Originally posted by Nagyfejedelem Sorry, I'm not Nazy. The (Hungarian) history was my teacher. About my family: my grandfather, an state officiar�protect hundreds of Jews against Nazis during the II. WW. After the war he was imprisoned two times (!) and lost his job. (The reason�is not intresting: he was accused he was an American spy, it was a tipical communist reason.) One week after he became free he died because torturing. The denunciator was his Jewish co-worker (why, I don't know), and the sadist prison quards were mainliy Jews. My other grandfather (and his wife) lost his house, and the aninvited guest was a Jewish member of the Communist Party. Nagyfejedelem is my new name. Please, not delete my two notices.

First of all. I didn't call you a Nazi, but stated that this kind of Anti-Semite rumours are identical to those you could hear in Germany when the Nazis started persecuting and murdering the Jewish population In Europe.
If you would care to study the history of the Jewish communities in Europe, you will find that there were very good reasons, why they were over-represented both in the finacial world and amongst the intelligentia of European countries. And these reasons have nothing to do with their religion, but with the nature of Anti-Semite persecution through the ages.
The reason, why there were so many Jewish people in Communist parties all over Europe is derived from the fact the Jewish people had been opressed for 2000 years. Contrary to all anti-Semite propaganda, the vast majority of Jewish people in Europe were extremely poor and as exploited as their Christian neighbours, and thus adopted Socialism as a possible strategy to get out of their misery. They same can be said for Jewish intellectuals.
The fact that you're family encountered so many Jewish people, if this should be true at all and not just some anecdotal and exaggerated evidence, is explainable, but on the whole inconsequential. You might as well state that your grandfather's prisonguards were all over 1.70m or most of them had brown eyes.
Secondly, your second post only confirms my fears, it's just the typical Anti-Semite rumour mill. We've heard it all before, it was racial hatred then and it still is.

Komnenos wrote:

'The reason, why there were so many Jewish people in Communist parties all over Europe is derived from the fact the Jewish people had been opressed for 2000 years.'

Jews migrated into Eastern Europe from Western Europe, where they were opressed. Hungarian kings and governments protect Jews against Anti-Semitism. In Hungary Jews had never been opressed except II. WW.

And Jews were not opressed in Hungary during the communism. In other communist countries Jews were enemies, but in Hungary most of the communists were Jewish.

It's very intresting. Poor Jews were opressed all over the world.

About Georg Lukacs: he was an intelligent officiar of the Soviet Republic of Hungary in 1919 controlled by Bela Kun (his original name was Kohn, Kun means Cumanian), and communism was a terrorist regime, as you know. (I told about my family.) So, innocent men and women near River of Tisza was killed because Lukacs cruel orders. Lukacs escaped into Germany of Weimar from Hungary and spoke and wrote versus the regime after defeat communism.

Most of the communist were Jews, as I wrote. There was a joke in Budapest at the same time of Soviet Republic: Sandor Garbai, the Reformed Hungarian man was a member of the communist government because he was necessary of writing death-sentences in Saturday.

Komnenos:

Here is a little help from your friends. This is a quick searching on the topics of Hungary and anti-semitism.

Nag's entry reminds me of anti-semitic propaganda too. It embodies the principal giving out half-lies and protraying the Jewish people as the monsters in a historical fairy tale.

Nag's greatest omission in his account is that there was anti-semitic activity carried out by the government from WWI to WWII.

Let's remember his claims about Hungary's history of anti-semitism.

I'm Hungarian and in my homeland the rule of Jews is intolerable. Jews migrated into Hungary mainly at the end of the 19th century, after the Austrian-Hungarian compromise of 1867. Hungarian governments protect Jews instead of Hungarians.

Jews migrated into Eastern Europe from Western Europe, where they were opressed. Hungarian kings and governments protect Jews against Anti-Semitism. In Hungary Jews had never been opressed except II. WW. And Jews were not opressed in Hungary during the communism. In other communist countries Jews were enemies, but in Hungary most of the communists were Jewish.

How about the Blood libel incident in Tiszaeszlar in 1882?

Or the anti-Jewish economic legislation in Hungary in 1938?
http://www.jafi.org.il/education/antisemitism/nf/history.htm l

You also failed no mention the cooperative relationship that Hungary had during the 1930 with the Axis.

In fact, it began to participate in WWII in the 1941 as an Axis member.

http://www.feldgrau.com/a-hungary.html


Here is a description of Hungary after WWI. It doesn't sound like the tolerant heaven that you describe.

A militantly anticommunist authoritarian government composed of military officers entered Budapest on the heels of the Romanians. A "white terror" ensued that led to the imprisonment, torture, and execution without trial of communists, socialists, Jews, leftist intellectuals, sympathizers with the Karolyi and Kun regimes, and others who threatened the traditional Hungarian political order that the officers sought to reestablish. Estimates placed the number of executions at approximately 5,000. In addition, about 75,000 people were jailed. In particular, the Hungarian right wing and the Romanian forces targeted Jews for retribution. Ultimately, the white terror forced nearly 100,000 people to leave the country, most of them socialists, intellectuals, and middle-class Jews. In 1920 and 1921, internal chaos racked Hungary. The white terror continued to plague Jews and leftists, unemployment and inflation soared, and penniless Hungarian refugees poured across the border from neighboring countries and burdened the floundering economy. The government offered the population little succor. In January 1920, Hungarian men and women cast the first secret ballots in the country's political history and elected a large counterrevolutionary and agrarian majority to a unicameral parliament. Two main political parties emerged: the socially conservative Christian National Union and the Independent Smallholders' Party, which advocated land reform. In March the parliament annulled both the Pragmatic Sanction of 1723 and the Compromise of 1867, and it restored the Hungarian monarchy but postponed electing a king until civil disorder had subsided. Instead, Miklos Horthy (1920-44)--a former commander in chief of the Austro-Hungarian navy--was elected regent and was empowered, among other things, to appoint Hungary's prime minister, veto legislation, convene or dissolve the parliament, and command the armed forces. Horthy appointed Pal Teleki prime minister in July 1920. His right-wing government set quotas effectively limiting admission of Jews to universities, legalized corporal punishment, and, to quiet rural discontent, took initial steps toward fulfilling a promise of major land reform by dividing about 385,000 hectares from the largest estates into smallholdings.

http://www.onwar.com/aced/data/hotel/hungary1919b.htm
More info:
http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/article.php?lang=en&ModuleId=100054 57

Now, this doesn't mean that Hungary has a long history of anti-semitism. On the contrary, Hungary seems to have been a place where Jews enjoyed little persecution. Many of these same sources describe how Hungary passed equality legislation for the Jews in the 1860s, and how popular anti-semitism wasn't reported until the WWII post war years.

http://www.jafi.org.il/education/identity/3-13.html

You judge by yourselves. I think that Komnenos was right when he identified the biased account of Nagyfejedelem as anti-semitic propaganda.

About Tiszaeszl�r: the opposition wanted to a libel action against Jews people, but the liberal government protected Jews and forbit the Anti-Semit demonstrations orgonised by opposition. Jews were accused and not oppresed.

White terror was the consequence of red terror. Do you know about 'Hungarian' Soviet Rebublic in 1919? The communists --mainly Jews--killed 600 Hungarians. After that was the white terror, and one thousand communists and Jews were killed. Elek F�nyes, a Hungarian left-handed publicist also wrote that 1k communists and Jews were killed. But Vilmos B�hm, a socialist lesder wrote about 5000, and this number was bigger than 1000...

The 'gold age' had other consequens. Mainly Jews imployer were employed. Universities admit mainly Jews. Regularly more than the percentage of Jews in Hungary. Christian Hungarians had no chance whatever. After defeating communism goverment restricted number of Jews in universities. (This act was called 'Numerus Classus', Closed Number.) The Jews positions in economic and financial power were not limited. Few years later this law was deleted.

In 1938 goverment reguleted positions of Jews. Jewish people may be employed in the economical and cultural sphere until 20 percent. It sounds comic, but it was the most liberal and democratic 'act of Jews' in Europe. The percentage of Jews were under 20 percent, about 5 percent, so it was a good act for Jews. (Nowadays it means the beginning of Holocaust.) After that Hungarian extremers and Hitler became angry with Hungary because it's law.

It still sickens me of how there is still anti-semitism in the west. I always hope that someday the west will stop this very age-old practice

Old habits die hard.