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Topic ClosedTurkish Creation myths and Korea

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Turkish Creation myths and Korea
    Posted: 17-Oct-2005 at 19:21
Originally posted by Chinghiz

I think you may be a Korean, But you appear to lnow nothing about Dongyi as well.



Educate me then.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2005 at 05:19
Originally posted by Gubook Janggoon

Originally posted by Chinghiz

I think you may be a Korean, But you appear to lnow nothing about Dongyi as well.



Educate me then.


and i'm still waiting
Inson borki insonlarning naqshidir, inson borki hayvon undan yaxshidir
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2005 at 13:29
Originally posted by katulakatula

That's what I don't like about Koreans

Sorry for the late notice, but warning: potentially hateful ethnic/racial comment.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Oct-2005 at 06:21

there are koreans in uzbekistan, kazakistan, kyrgyzistan?

How did they come there?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Oct-2005 at 06:58
Originally posted by DayI

there are koreans in uzbekistan, kazakistan, kyrgyzistan?

How did they come there?

Koreans owed Russians money, they had none.So they sent human labour to repay the debt.

Jai Badri Vishal
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Oct-2005 at 07:01
Originally posted by katulakatula

Originally posted by DayI

there are koreans in uzbekistan, kazakistan, kyrgyzistan?

How did they come there?

Koreans owed Russians money, they had none.So they sent human labour to repay the debt.

Is this a potentially hateful ethnic/racial comment too Mr. Moderator.

Jai Badri Vishal
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Oct-2005 at 11:09
Originally posted by Gubook Janggoon

Originally posted by Chinghiz

I think you may be a Korean, But you appear to lnow nothing about Dongyi as well.



Educate me then.


There no such thing as Dong Yi, its basically propaganda that makes koreans, japanese and chinese seem like some lost caucasoids.  this nonsense is basically made up after several bodies were dug up from Linzi country, Shandong province, which were considered the closest skulls to caucasoids ever found in east asia.  Later people figure out that it was total BS.

The real Yi people were a group of then non chinese "barbarians" that inhabited the Shandong peninsula and had a southern culture and were assimilated very early by the zhou dynasty.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Oct-2005 at 16:57
Originally posted by katulakatula

Originally posted by katulakatula

Originally posted by DayI

there are koreans in uzbekistan, kazakistan, kyrgyzistan?

How did they come there?

Koreans owed Russians money, they had none.So they sent human labour to repay the debt.

Is this a potentially hateful ethnic/racial comment too Mr. Moderator.

In the immediate context there is nothing suggesting hate.  Your previous comment is blatantly obvious, however: you simply said you dislike Koreans.  You said there is something you dislike about Koreans, now you can argue that "it's not that I dislike Koreans, but something about them."  But that "something" is predicated to Koreans by implication, so in essence you were saying you dislike Koreans in parts.  But to dislike some entity (albeit collective) in part is to dislike that entity itself.



Edited by MengTzu


(Credit to Cwyr and Gubookjanggoon for first using the sloganizer.)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Oct-2005 at 03:43
Originally posted by MengTzu

Originally posted by katulakatula

Originally posted by katulakatula

Originally posted by DayI

there are koreans in uzbekistan, kazakistan, kyrgyzistan?

How did they come there?

Koreans owed Russians money, they had none.So they sent human labour to repay the debt.

 

Is this a potentially hateful ethnic/racial comment too Mr. Moderator.

In the immediate context there is nothing suggesting hate.  Your previous comment is blatantly obvious, however: you simply said you dislike Koreans.  You said there is something you dislike about Koreans, now you can argue that "it's not that I dislike Koreans, but something about them."  But that "something" is predicated to Koreans by implication, so in essence you were saying you dislike Koreans in parts.  But to dislike some entity (albeit collective) in part is to dislike that entity itself.

I'd like to narrate a real-life incident which happened a month earlier.I n a Pakistani guy {both of us don't have a visa} started working in a factory.The owner liked our work n fired 3 Koreans who'd been working there.After a few days one of the friends of the guys who'd been fired came to the factory {he was drunk} n attacked the Pakistani guy with a knife.

I guess in any other nation in the world that guy would have landed in a prison.Guess what happened???? Owner broke  headlights of the mobike that guy had left n ensured us that he had beaten him n he was in hospital.Next day me n the Pakistani guy got 6 pairs of shining white brand new UNDERWEAR..................................................WELCOME TO KOREA.

Jai Badri Vishal
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-Oct-2005 at 21:38

Even though you may have had genuinely bothersome experiences with your ethnic colleagues at work, I don't think this is the proper forum to vent your frustrations. Personal experiences are important in shaping  opinions but they are difficult to verify to us. Its not what this topic is about.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Nov-2005 at 01:58
Originally posted by DayI

there are koreans in uzbekistan, kazakistan, kyrgyzistan?

How did they come there?



They're called "Koryo" people and were moved there from the Russian Far East by Stalin in order to push down any chances of rebellion.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Nov-2005 at 09:52

Originally posted by katulakatula


50% of S Koreans r christians {1/2 of the population has converted very rapidly after their contact with the US}, n the new generation {most of whom I've met confess they have no religion}.


According to 2003 statistics compiled by the South Korean government, about 46 percent of citizens profess to follow no particular religion. Christians account for 27.3% of the population and Buddhists 25.3%

So when you say 50% of S Koreans, it's not 50% of the whole population but 50% of believers, only.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Nov-2005 at 10:26

they are many huge active missionaris (moon sect) out there, and there aim whas 50 % of the population till 2010.

Can we be on topic, or can someone add similarity's to Turkish creation myth and the Korean one?



Edited by DayI
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Nov-2005 at 11:06
Originally posted by DayI

they are many huge active missionaris (moon sect) out there, and there aim whas 50 % of the population till 2010.

Can we be on topic, or can someone add similarity's to Turkish creation myth and the Korean one?

Ya most of the discussions on AE go astray.Don't know why.

Jai Badri Vishal
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Dec-2005 at 05:03

You guys might find this quite interesting. Korean shaman is also called as 籼(Tangul). Shaman hold Tangun as his/her supreme being. Many historians found this tangul is the original word for Tangun.

Somebody mentioned of affinity between Korean and other altaic language. I do know that there should be a lot examples for such affinity.

gara, kara, qara - black in altaic language

- karamal - black horse

However, dominant word for 'black' is , (keom, kam). (kara) has changed its form to xeul (or heul) as in 帮(heulida). This is usually used in cloudy wheather.

 

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Dec-2005 at 07:33

i think the word "kara" is also used for cloudy places too.

I think you are little bit late arrived to this topic, the who did open this thread did leave and some others who knew something about this did also leave....

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-May-2006 at 16:35
Hi I am new to this forum. I am Korean and live in the US. I was very happy to come across this forum and read from so many well informed sources as I am interested in East Asian History. I studied European history during college and also took some courses on Tokugawa Japan, but it is only recently that I have become interested in Korean, East Asian history.
I agree that there are many similarities between Koreans and Turks. I found this out myself, even before I found out that Koreans and Turks consider each other brothers and that we share so many similiarities. I never knew any of this when I went to Turkey 5 years ago. I couldnt put my finger on it then, but when I went there, I found so many uncanny similarities. The national psyche, the machismo culture, the vibe I got, whatever it is, so reminded me of Koreans. When I was in Antalya and I talked to a 25 YO guy who was the nephew of the hotel owner and he talked about how he met his girl friend, he really reminded me of my favourite cousin and the way he would think and talk and act. I told him so.
It was only during the World Cup, that I found that Koreans and Turks considered each other similar and brothers. So since I found out the similiarites all by myself and only confirmed it later, I really think the idea that Turks and Koreans share similar identities must be somehow true. I dont have any hisorical facts to back this up, but the intuition is there. And I am glad of it. Because I respect the Turkish people and I consider them very similar to Koreans.

Now regarding the suspended Indian forum member....I lived 5 years in India when I was young. I will not make any personal comments about my impressions, but I have many non-Indian friends whom I met there and still keep in touch with. And I will talk about what they said to me. One time some years ago, one of these non-Indian friends who grew up there came to visit me in NY. We were shopping at an Indian owned/run store. As we were paying for our stuff at the counter, an Indian guy was scanning our shopping. The store is Indian owned and run. My friend whispered to me that he didn't trust Indians and so we should check our receipts. I never do this, but I did so that day. When I checked my receipt, I found that we had been charged for many items which were double scanned. My friend told me that Indians were cheats and that is why he wanted to check our receipts. So it is funny how the Suspended forum member said that Koreans were liars.

It is funny how he also said that Koreans idolize money. Another non-Indian friend of mine who lived in India and has a lot of dealings with them told me that Indians idolize money, have no honour and would even sell their own mothers for a little profit. So it is funny how the suspended Indian forum member accuses Koreans of idolizing money.
If the suspended Indian forum member hates Korea, why doesnt he leave? He doesnt have a visa, so he is illegal there (which is a form of lying and cheating) yet he will even go work at a factory to stay in a place he hates? Why? Is it for money or because he is a glutton for misery? Why lie and cheat just to stay in a place you hate?

He also started off topic negative comments about Koreans. Yet at first, all these were couched in seemingly innocuous comments and he even went as far as acting very friendly and polite by calling the moderator "Ahn nyeong Haseyo"etc etc. Why act so polite and friendly and all smiles if your hidden motivations and agenda are based on hatred? That to me sounds like lying, and underhanded devious conniving pretense... One of my non-Indian friends always says that Indians will smile and lie through their teeth and be friendly to you, but at the same time, have a knife hidden behind their backs with which to stab you in the back when you arent suspecting anything.
Further, the suspended Indian forum member lied and pretended that he never suffered any personal racism in Korea. He said that initially, yet later on, he admitted that he did suffer personal racism in the factory. Why lie? Is it the same defensiveness whch he accuses Koreans of being?
When I asked a non_indian friend of mine who lives very near India and has many dealings with them, why Indians are so arrogant, he told me it was because Indians have a chip on their shoulder.
The suspended Indian forum member accuses Koreans of being liars, defensive and money lovers. But all I have noticed on his part is that he is doing exactly all the things he accuses Koreans of. And he did that in a very devious and conniving way. Starting out by acting very polite and friendly and seemingly non threatening. Yet he was hiding all his true intentions behind couched words and politeness. He even went as far as using polite formal Korean words to address Korean forum moderators etc. That to me sounds exactly like what a friend told me. I was told that Indians are all smiles and honeyed words in front of you, but their true agendas are poison and they will back stab you.


Edited by Hando
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-May-2006 at 22:26

Welcome to AE, Hando.  You sound well traveled and genuine in curiocity.  I'm intrested to read what you can share about your experiences in different parts of the world you've lived/studied/traveled.  I hope you get as much as you can out of AE.  I personally find Gubook Jangoon very resourceful in East Asia forum.

Having said that, I have to admit I miss Jhangora and his other reincanations.  Don't get me wrong though, I do think some of his wordings were out of lines and moderators had to warn him and that just riled him up more.

But I do feel for the guy as I would for any migrant workers living/working under racism, less rights, less pays etc whether they are Central Americans in US or Muslems in Europe or an Indian in Korea.  Especially in such enthno centric country like Korea, it is not easy to find your comfort zone. 

It is an issue that Korea will face more and more as their economy and the population itself become more 'Globalized'. 

I read an article about Superbowl MVP Hines Ward visiting his motherland a couple of weeks ago.  The article mentioned growing migrant workers(mostly from SE Asia) and growing interracial marriges and births(up to 10% of new birth in a decade) in Korea.  Well, there are many Korean women who married US GIs and Korea used to be #1 orphan export country in the world(are they still?), but these are different kind of interracial marriages.  The birth rate in Korea are going down like other developed countries, but their patriatic tradition prefers sons over daughters.  So many Korean men have hard time finding brides and some of them will marry foreigners.  Koreans are also allowing half-blooded Koreans to serve in their military for the first time. 

About migrant workers in Korea; When Korea started its economic miracle it started out with 'Sweat Shops' even Hyundai or Samsung all started out of 'Textile' industry.  As their manufacturing tech developed through past decades and their labor movements and living standard improved, they have less population willing to work in sweat shop condition, they will need more migrant workforce.  Otherwise outsource.

Koreans are very proud to be a single race nation and I think it is something to be celebrated.  But as any good thing can be used in something synical, Korea's long standing tradition and pride can be used as an obsticle between Koreans and a nation growing out of them.  Migant worker issue is like another coming of age rite for any developed country with low birth rate, higher wages, living standards.  In US the issue is little different because they've been dealing with migrant workers and racism from the founding of the nation and still, but in Korea it is a new growing social issue and it will only get bigger fast.  Being a single race nation makes many Koreans naive on the issue of racism and buy into how other developed nations treat with their migrant workers.

That is why I miss Jhangora.  I wasn't even aware of such issues until I read his postings.  It was a great first hand snap shot of an Global issue, so much more refreshing than some nerds posting up what they googled.  Sure, he could've bias in his story telling but I wouldn't go quite as far as calling it an isolated incident. 

If Jhangora is still in Korea, I hope he can have better experiences being there and have deeper understanding of Koreans as they have lessons to be learned as a growing nation.

As far as Turkic creation myth and Korean one goes, I doubt that there was a massive migration of ancient nomatic Turks to Korea or vice versa, but I can see how the Mongols could have brought some Turkic/Scythian/Mongol tradition to Korea though Dangun myth was recorded before the Mongol invasion.  And the postings on Chi You were also very interesting.  Lately though, I've been intersted in Mediterrenian Dagon myth and subSaharan Dogon myth possibly connected with Dangun myth. 

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