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Vandals" - a character assassination

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Komnenos View Drop Down
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  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Vandals" - a character assassination
    Posted: 02-Dec-2005 at 01:48
Originally posted by pakeray

We get the word 'criminal' from the Crimeans (Cimmerians) of the Ukraine. 'Brigand' comes from the Brigantes tribe of Britain. 'Viking' means 'pirate'. Sacae (the root word for 'Scythian') means 'robber'. I read somewhere that 'barbarian' comes from Berbers and the Barbary Coast (most say it comes from the Greek 'bar-bar'.). I read that 'Tatar' comes from 'Tartarus'.'Germ' might come from Germans.'Hunger' might come from Huns. I think much of this could have come from the Romans who often described the 'barbarians' of Europe and other places in an unfavorable way.



The endless joys of etymology, many a long winter evening will just fly, when you play guessing games.

Germ does not come from "German", but from the Latin "germen", to sprout, to bud.
Crime does not come from "Crimeans" ( ) but from the Latin "crimen", meaning offense.
Hunger from the old Germanic word "*khungrus",meaning the same, long before the Huns were around.
Viking from the Old Norwegian "vikingr", meaning someone who comes from the fjords.
Anymore?
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  Quote Quetzalcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Dec-2005 at 21:13

 

 Funny how some would accuse the Vandals of savagery, but nothing is said about romans tyranny except as a civilising force. The Gauls of Brennus and the vandals were altar boys compared to the savagery of the romans. The romans were more systematic and radical in their way of making warfare. I've always hated the roman, the best that had ever happed to France is the invasion of the Franks, otherwise France would have always been in the shadow of oppressive romans.

 

 Did France need rome? Definitely not, the Gauls and Franks had mastery of metal than romans didn't possess. They just needed better organisation for warfare.



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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Dec-2005 at 21:27
Originally posted by Quetzalcoatl

 

 Funny how some would accuse the Vandals of savagery, but nothing is said about romans tyranny except as a civilising force. The Gauls of Brennus and the vandals were altar boys compared to the savagery of the romans. The romans were more systematic and radical in their way of making warfare. I've always hated the roman, the best that had ever happed to France is the invasion of the Franks, otherwise France would have always been in the shadow of oppressive romans.

I agree

 Did France need rome? Definitely not, the Gauls and Franks had mastery of metal than romans didn't possess. They just needed better organisation for warfare.

Well Rome did have a number of technologies not possessed by the Gauls thanks to their Mediterannean position. The level of public works and legal development was another thing the Gauls simply couldn't compete with compared to Rome.

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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Dec-2005 at 16:15
I agree with the above. In recent discussions on the influence of Rome, it's been clear that Gaul and Britain were virtually the only beneficiaries of the "civilizating" influx of Rome, no matter how limited and opressive it may have been. The conclussion was more or less that the world hardly needed Rome but that Gaul and Britain did benefit in many aspects from its influx and that otherwise they would have remained marginal for longer probably. 

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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Dec-2005 at 06:44
I think we are finally coming to an agreement over the Rome thing. I think everyone benefitted from such an intellectual discussion, personally my perspective has certainly evolved. I would say it is more refined now.
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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2005 at 00:41
I have another etymology question which I am sure a certain member who happens to be fairly German may be able to answer. Do we get Bavaria from Barbaria? Are Bavarians named because they were considered barbarian? If not, where do they get such a name? Being partly of Bavarian stock myself, I wonder if perhaps these relentless scourges of Pax Romana might have resembled me just a little bit
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  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2005 at 05:54
Originally posted by Constantine XI

I have anotheretymology question which I am sure a certain member who happens to be fairly German may be able to answer. Do we get Bavaria from Barbaria? Are Bavarians named because they were considered barbarian? If not, where do they get such a name? Being partly of Bavarian stock myself, I wonder if perhaps these relentless scourges of Pax Romana might have resembled me just a little bit


The original name of this southern Germanic tribe was "Bajuwaren,Boiaren", and various others similar sounding terms. The Romans made "Bavarii" out of that and the name stuck.
In Germany itself, they called the "Bayern".

It's got nothing to do with "Barbarians" whatsoever, however if you have ever watched Bavarian folk music (Oompah with Lederhosen) on German TV, you might be excused of making that presumption.

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  Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2005 at 07:49
Does then the name Bavaria/Bayern come from the Celtic tribe of the Boii, like neighbouring Bohemia?

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  Quote Komnenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2005 at 13:35
Originally posted by Maju

Does then the name Bavaria/Bayern come from the Celtic tribe of the Boii, like neighbouring Bohemia?



There seems to be a theory circulating, that there is indeed a connection. However, it is a geographical, as the Bajuwares have alledgedly settled Southern Germany coming from Bohemia, and not a ethnical, as there seems no doubt that the core of the tribe was Germanic, possibly with some Slavic elements acquired on their way through South-East Central-Europe.
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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Dec-2005 at 17:24
this is difficult. the area inhabited by Bavarians today was first inhabited by Rugians, then they either renamed or were replaced by Bajuwars (never heard Boyars before, Boyars are Russian nobles...). and Rugians/Bajuwars never really major clashes with Rome, if any at all... I think i also once heard a theory that Bajuwar comes from Awars (Baj-awars) but i think this is just another wordplay...
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  Quote Nagyfejedelem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Dec-2005 at 11:59
I know about this malicious etymology. Hungarians were hungry after a German chronicler, Slavs were slaves, Avars were avaricious (avarus) after a Frankish chronicler, Hungarians called Germans 'nmet', it meant dumb.
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