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Topic: Persian names in Greece Posted: 27-Jul-2005 at 00:27 |
The only Greek name, that I'm aware of, that they use in Iran is
Alexander, pronounced "Eskandar." Do the Greeks use any Persian names
(like Darius, or Cyrus)? If so, how do they pronounce them? Just
curious.
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Yiannis
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Posted: 27-Jul-2005 at 04:19 |
Since Greeks were always pronouncing foreign names the way they liked and deemed easier for them and not the way they sounded in the native language, most of the names of ancient Persians, Egyptians, Skythians etc that we know are the way the Greeks pronounced them.
Coming back to your question, practically we pronounce ancient Persian names the way you see them in English (since they became known to the west from the Greek writers), with some minor differenciations.
E.g. Artaxerxes, Kyros (a friend of mine is married to a Persian lady and they named their son as Kyros - also an international Greek referee is named Kyros Vassaras), Dareios, Camvyses etc...
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Menippos
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Posted: 27-Jul-2005 at 05:56 |
Artaxerxis (stress on e), Xerxis (stress on e), Darios (stress on i),
Artafernis (stress on e), Ekvatana (stress on first a), Persis =
persian (stress on e), Persia (stress on i), Vavylon (stress on o),
Kyros (stress on y), Susa (stress on u), Mardonios (stress on first o),
Sardis (stress on a), Megabazos (stress on first a), Kamvysis (stress on y), Datis (stress on a).
And many other historical names.
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Posted: 27-Jul-2005 at 11:36 |
i think the only persian name used in greece today is Kyros
the italians use Dario and Cyrus
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Harry Potter
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Posted: 28-Jul-2005 at 19:47 |
Originally posted by hansel
i think the only persian name used in greece today is Kyros
the italians use Dario and Cyrus
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In Macedonia we use Dario too, and Kyros but without the greek S in the end
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Zagros
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Posted: 28-Jul-2005 at 20:20 |
the greek "s" is an adaption of the persian "sh" seems the further west one goes people get lazier with words.
also is "v" in greek pronounced like english "b"?
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Harry Potter
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Posted: 28-Jul-2005 at 21:45 |
and how the greeks pronounce the english "v"?
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Yiannis
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 04:01 |
Originally posted by Zagros Purya
also is "v" in greek pronounced like english "b"? |
In modern Greek, English B is pronounced as "mp", Greek letter "B" is equivalent in english as "V".
Some scholars maintain that in ancient Greek, B sounded like in today's modern English. Others disagree and it's quite difficult to ever know who's right and who's wrong.
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The basis of a democratic state is liberty. Aristotle, Politics
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Menippos
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 04:05 |
The latin sound "V" is pronounced as "V" in Greek but written as "B".
And the latin sound "B" is pronounced as "B" in Greek but slightly softer and written as "MP".
The reason for the difference is that in ancinet Greek, the sound "B"
did not exist. Thus they converted everything to the sound "V". But in
modern greek we have integrated the sound "B" by joining the sounds "M"
and "P" in to a diphthongue which roughly resembles "B", vocally. And
that is why it sounds a bit softer, because you can still notice the
slight separation of "M" and "P".
Edited by Menippos
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Zagros
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 07:31 |
Interesting, interesting.
In Spanish the V sounds like B, I thought it was the same in Greek, but it turns out to be the opposite.
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Yiannis
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 07:35 |
Thanks Menippe, for elaborating. As it turns out, you're much more eloquent than me!
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The basis of a democratic state is liberty. Aristotle, Politics
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Menippos
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 07:44 |
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Harry Potter
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Posted: 29-Jul-2005 at 22:43 |
Originally posted by Menippos
The latin sound "V" is pronounced as "V" in Greek but written as "B". And the latin sound "B" is pronounced as "B" in Greek but slightly softer and written as "MP". |
thanx mate, but I dont get one thing. In Xanthi plays one maco, Vance Sikov. his surname in greek was written Sikof, with "F" instead "V" and in macedonian sound "V" is like the latin "V" so in greek should be Sikob, right?
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Macedonian swear in 1903 wars: With the blood we shed all over Macedonian fields and forests, we serve freedom, as the Macedonian army of Alexander of Macedon did, with our slogan Freedom or Death!
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Menippos
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Posted: 31-Jul-2005 at 17:50 |
Sikov is a slavic sounding name.
In Greece (thanks to the Germans) we have the mistaken idea that all
names ending in -ov and -ev, like Kasparov and Brezniev are pronounced
as -of and -ef.
As far as B and V are concerned, in Greek, the sound V sounds like V.
But it is written with the letter B. Just like in Cyrillic. So, in
Greek, the name Sikov is written ΣΙΚΟΒ, as in Cyrillic is CNKOB
(inverse the N, I don't have Cyrillic alpabet installed). And all are
pronounced SIKOV.
Solved?
Edited by Menippos
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Harry Potter
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Posted: 31-Jul-2005 at 20:10 |
yes, thanx
so in greek is U, in cyrillic is YIKOB
Y - sh (no greek sound for that )
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Macedonian swear in 1903 wars: With the blood we shed all over Macedonian fields and forests, we serve freedom, as the Macedonian army of Alexander of Macedon did, with our slogan Freedom or Death!
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Harry Potter
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Posted: 31-Jul-2005 at 20:19 |
one more think Im interested in, u havo 2 "O"s, "O" and "". What is the defference?
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Macedonian swear in 1903 wars: With the blood we shed all over Macedonian fields and forests, we serve freedom, as the Macedonian army of Alexander of Macedon did, with our slogan Freedom or Death!
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Menippos
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Posted: 01-Aug-2005 at 03:11 |
Nowadays "o" (omicron) and "w" (omega) are indiscernible vocally. But
in the older times the difference was that "o" was short (thus o-micron
= o-small) and "w" was long (thus o-mega = o-big).
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Istor the Macedonian
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Posted: 05-Aug-2005 at 18:00 |
Macedonians had and have Greek Language. That's why they called the
city Thessaloniki as no Slav could ever call it. No Slavic language has
the sound th(eta) as in "thing". That's why Slavs (including
SlavoSkopians) call the city as Solun.
Istor
Ethnic Macedonians were always Greeks
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Perseas
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Posted: 06-Aug-2005 at 06:52 |
Greeks had a tedency to regularize foreign names. As far as your question about Persian names here are some examples...
- The name Artaxerxes is the regularization of the original Persian name Artakhshathra.
- The name Xerxes is the regularization of the original Persian name Khshayarsha.
- The name Darius from the regularization of the old Persian name Drayawu.
Even the name of the famous Indian founder of the Mauryan empire Chandragupta was regularised from Greeks into Sandracottus.
Note: All these regularised foreign names like the ones above have no meaning in Greek but reading the last post, i have to say all Macedonian names like Alexandros and Phillipos are completely meaningful in greek in their original forms therefore there was no need anyone to regularize them.
And the answer is very simple: Because all the Macedonian names were originally Greek.
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Harry Potter
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Posted: 07-Aug-2005 at 20:57 |
Originally posted by Istor the Macedonian
Macedonians had and have Greek Language. That's why they called the city Thessaloniki as no Slav could ever call it. No Slavic language has the sound th(eta) as in "thing". That's why Slavs (including SlavoSkopians) call the city as Solun.
Istor Ethnic Macedonians were always Greeks
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Macedonian swear in 1903 wars: With the blood we shed all over Macedonian fields and forests, we serve freedom, as the Macedonian army of Alexander of Macedon did, with our slogan Freedom or Death!
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