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aknc
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Topic: Mevlana;Turk or Persian? Posted: 30-May-2005 at 08:04 |
???????I think he was turkish,or was he
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"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
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Beylerbeyi
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 09:50 |
Maybe he was ethnically a Turk, or a Mongol, whatever, it is irrelevant, he says so himself. His significance is in his philosophy and his poetry. His philosophy is actively anti-divisive (he would be disgusted by these little people trying to make him a Turk or a Persian).
On the other hand, by his poetry, he is obviously Persian. So it is better to call him a Persian poet, not necessarily meaning that he is of Persian ethnicity, but meaning that he is a poet of the Persian language. It is absurdly pathetic to call him a Turkish poet, because poetry is about language, and language only.
This fight over his 'ethnicity' is because some people are brainwashed by modern (western) ideas of racial purity and ethno-cultural nationalism. If you really want some of the credit for the Turks, you can say that he lived in Turkey, because the Turkish Sultanate of Rum, who were our ancestors, was a very enlightened place. Which was quite true. It also means that in terms of political identity he was a Turkish subject, just like the Azeris who are Turkics but politically Iranians. This (political) identity is, in many ways, more important than ethnic identity.
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ramin
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 11:37 |
why does it even matter...
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"I won't laugh if a philosophy halves the moon"
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Hushyar
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 13:50 |
An old fashioned and boring problem.Last month I was in an Afghan Forum and all afghans believed that he was an Afghan because he was born in Balkh in modern day Afghanistan.
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Feramez
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 14:07 |
I'm Turkish but I believe he was a Persian by blood. He might've accepted himself as a Turk but I think he was Persian.
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kroglu
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 20:49 |
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kroglu
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 20:51 |
Originally posted by kroglu
Turkman from Chorasan
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aknc
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Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 10:15 |
Originally posted by ramin
why does it even matter... |
It doesn't,there was a heated discussion between land of aryan and some of our turkish members,so i thought i'd open a thread on it
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"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
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Jazz
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Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 14:01 |
Pardon my ignorance, but who is Mevlana??
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Cyrus Shahmiri
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Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 14:07 |
Pardon my ignorance, but who is Mevlana?? |
He is a Persian poet!
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Feramez
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Posted: 01-Jun-2005 at 16:06 |
Originally posted by Jazz
Pardon my ignorance, but who is Mevlana?? |
Check this out, it'll explain who he is better. http://www.mevlana.net/index.htm
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Cyrus Shahmiri
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Posted: 02-Jun-2005 at 03:12 |
Rumi hasn't said it:
"Come, come again, whoever you are, come! Heathen, fire worshipper or idolatrous, come! Come even if you broke your penitence a hundred times, Ours is the portal of hope, come as you are."
but:
"Baza baza, har ancheh hasti, bazay Gar kafar o gabr o botparasti, bazay In dargah-e ma dargah nomidi nist Sad bar agar tobeh shekasti, bazay"
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Behrouz
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Posted: 02-Jun-2005 at 13:25 |
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri
"Baza baza, har ancheh hasti, bazay
Gar kafar o gabr o botparasti, bazay
In dargah-e ma dargah nomidi nist Sad bar agar tobeh shekasti, bazay" |
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aknc
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Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 08:41 |
speaking the language does not make you persian
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"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
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Murtaza
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Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 12:05 |
isnt it a little weird to choose nation of Mevlana by democracy?
By the way, Mevlana have Turkish poets too.
He even write greek.
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Cyrus Shahmiri
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Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 15:48 |
As he himself says he was a lover and nothing else!
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baracuda
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Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 15:58 |
What does it matter if he was a turk, a persian or an arab, it wont prove anything nor will it inferiorate anyone as the area was pretty much one nation in his time..
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Murtaza
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Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 16:07 |
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri
As he himself says he was a lover and nothing else! |
I think this is the best description of him. I am sure He prefered this in stead of Turk or Persian.
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aknc
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Posted: 03-Jun-2005 at 16:09 |
Originally posted by aknc
Originally posted by ramin
why does it even matter... |
It doesn't,there was a heated discussion between land of aryan and some of our turkish members,so i thought i'd open a thread on it
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In reply to baracuda
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"I am the scourage of god appointed to chastise you,since no one knows the remedy for your iniquity exept me.You are wicked,but I am more wicked than you,so be silent!"
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Zagros
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Posted: 05-Jun-2005 at 06:27 |
Where is chorasan? You mean Khorasan? The population of Khorasan is six million, the highest estimate of Turkman in Iran is 1.4 million and not confined to Khorasan, a lot are still nomads, most of them have been ever since they arrived in Iran, only urbanising or settling during theQajar period. I highly doubt Rumi was ethnically Turkmen, if he was then his father's only language as a nomad would have been Turkmen and he would have been illiterate, not a scholar.
1207-73, great Islamic Persian sage and poet mystic, b. in Balkh. His father, a scholar, was invited by the Seljuk sultan of Rum to settle in Iconium (now Konya), Turkey. His apprenticeship as a Sufi mystic was guided by the mysterious Shams ad-Din Tabrizi (d. 1247), who was considered one of the spiritual masters of Rumi's age.
http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/r/rumi-j1al.asp
This isn't a conspiracy against the Turkish nation.
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