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do the sogdians still exist as a people?

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  Quote maersk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: do the sogdians still exist as a people?
    Posted: 05-Jul-2005 at 22:09

i think ancient sogdiana covered modern turkmenistan and uzbekistan, are there still people who claim sogdian descent there? or have they been wiped out? i know that they had a strong presence in china throughout the tang dynasty and into the song, but then they where slaughtered by an emperor who hated them in northern china sometime in the song dynasty. was that the end of them?

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  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jul-2005 at 22:17
Damn, what a coinsidence.  I was just going to make a post about the Sogdians right now.  I'll just use your post, first off, I don't think they still do exist, I'm sure they've been assimliated into the areas you just mentioned.  Now for my question, I've heard that Turkish has derived from the Sogdian language, is this true?  If so, please give me some links, I also need to show someone else the sources that claim this.  Thank you.
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  Quote Kenaney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jul-2005 at 13:59
did sogdians live in area where Russia is? Then ask to Baracuda he knows some stuff i think...
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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jul-2005 at 15:06

Sogdians lived in Transoxania.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jul-2005 at 18:49

The descendants of Sogdians still exist. In fact, a big population in Semerkand and Bukhara are Iranic people. Some of them still keep their languages alive. Also Tajiks can also be some of their descendants.

And Turkish language wasnt derived from Sogdian. Sogdian is a IE language and Turkish is Ural Altaic. But the Uighur script was derived from Sogdian alphabet once. Today's Mongolian alphabet is loaned from Uygurs.

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  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jul-2005 at 22:43
Originally posted by Oguzoglu

The descendants of Sogdians still exist. In fact, a big population in Semerkand and Bukhara are Iranic people. Some of them still keep their languages alive. Also Tajiks can also be some of their descendants.

And Turkish language wasnt derived from Sogdian. Sogdian is a IE language and Turkish is Ural Altaic. But the Uighur script was derived from Sogdian alphabet once. Today's Mongolian alphabet is loaned from Uygurs.

Yea I know Mongols use the old Uygur script, and I remember hearing that that Uygur script came from the Sogdian.  I guess I forgot it was just the Uygur script and not the Turkish language, thanks.

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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2005 at 16:02
Soghdians were Iranic? but they were not a Sakae tribe, thats sure...
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  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2005 at 16:59
Originally posted by Temujin

Soghdians were Iranic? but they were not a Sakae tribe, thats sure...
I might want to give some information here, but I'm afraid that this thread might turns into another nationalistic topic that I wouldn't participate in.
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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jul-2005 at 17:14

well, I always thought Sogdians were a people on their own, Indo-European but not precisely Indo-Iranian...

and don't worry, in case this thread runs out of control i'll close it...

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  Quote Hushyar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jul-2005 at 00:42

Soghdians were Iranic people and their language was considered as northeastern branch of Iranic language. there is a vast amount of litreature in soghdian language.

Moqhadasi famous geographer of 10th century said that Soghdians are assimilated by Dari (modern persian )language.

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  Quote heyamigos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Aug-2012 at 05:59
Many Uygurs and Uzbeks are descended from this people.  They just lost their language and mixed a little bit with eastern races
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Aug-2012 at 14:54
Uygurs are Chinese, no? Wen a people lose their language they lose their culture too - culture is hold by language.
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  Quote heyamigos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Aug-2012 at 18:29
^African-Americans lost their original African languages, but many aspects of their culture testify to an African origin: vocal singing (rap/hip hop derived from African verbal history telling, certain foods like rice, watermelon, okra, frying of the food, etc.)
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2012 at 02:00
Yes, but they call themselves ""African Americans", not by the names of their riginal tribes, no? The Pomaks on the balkans lost their language and religion to Turkish and Islam and consider themselves Turkish, not from the nation they live in.

So certain elements in teh culture can only show the original roots of it, but it;s not anymore that culture per se. So we can possibly say ""The Uygurs have Sogdian roots"/if this is so, which I don't know, I thought they are Chinese/, but not that they are Sogdians-still-in-exstence.

To have a claim on a cultureral continuation one has to have langauge to back it  - like the Greeks, Indians, Chinese have. Otherwise I could claim that I'm an ancient Thracian, with some Thracian words and customs still in existence in the modern Bulgarian culture - but it wouldn't be right to do so.
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  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2012 at 02:52
Just imagine if you wake up tomorrow morning without the ability to think or speak English, which is to say you do not remember English at all when you wake up tomorrow, this being for those people from cultures speaking that language, is your culture somehow magically gone? Somehow I don't think so.
What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture.
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  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2012 at 15:00
I think that the Mongolian written language derived from the Uyrgur language.
What a handsome figure of a dragon. No wonder I fall madly in love with the Alani Dragon now, the avatar, it's a gorgeous dragon picture.
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Sep-2012 at 15:24
I culture is transferred by it's language - all he books people read to make there persona space iin tihis culture are written on it; and if the language is gone, this cultural accumulation is unaccessible, hence for all practical purposes - gone.

In reality when a cuture is assimilated by another, this always happens by the losing and chnaging t's language, accapting the language and with it the culture of other people. When this process happens in full, the  culture in quiestion is not anymore the fisrt version, but the second.

For example, when the Ancient Thracians got assimilated culturaly by Slavs and Bulgars, they culturally stopped being Thracians anymore, and the old Thracian customs started being interpreted in other terms, in the cultural terms of the new culture - Slavic/Bulgarian. Even though the modern Bulgarins are genetically predominantly Mediterranean /Thracian, in other words, with less Slavic and Bulgar clades than the ones of the local Thracian people/ they are not by any means Thracians, because the old Thracian cultre got lost together with it's language.

The same, as I understand, is the case of the Sogdianians - if they became Uygurs, with a Chinese language instead of with Indo-European, and through intermarriage they got the genotype and phenotype of the Synitic people, they are not anymore Iranians/Indo-Europeans, but Chinese.
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  Quote hasan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Mar-2015 at 11:42
Yeh, Sure it`s notable to speak about Sogdians dynasties & existing of their peoples. I`m one of Sogdiani man & I have speak clear and entirely with my native Language.With proudly I say  I`m Sogdians descendent  becauce we are kept  firmly  our real language, history,culture,civilizations  but onely we have not  our own & unit country (state) by name of Sogdian. It`s praiseworthy to be  Sogdiani and  I wont write much on this themes .I give  you concisely information:  The amount of  main population of Sogdians which speaks by that more 50000 peoples except  which losted their native tongue but said  I`m Sogdian.
 Location of  our settlement & living-place  Republic of Tajikistan, Soghd province, Zafarabad district rural of H.Aliev & vally of (Yagnob) 
Entrested 
Feel free to contact with me (it is temporily in forum I`ll spend  my more time in e-mail )
My mail: Azizmurodh@mail.ru
Facebook: Azizmurod  Husenov
date:26.03.2015y


Edited by hasan - 25-Mar-2015 at 11:46
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  Quote Druzhina Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Mar-2015 at 04:29
Here are some pictures of Sogdians and their costumes:

Sogdian murals from Panjikent


A Sogdian Mortuary Couch, Bas Relief, Northern Qi dynasty, A.D. 550-577.
At least nine stone slabs were once part of an elaborate stone couch (shichuang), a rare type of burial furniture used for the repose of the deceased, carved with an unusual combination of Buddhist and secular themes.


A Sogdian split tapestry (kilim) coat with animal motifs, Central Asia, 9th/10th Century


A Dish showing soldiers in winged helmets in combat, from post Sasanian Iran


Sogdian armoured cavalryman on a painted shield from Mug castle, eighth century.


MIRROR SITES
Sogdian murals from Panjikent
Sogdian murals from Panjikent

Druzhina
Illustrations of Costume & Soldiers
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  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Mar-2015 at 06:38
How does it sounds Panjikent in latin Druzina?!?
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