduism, I feel even more uncomfortable and intimidated with the forces and their motives, that have built up Islam and Islamic countries into the bogey-men of the post-1990 new world order.
It seems that Western capitalist society can not live without a clearly defined imagery of an enemy.
After the collapse of Stalinism, or Communism as it was known then, there was a huge vacuum that urgently needed to be filled. Western society need the concept of a thread to its existence, the looming external danger that helps to divert from its own unsolvable problems, and that is useful to install all sorts of authoritarian and undemocratic emergency measures required to control its own people if it should become necessary.
The danger of Communism used to justify all this, and in absence of any other real thread, Islam was enrolled.
If you compare the paranoid mass hysteria that gripped US-America and its allies during the Cold War, of which Mc Carthys anti-communist witch- hunt is the ugliest example, you will find there are numerous parallels to the current hysteria about Islam. The often quoted website jihad-watch is a prime example for Anti-Islam paranoia, and many recent posts in AE will document how deeply that has sunk in.
I cant wait to watch Hollywoods re-make of I married a Communist, with its slighty revised title, I married a Muslim.




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  Quote Ahmed The Fighter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 09:12

 I think only uneducated western people are uncomfortable with islam,They don't know too much about islam they see the bad terrorists only but in real they don't implement Islam,Islam mean peace not war or kill,Islam ideology said as prophet Muhammed(pbuh)said:-

The ink of the scholar is more holy than the blood of the martyr.

The most excellent Jihad is that for the conquest of self.

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  Quote Decebal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 09:45
Originally posted by Ahmed The Fighter

 I think only uneducated western people are uncomfortable with islam,They don't know too much about islam they see the bad terrorists only but in real they don't implement Islam,Islam mean peace not war or kill,Islam ideology said as prophet Muhammed(pbuh)said:-

The ink of the scholar is more holy than the blood of the martyr.

The most excellent Jihad is that for the conquest of self.

I wish it were only that. I've met plenty of educated westerners who are uncomfortable with Islam. It is not just the terrorists: it's the muslim lifestyle. For example, even open-minded well-educated westerners are uncomfortable with women wearing the full veil and face-cover in a western city. They simply are uncomfortable with a religion which regulates every aspect of one's life. As I said before: Christian westerners don't like Islam because it clashes with their own beliefs; secular westerners don't like Islam because they are liberal and it seems to them like Islam infringes upon one's liberty.  

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  Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 10:19
Ya, but for the most part that is an exaggerated belief among many westerners. My parents lived in Saudi Arabia for 5 years, the country where they supposedly "oppress Christians", and they said they were never once treated differently for being Christians.


Did they have to live in a compound?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 10:25
Lebanon has a big Christian population, so I guess it wouldnt be hard for Christians to live there...
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  Quote hugoestr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 10:45
I am not. I am uncomfortable with religious fanatics.
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  Quote Ahmed The Fighter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Aug-2005 at 11:07
Originally posted by Decebal

Originally posted by Ahmed The Fighter

 I think only uneducated western people are uncomfortable with islam,They don't know too much about islam they see the bad terrorists only but in real they don't implement Islam,Islam mean peace not war or kill,Islam ideology said as prophet Muhammed(pbuh)said:-

The ink of the scholar is more holy than the blood of the martyr.

The most excellent Jihad is that for the conquest of self.

I wish it were only that. I've met plenty of educated westerners who are uncomfortable with Islam. It is not just the terrorists: it's the muslim lifestyle. For example, even open-minded well-educated westerners are uncomfortable with women wearing the full veil and face-cover in a western city. They simply are uncomfortable with a religion which regulates every aspect of one's life. As I said before: Christian westerners don't like Islam because it clashes with their own beliefs; secular westerners don't like Islam because they are liberal and it seems to them like Islam infringes upon one's liberty.  

I concluded from your topic Islam have a little popularity in the west,I think each religion have a cultural we must respected in both sides in Islam the veil is not a shame thing ,I think there is no clash between us but misunderstooding can be solve by corporate propaganda in christianity there is strange things like veil such as the singlity of priests.but i think it is not real reasons to uncofortable.
"May the eyes of cowards never sleep"
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