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Mevlana;Turk or Persian?

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Poll Question: Was mevlana Turk or Persian?
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38 [62.30%]
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aknc View Drop Down
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  Quote aknc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Mevlana;Turk or Persian?
    Posted: 30-May-2005 at 08:04

???????I think he was turkish,or was he

"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
              
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  Quote Beylerbeyi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2005 at 09:50

Maybe he was ethnically a Turk, or a Mongol, whatever, it is irrelevant, he says so himself. His significance is in his philosophy and his poetry. His philosophy is actively anti-divisive (he would be disgusted by these little people trying to make him a Turk or a Persian).

On the other hand, by his poetry, he is obviously Persian. So it is better to call him a Persian poet, not necessarily meaning that he is of Persian ethnicity, but meaning that he is a poet of the Persian language. It is absurdly pathetic to call him a Turkish poet, because poetry is about language, and language only.

This fight over his 'ethnicity' is because some people are brainwashed by modern (western) ideas of racial purity and ethno-cultural nationalism. If you really want some of the credit for the Turks, you can say that he lived in Turkey, because the Turkish Sultanate of Rum, who were our ancestors, was a very enlightened place. Which was quite true. It also means that in terms of political identity he was a Turkish subject, just like the Azeris who are Turkics but politically Iranians. This (political) identity is, in many ways, more important than ethnic identity.   

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  Quote ramin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2005 at 11:37
why does it even matter...
"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
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  Quote Hushyar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2005 at 13:50

An old fashioned and boring problem.Last month I was in an Afghan Forum and all afghans believed that he was an Afghan because he was born in Balkh in modern day Afghanistan.

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  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2005 at 14:07
I'm Turkish but I believe he was a Persian by blood.  He might've accepted himself as a Turk but I think he was Persian.
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  Quote kroglu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2005 at 20:49

Turkman from Chorasan

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  Quote kroglu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2005 at 20:51
Originally posted by kroglu

Turkman from Chorasan

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  Quote aknc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 10:15

Originally posted by ramin

why does it even matter...

It doesn't,there was a heated discussion between land of aryan and some of our turkish members,so i thought i'd open a thread on it

"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
              
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  Quote Jazz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 14:01
Pardon my ignorance, but who is Mevlana??
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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 14:07

Pardon my ignorance, but who is Mevlana??

He is a Persian poet!

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  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 16:06

Originally posted by Jazz

Pardon my ignorance, but who is Mevlana??

Check this out, it'll explain who he is better.  http://www.mevlana.net/index.htm

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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Jun-2005 at 03:12

Rumi hasn't said it:

"Come, come again, whoever you are, come!
Heathen, fire worshipper or idolatrous, come!
Come even if you broke your penitence a hundred times,
Ours is the portal of hope, come as you are."

but:

"Baza baza, har ancheh hasti, bazay
Gar kafar o gabr o botparasti, bazay
In dargah-e ma dargah nomidi nist
Sad bar agar tobeh shekasti, bazay"

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  Quote Behrouz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Jun-2005 at 13:25
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri


"Baza baza, har ancheh hasti, bazay
Gar kafar o gabr o botparasti, bazay
In dargah-e ma dargah nomidi nist
Sad bar agar tobeh shekasti, bazay"




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  Quote aknc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 08:41

speaking the language does not make you persian

"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
              
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  Quote Murtaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 12:05

isnt it a little weird to choose nation of Mevlana by democracy?

By the way, Mevlana have Turkish poets too.

He even  write greek.

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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 15:48
As he himself says he was a lover and nothing else!
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  Quote baracuda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 15:58
What does it matter if he was a turk, a persian or an arab, it wont prove anything nor will it inferiorate anyone as the area was pretty much one nation in his time..
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  Quote Murtaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 16:07

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

As he himself says he was a lover and nothing else!

I think this is the best description of him. I am sure He prefered this  in stead of Turk or Persian.

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  Quote aknc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 16:09
Originally posted by aknc

Originally posted by ramin

why does it even matter...

It doesn't,there was a heated discussion between land of aryan and some of our turkish members,so i thought i'd open a thread on it

In reply to baracuda

"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
              
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jun-2005 at 06:27

Where is chorasan? You mean Khorasan? The population of Khorasan is six million, the highest estimate of Turkman in Iran is 1.4 million and not confined to Khorasan, a lot are still nomads, most of them have been  ever since they arrived in Iran, only urbanising or settling during theQajar period.  I highly doubt Rumi was ethnically Turkmen, if he was then his father's only language as a nomad would have been Turkmen and he would have been illiterate, not a scholar.

1207-73, great Islamic Persian sage and poet mystic, b. in Balkh. His father, a scholar, was invited by the Seljuk sultan of Rum to settle in Iconium (now Konya), Turkey. His apprenticeship as a Sufi mystic was guided by the mysterious Shams ad-Din Tabrizi (d. 1247), who was considered one of the spiritual masters of Rumi's age.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/r/rumi-j1al.asp

This isn't a conspiracy against the Turkish nation.

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