The Fall of Berlin, 1945

I just saw this WW2 documentary yesterday, spoke of Hitler, and mostly where his corpse was burried, somewhere in Magdeburg. So it also covered the basics of the history of the war like the massive Soviet offensive against fascist tyranny and opression. The documentary also stated that 2,5 million soldiers of the Red Army were storming towards Berlin. And then, to my astoundment, it mentioned 1,5 million Soviet casualties purely on the taking of the nazi capitol.

I have always imagined the defense of Berlin as a totally futile attempt by an army utterly demoralized and ripped of nazist illusions, but killing 1,5 million attackers can't be the act of an army i mentioned above, what was the case there? Am i just dumb on the matter of sieging and conquering cities during WW2, is the documentary faulty or was everything fine with such a casualty rate during WW2?

Actually the History Channel has some very nice stuff.  I don't know what you "mon-u-mentary came from.  But I have heard that that figure is correct, and it is quite possible.  Imagine street-to-street, house-to-house fighting with tanks rolling down the streets.  Pretty easy targets for any panzershrecks.  And with the knowledge that this was their last stand; don't underestimate the German army!

So what is the real figure?

http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/battles.htm:
Berlin, World War II (16 April-7 May 1945): 250 000

• Erickson, Barbarossa: The Axis and the Allies. Table 12.4 (USSR KIA): 78,291
• 30 May 2004 Washinton Post review of Inside Hitler's Bunker by Joachim Fest: Fest est. >300,000 Red Army soldiers died, contrasted by reviewer with Antony Beevor's est. (Fall of Berlin 1945) of 78,000 Soviet dead.
• Martin Sorge, The Other Price of Hitler's War (1986): 100,000 civilians d. incl. 20,000 cardiac arrest and 6,000 suicide. Not incl. 52,000 refugees k. caught in air raids. (citing Cornelius Ryan)
• Wikipedia
  • Soviet: 305,000 k.
  • German: 325,000 soldiers + civilians k.
• Some guy on Internet (Jason McDonald)
  • Soviet: 305,000 d.
  • German: 325,000, incl. civilians k.
• [I'm figuring 78T Soviets + 325T German deaths - 152T civilians]

Hmm

maybe different sources are talking about different definition the fall Berlin. Have seen a program on Discovery some months ago (can't remember the name of it) where they talked about 6 mil. Russians in attack towards Berlin, but this offensive was already launced in Jan. 45 from Mid-Poland with a frontline going south through Poland down into the Czech Republic - so a large frontline counting the entire northern part of the eastern front

Maybe the Russians lost 1.5 mil men from Jan 45 to the end of Berlin, and from these 1.5 mil they lost 300.000 in the final attack into the streets of Berlin?

 

One should absolutely watch the movie Der Untergang in order to have a clue about what a downfall means.!

Soviet losses were huge in Berlin, I do know that the Soviets lost more men taking Berlin than the total combined military and civilian deaths of the UK  in "the entire war" 

Edited by aghart

Around 300,000 DEAD yes, the total casualty figure could very well be at or even over one million if we accept a reasonable 3:1 or 4:1 ratio of wounded to dead. Red Army's tactics were atrocious with complete disregard for the life of the soldier. Urban warfare is also more costly in lives by definition. I should mention that these figures cover not only the Battle for Berlin itself but also the period leading right up to it, from the moment the Russians crossed the Oder to the final days and the fall in May.  

Originally posted by sovietsniper the red army made the same mistakes at berlin as the germans did at stalingrad. they sent in tanks thought aircraft could do all the work ect

Many sources, when they use the word 'casualty', it combines the soldiers killed and wounded. 

1.5 million casualties? (dead and wounded)  Probably on the high end.  I would take the 300.000 killed and multiply that by 2.5.  Remember, in the eyes of the Soviet Commanders, the siege of Berlin wasn't really a siege.  It was a race.  Who could get to the Reichstag the fastest.