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  Quote mauk4678 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Obscure Empires
    Posted: 05-Sep-2004 at 20:42
I was just thinking, there are alot of relatively unknown  and underapreciated  Empires in  History.  A few examles are  the  Palmyran  empire,  the Gallic empire,  the Mittanian Empire,   the Bosporan kingdom,  The Jewish Kingdom of Yemen(not sure of the real title)  The Songhai  Empire  etc....   I would like to hear about some more, and if you have any sources of information on these and others  i'd appreciate hearing about it.
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  Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2004 at 22:11

The Armenian Kingdom of Cilicia (1080-1375)

After the devastating raids of Seljuks thousands of Armenians moved toward Cilicia - region of Armenia Minor situated between the Taurus and Amanus mountains close to Mediterranean coast. The Armenian population in Cilicia gradually became predominant. In 1080 a certain Prince Ruben, that the historians believe to be descendant of the Bagradouni and Ardzrouni dynasties, asserted authority over the local Armenian and Greek princes. Ruben became founder of a new glorious royal House of Rubenids that ruled over Cilicia for more than 300 years.
Ruben I and his successors maintained close contacts with the Crusaders. As a result, the new Armenian Principality, which later became Kingdom, imitated the principles of State organization accepted in European countries. A number of new ranks and titles were established. Armenian Nakharars became Knights and Barons, Sparapets were often called Constables etc. The Armenian Cilician noblemen used the Latin and French languages alongside the Armenian. Intermarriages between the members of the Armenian and European noble families were widespread.

While the inhabitants of the Greater Armenia eye-witnessed the loss of their national statehood and numerous foreign invasions, the Cilician Armenians lived in wealth and prosperity. Good geographic location involved the country into an intensive international trade. Science and culture flourished. This period of Armenian history is regarded as the brilliant Age of Ecclesiastical manuscript painting. The school of genius Thoros Roslin was especially famous. Theology, philosophy, rhetoric, medicine and mathematics were taught in a large number of new schools and monasteries. New significant names appeared in the Armenian literature, such as: Nerses Shnorhali, Matthew of Edessa, Vardan Aygektsi and Sembat the Constable.

More complete story: http://www.armenianhistory.info/cilician.htm

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  Quote Imperator Invictus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Sep-2004 at 22:44
LOL how about the "Zeng Empire"

Really old time AE members might remember our discussion on this.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 05:22

How about the Melakan Empire?

A Palembang prince,Parameswara, runs away after conflicts in his country and settled in Temasek(present-day Singapore). After a while staying there, he killed the local chief, Tamagi to gain control of Temasek. However, Temasek was a vassal of Siam(Thailand) and the Siam King sent a force to capture Parameswara.

His followers and him flee northwards and eventually established the maritime empire of Melaka. Melaka, in its heyday manage to rival the three greatest empires in the region, Siam, Acheh and Majapahit. It accepted a pact with China since Siam was still looking for Parameswara. He eventually married a Chinese princess, Hang Li Po.

Melaka's teritory stretch from Malaysia, parts of Sumatra and Southern Phillipines. Eventually, falling from internal unrest and Portugese invasion by Alfonso Albuberque(sp?).

 

More info at www.malaya.org.uk

 

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  Quote Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 05:56
The Khwarezmian Empire
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 07:34
Originally posted by mauk4678

the Gallic empire,

Did the Gauls ever have an empire? I thought the dfferent tribes always fought wars against each other.
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  Quote Imperator Invictus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 14:02
No, the "Gallic" Empire, as it was called, was rebel Roman state consiting of the provinces of Britian, Gaul and Spain that broke away from the Empire during the Barracks Emperors period (3rd century). The Palmyrene Empire, which conquered most of Rome's Eastern Provinces, also existed at the same time. The Gallic Empire survived after the death of its first Emperor, but declined when Spain returned itself back to Rome and loss of some territory to Roman Reconquest until Emperor Aurelian's Reconquest of the entire lost territories.


Territories lost to Gallic Empire (left) and the Palmyrene Empire (right)


Edited by Imperator Invictus
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  Quote Abyssmal Fiend Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 16:33

The First Reich. Nobody considers it an Empire, since it had one war...

Other than that, Parthia? I think that's how you spell it. Crassus got dominated. Heh.

I forget the name... The Empire Yuan Shu made after he declared himself Empire of China, when he controlled 4 cities. Needless to say, he was massacred.

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  Quote demon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 16:57

The Korean empire

Brazillian empire is often untold...seriously, we conquered so much of South America.

Grrr..
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  Quote Berosus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 17:40
I nominate the Khazar Khanate of Russia, ca. 576-969 A.D.  Turkic in origin, they were the most unusual nomadic tribe to come out of Central Asia, for these reasons:

1.  They settled down, built cities and became traders, before anyone forced them to do so.

2.  In the eighth century, they decided they needed a modern religion, and chose Judaism.  In other words, they were Jewish ex-barbarians.  There are legends told by rabbis to explain why the Khazars went with Judaism, but it appears the most likely reason is because it had no political strings attached.  Had they gone with Christianity or Islam, they would have had to take orders from the pope, the Byzantine emperor or the caliph.

For more about the Khazars, check out http://www.khazaria.com .
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  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Sep-2004 at 22:11

Kingdom of Axum is my favorite obscure one, followed by the Tibetan EMpire of the 700's

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I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
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  Quote Jr_Capablanca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2004 at 16:02

Hello!

The Urartu "empire". Urartu was a country north of assyria. It existed in the 8th century BC. Actually it was one of the very few dangerous enemies assyria had during that time. (Yes, it was conquered later on by assyria).

/Capa

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  Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Sep-2004 at 16:44

And dont forget the neighbors of the Urartu empire in Anatolia, the Hittite Empire. They duked it out with the Persian empire, and im sure you guys can guess who came out on top. They started out in i believe the 18th century B.C. and lasted for about 600 years.

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  Quote warhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2004 at 10:27
Khakhan, what Zeng empire is this? You've said it was in southwest china? Southwest China at the time is ruled by Dali guo which had all of Yunnan and Guei Zhou, and its a kingdom not an empire. Is this Zeng a tribe?
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  Quote ihsan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2004 at 11:33

The Assyrians never managed to conquer the Urartu, the Urartuians were destroyed by the Medes.

Another not-very-known but long-lasting empire was the Qarluq Empire of 8th-10th centuries.



Edited by ihsan
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  Quote mauk4678 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2004 at 16:33

I was wondering, Has anyone else heard of the Mittanean empire?  I  have read about it only once and I wondered if it is known by another name typically. It Existed as a contemporary of the Hittite empire around the mid second century B.C. and survived for about 300 years. It eventually became a vassal state of the Hittites and was destroyed along with that people during the invasions of the "Sea Peoples" They were an Indo-European People who spoke a dialect of Sanskrit, and worshiped many Indo-Aryan dieties..

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  Quote Imperator Invictus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2004 at 18:41
Originally posted by warhead

Khakhan, what Zeng empire is this? You've said it was in southwest china? Southwest China at the time is ruled by Dali guo which had all of Yunnan and Guei Zhou, and its a kingdom not an empire. Is this Zeng a tribe?


Yeah I never got this figured out. Apparantly, Sharukin (IIRC) said it was african kingdom, but I found some strange map that had it in South East asia (judging the boundaries, it would be about the same time as the Sung Dynasty). However, I can't find this map on the web anymore. I'm also aware that that "Zeng" also appears in the names of various chinese states.
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  Quote Quetzalcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2004 at 19:23

No, the "Gallic" Empire, as it was called, was rebel Roman state consiting of the provinces of Britian, Gaul and Spain that broke away from the Empire during the Barracks Emperors period (3rd century). The Palmyrene Empire, which conquered most of Rome's Eastern Provinces, also existed at the same time. The Gallic Empire survived after the death of its first Emperor, but declined when Spain returned itself back to Rome and loss of some territory to Roman Reconquest until Emperor Aurelian's Reconquest of the entire lost territories.

 Ok, I thought it was Gaul empire too, which couldn't be right since Gaul was only a region with many warring tribes. First time I heard of the Gallic empire though,now I understand why they sometime refer to us french as Gallic. And what the origin of the word Gallic? In french, we call the Welsh as Gallois and the country as Galle does it have something to do with the celts in any case.

 

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  Quote ihsan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Sep-2004 at 02:46

The Celts of Central Anatolia were called Galat and the regions around Ancyra were named Galatia.

Really, is there a connection between the names Kelt and Gal.

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  Quote Jagatai Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Sep-2004 at 09:15

The Celts of Central Anatolia were called Galat and the regions around Ancyra were named Galatia.

Yes the Celts lived in Anatolia and last year their death bodies were found by Turkish archeologs.

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