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Question on the Magyars

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  Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Question on the Magyars
    Posted: 18-Jun-2005 at 11:51

During the the 10th century the Vikings were ravaging Europe by sea and Magyars by land. My question is that were the Magyars a Turkic people or were they more related to the Scythians and Khazars??

This site that i found says that they were indeed Turkic but ive been to Hungary and i havent seen anyone looking Turkic at all. In fact most of them look rather German. I guess people in the villages might look different i only stayed in Budapest. Here's the site by the way http://www.hunmagyar.org/turan.html

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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Jun-2005 at 12:17
they're originally Finno-Ugric mixed with few Turkic.
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  Quote Kenaney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Jun-2005 at 14:07
maybe they look different its because they mixed with mostly germans but they use still the old Turkic names. Like Atilla, emre, borte, turan etc
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Jun-2005 at 17:22

Scythians are a mix of Turkic and Iranic people, and the Khazars are Turkic too.

Magyars are Finno Ugric people, who belong to the same linguistic group with Turks (Ural Altaic). But "Hungars", the original word "Ongogur" or "Onoguz" were certainly from Turkic origins. Today, they are very mixed with the local populations of Europe, but it doesnt matter, if they speak Turkish, if they still have a Turkic culture and still call themselves Turks, they are Turks.

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  Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Jun-2005 at 21:46
and Finnish people are Turks as well then??











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  Quote Kalevipoeg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Jun-2005 at 02:20
Yes, Estonians, Finnish and Hungarians, the only free Finno-Ugrians today. I think the Hungarians are more related to the Turks due to their closer interactions with them (i think they had interactions ), and something like that. But were they really Turkic-like beofre the Ottoman invasion of Europe, i mean, where did they actually live before migrating to Europe, probably the same areas the other Finno-Ugrians - near the Urals. But they don't look like Turkic people, on the other hand, their language doesn't resemble much Finno-Ugrian, maybe living among Slavs, Turks and other nations and ethnicities altered their language and culture too much.
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  Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Jun-2005 at 11:34
yes it seems like a very difficult language to learn
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  Quote Degredado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Jun-2005 at 14:59
I don't know about races, but I do know that Finno-Ugrian is a language family that is as distinct from turkish as it is from Indo-European. It is suggested that the ancestors of the Magyars left their original homelands (God knows where) and adopted the life-styles of the steppe peoples. This means influence from turks and iranics. They formed an alliance which included one or two turkic tribes. Then they moved on to Hungary.
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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Jun-2005 at 17:44

Magyars were not Turkic and are not Turkic, they have a Turkic element because they were subjects of the Khazar Turks when they were still in Russia and they apparently had a Turkic ruling elite but thats it.

 

and I make one thing clear now, any further post that claims Steppe people x or y (like Scythians or Hungarians are Turkic or whatever) and i go on a post deleting rampage and if it still doesn't stop i go on a banning rampage, I'm like soooooooo sick of that dumb Turkic this Turkic that blabla I will give no quarter in the future, this is my only warning, you have read this as you have already posted in this thread and you know who i'm talking to!

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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jun-2005 at 05:28

 

Well this is a difficult question. Accoding to the anthropology researches of Blint Hman the finno-ugrian peoples were different kind of people from the beginning. This is only a language group. The magyars were ethnically mixed when they arrived to the Carpathian Basin. The Hungarian Tribal federation was also consisted turkic and iraninan people. It is likely that the social elit was bilingual. They spoke magyar and some turkic dialect. (Giving turkic names was common. For example: Zoltn(=sultan) or Vajk(=bey)) In byzantine sources Hungary appears as Turkia.

In Hungary the magyars mixed with the native and immigrant people. (slavs, late avars, germans etc.) (Don't forget, nearly half of the population was killed by the mongol invasion or by the famine after it.)

Personally I know that among my ancestor were slovaks, germans, and cumans (and naturally magyars  ).



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  Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jun-2005 at 15:54
Originally posted by Temujin

Magyars were not Turkic and are not Turkic, they have a Turkic element because they were subjects of the Khazar Turks when they were still in Russia and they apparently had a Turkic ruling elite but thats it.

and I make one thing clear now, any further post that claims Steppe people x or y (like Scythians or Hungarians are Turkic or whatever) and i go on a post deleting rampage and if it still doesn't stop i go on a banning rampage, I'm like soooooooo sick of that dumb Turkic this Turkic that blabla I will give no quarter in the future, this is my only warning, you have read this as you have already posted in this thread and you know who i'm talking to!

the site that i posted in the opening claims that they are ... they claim that the magyars are one of the two branches of the scythians with the Huns being the others but i doubt it. They relate this to a legend concerning two sons of a Scythian king. One was called Mago and the other Hunno. After they went on a hunt they pursued the deer so long that they decided they would move their respective peoples where they killed it. So the people of Mago were called Magyars and Hunno .. Huns. A nice little bedtime story

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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2005 at 03:47

Vulkan02:

That's an anti-trianon, nationalist page. I would not take it seriously.

"One was called Mago and the other Hunno"

Hunor and Magor. According to historians the name Hunor refers to the onogurs, not the huns.

A Picure from the Illuminated Chronicle:

 

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  Quote baracuda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2005 at 04:09
Originally posted by Temujin

Magyars were not Turkic and are not Turkic, they have a Turkic element because they were subjects of the Khazar Turks when they were still in Russia and they apparently had a Turkic ruling elite but thats it.



and I make one thing clear now, any further post that claims Steppe people x or y (like Scythians or Hungarians are Turkic or whatever) and i go on a post deleting rampage and if it still doesn't stop i go on a banning rampage, I'm like soooooooo sick of that dumb Turkic this Turkic that blabla I will give no quarter in the future, this is my only warning, you have read this as you have already posted in this thread and you know who i'm talking to!



Turkish claims are about as true as the ones that you think are true, in fact they are more viable than the current existant 'theories' of steppe peoples as they are based on archeology so its pretty ignorant to say otherwise... plus its pretty annoying to see another moderator being so sided, and calling turks - dumb.
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  Quote Midas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2005 at 05:16
Magyars are coming from Huns... And Turks too... Yes they are not turkic; but difference between Magyars and Turks is same as Turks and Mongolians.
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  Quote Jagatai Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2005 at 09:32
And it is clear that they Have Turkish origin;because in the middle of the Europe,the affixes in Magyar language are added to words at the end of the word(like Turkish and don't like Indo-European languages) and their language resembles to Ural-Altaic languages.

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  Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2005 at 10:35
I dont think Hungarians would like to be known as Turks tho even though they might have some similarities with the Turks
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  Quote Murtaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jun-2005 at 10:42

Well mostly They dont like.

I dont see  any reason  for calling them Turk too. Our culture is different.

who care what happened 1500 years ago. If they dont want to call themself as Turk, they are not Turk.

 

 

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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Jun-2005 at 04:30

 

I must repeat myself. The magyars are not turks. We were culturaly influenced by turks, and assimilated some turk group, but we are definitely not turks. The turks were only one of those ethnic groups which mixed with us.

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  Quote Murtaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Jun-2005 at 05:29

Raider

what is the history of  magyar  people? I always think they are as a Turk.  But well I cannot know magyars better  than you.  So they are not Turk

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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Jun-2005 at 05:38

 

Murtaza:

Above I have already written a brief summary.

By the way there are some nationalist who still prefers the "warrior" turk origin instead of "the eskimos" (I am sorry Finnland.), but their opinion was falsificated yet in the end of the XIX. century.

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