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Ancient Anatolian Peoples

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  Quote Belisarius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Ancient Anatolian Peoples
    Posted: 16-May-2005 at 22:09
When I look at the demographics of Turkey, I find that it is a whopping 80% Turkish, the rest being Kurds.

My question is where have all the ancient Anatolian People gone? The Assyrians survive to the present day, so why not the Hittites, the Cappadocians, or the Cilicians?
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  Quote strategos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-May-2005 at 22:30
Many of these people have been added into the current day turkish population. Also, peoples have been deported from the country in a populatio exchange, at least between Greece and Turkey. Much of present day population is a mix between different ethnics.
http://theforgotten.org/intro.html
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  Quote Alparslan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2005 at 01:21

Originally posted by Belisarius


My question is where have all the ancient Anatolian People gone? The Assyrians survive to the present day, so why not the Hittites, the Cappadocians, or the Cilicians?

Assyrians do not survive today. This is one of the biggest lies of modern age. What it is called as Assyrians are Aramians. They call themselves as Suryoyo not Assyrian. Both speak a Semitic language but not same.

Ancient Anatolian people are in the place where Romans are. They have mostly mixed with today's population of Turkey, many of them died during crusaders, famine, diseases and social unrest between 11th - 13th century AD.

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  Quote AssyrianMan7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2005 at 11:15
Originally posted by AssyrianMan7

Originally posted by Alparslan

[QUOTE=Belisarius]
My question is where have all the ancient Anatolian People gone? The Assyrians survive to the present day, so why not the Hittites, the Cappadocians, or the Cilicians?

Assyrians do not survive today. This is one of the biggest lies of modern age. What it is called as Assyrians are Aramians. They call themselves as Suryoyo not Assyrian. Both speak a Semitic language but not same.

Ancient Anatolian people are in the place where Romans are. They have mostly mixed with today's population of Turkey, many of them died during crusaders, famine, diseases and social unrest between 11th - 13th century AD.

 

I am an Assyrian and i dont believe Turkish is a nationality. Turks being called human is the worlds biggest lie.  Turks are animals not humans. Who are you to say im not Assyrian. I am 100% Assyrian from Nineveh.  Arameans say they are Syriac in English and Suryoyo in their own language.  I dont know where you get your stupid information from but i suggest you go to none bullsh*t sites.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2005 at 12:46

  I am an Assyrian and i dont believe Turkish is a nationality. Turks being called human is the worlds biggest lie.  Turks are animals not humans. Who are you to say im not Assyrian. I am 100% Assyrian from Nineveh.  Arameans say they are Syriac in English and Suryoyo in their own language.  I dont know where you get your stupid information from but i suggest you go to none bullsh*t sites.

Write properly and be mannered. We arent here to read your inferior insults. You are one of those guys who hate us with those propoganda you heard, arent you? I suggest you to dry your mind boy, maybe you can need to use the very limited amount of it in such forums like this one someday...

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  Quote AssyrianMan7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2005 at 19:37
You muslim turks are murders. If you theory is right its because you turkish dogs killed them all because of their faith. By killing all the Assyrians and Armenians in your empire you created room for a Great Kurdistan which today it is a wonderfull problem for you guys!!! Long Live Kurdistan on Turkish soil!!!

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  Quote Gazi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 04:46
Arent you that facist -Assyrianguy7- who was banned?I think its not just for them to ban aknc and let you roam around.
Freedom is the recognition of necessity.-Friedrich Engels
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  Quote Alparslan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 06:10

Assyrians were a member of an empire ended at around 600 BC. It was 2500 years ego. You are saying that "I am from Nineveh". It is like someone consider himself from Ephesus. I think you wanted to call the place as Musul. As far as I know the remainings of Nineveh has been found in 19th century.

Today people who are called as Assyrians speak Aramaic which is also a Semitic language but certainly different one from Assyrian as it is shown on the map.

On the other hand I respect AssyrianMan7 and he can express himself by whatever they want and I am not angry at all about what you have written about Turks.

I know that you are suffering from Kurds and if they will establish a country it will be in Iraq, so it would be bad for you. On the other hand it is not wise to choose an identity which is famous of its fathal enemity towards Jews. It is not hard to guess that you will not be popular among neocons of US.

Call yourself whatever you want. But you are nothing more than a part of the Arab world/Semitic having a different religion than Islam, which is Christianity. This doesn't give you the right to get the heritage of an ancient people. You are just a few million but there are dozens of millions of Muslims living in Iraq, Syria and other Semitic countries. If you are Assyrians they Assyrians too......

You are talking about an empire which ended 2.500 years ego.......

 

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  Quote Ionian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 08:08
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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 11:43
Most of peoples who are called themselves Turks and Arabs (such as people of Turkey, Azerbaijan, Egypt, Algeria, ...) are in fact the descendants of some ancient peoples who have lost their "identity", for example about Azeris, it is obvious that Azeri language which was certainly an Indo-European language existed in Azerbaijan before the entering of the Turks to this region.
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  Quote AssyrianMan7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 11:59

Originally posted by Gazi

Arent you that facist -Assyrianguy7- who was banned?I think its not just for them to ban aknc and let you roam around.

 

yes i am him, my punishment had ended more then a year ago

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  Quote AssyrianMan7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 12:02
My village is one of the oldest villages in Iraq. My village is more then 2000 years old. My village is less then a mile away from Nineveh(Mosul), it is known and said that the people in my village are true Assyrians.
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  Quote Gazi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 12:26
And which village may that be?
Freedom is the recognition of necessity.-Friedrich Engels
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  Quote Kenaney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 15:08

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

Most of peoples who are called themselves Turks and Arabs (such as people of Turkey, Azerbaijan, Egypt, Algeria, ...) are in fact the descendants of some ancient peoples who have lost their "identity", for example about Azeris, it is obvious that Azeri language which was certainly an Indo-European language existed in Azerbaijan before the entering of the Turks to this region.

Yea yea, they were Iranic people huh? Fu!!! tell youre nonsens to chldren not HERE!!!!!!! 

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 15:47

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

Most of peoples who are called themselves Turks and Arabs (such as people of Turkey, Azerbaijan, Egypt, Algeria, ...) are in fact the descendants of some ancient peoples who have lost their "identity", for example about Azeris, it is obvious that Azeri language which was certainly an Indo-European language existed in Azerbaijan before the entering of the Turks to this region.

Not most people, but an important amount of those people. And it is true that there existed an Indo European Azerbaijan before the Turkish conquests and settlements at that region, but it was only the name of the region, I think in the meaning of "the place of fire" or something like that.

Of course, some Iranian inhabitants have lost their identity in the new society, and intermixed with the Turks, so there appeared the current Azeri sub-nation, as a result. But we cant say that they are some ancient Iranic inhabitants who have lost their identities with the invasion of some Turkish/Turkmen tribes. So why do the big Azeri population in Iran still exist with a Turkic identity, and not assimilated in Iranic civilization in the last couple of centuries, after the collapses of Seljuks and their succerssors in Iran, Khwarezmshahs?

I think the fact is that in the last thousands of years of intermixing btw Turkic and Iranic people/societies both in western steppes, Iran, Azerbaijan, and even C.A. (with Schytians, Tocharians etc.), we cant consider those people very different from each other and differ them as assimilated locals or pure blooded societies. It is also for Iran and people who now call themselves Iranians. Iranians were under foreign rules from the Seljuks' reign until the collapse of the Turkic (Oguz) originated Safavid dynasty. And Khorasan, Persia and middle east have been the most important immigration routes of those Turkic peoples since the Islamic conquest of Iran and C.A. So that's the truth for all current nations of our world, intermixing through thousands of years. The main element that forms today's nations is the common culture and history among the members of a society.

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  Quote Justice Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 16:24
Yes indeed there are Assyrians untill today and there are quite many.Its really impressive that those people managed to preserve themselves even though they have been persecuted with Genocides ,like so many others, by the Turks.Around 600.000 - 700.000 were massacred by the Turks,with the aid of the Kurds, and driven out from their ancient home land.The Assyrian diaspora should organise themselves and preserve their national identity.They definately deserve to have back a nation.
THEY WILL NOT PASS
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  Quote AssyrianMan7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2005 at 17:43

Originally posted by Justice

Yes indeed there are Assyrians untill today and there are quite many.Its really impressive that those people managed to preserve themselves even though they have been persecuted with Genocides ,like so many others, by the Turks.Around 600.000 - 700.000 were massacred by the Turks,with the aid of the Kurds, and driven out from their ancient home land.The Assyrian diaspora should organise themselves and preserve their national identity.They definately deserve to have back a nation.

 Your are VERY right.  We the Assyrians now are trying to get a voice in the new Iraq. For the Iraqi elections not one Assyrian village was given a chance to vote.  The day of the elections, the Kurdish Regional Government was in charge of sending the ballot boxes throughout all of Northern Iraq.  NOT ONE ballot box reached any Assyrian city or Turkomen city.  We protested this uncivilialzed action all over the world along with the Turkomen.  Out of 275 seats in the Iraqi Government we only recieved 1 seat, and that was thanks to the Assyrians out side Iraq. Right now our only goal is to get a voice in the New Iraq and to get an Administrative Region of our own.  Northern Iraq is not all kurdish. The Assyrians and the Turkomen are considered as kurds in the eyes of the Americans.

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  Quote Alparslan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-May-2005 at 01:16

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

Most of peoples who are called themselves Turks and Arabs (such as people of Turkey, Azerbaijan, Egypt, Algeria, ...) are in fact the descendants of some ancient peoples who have lost their "identity", for example about Azeris, it is obvious that Azeri language which was certainly an Indo-European language existed in Azerbaijan before the entering of the Turks to this region.

  Wishful thinking.....

It seems like you want to forget the history of Iran. Kharzemshahs, Seljuks, Akkoyunlu, Karakoyunlu, Kacars, Safavids were all Turkic rules over Iran. Today in Iran, especially in Southern Azerbaijan in Iran, there are around 20 million Turkic speaking people. The area from Anatolia to Central Asia via Northern Iran and Azerbaijan is a natural continuation of Turkic world.

You are saying that "ancient Azeri language was an IE language".  You cannot call this language as Azeri language, it was a different language.

Aren't you claim those Aryan theories by only looking at language of nations? So, to be consitent with yourself you have to accept that Azeris and Turks are the same. Otherwise your Aryan stories wiped out.



Edited by Alparslan
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  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-May-2005 at 02:01

At first I should say that it can be said about Iranians too. Elamites, Kassites, Lullubis and some other ancient non-Iranian peoples who lived in Iran, have also lost their identities and many peoples who already call themselves Iranian or Persian are in fact the descendants of these peoples.

But about Azeris you can see that everything except language is Iranian, of course it can be said about other Turkic peoples too but Azeris are more culturally related to Iranians, one of the reasons can be that they are also Shia muslims.

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  Quote Alparslan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-May-2005 at 04:14

Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

But about Azeris you can see that everything except language is Iranian, of course it can be said about other Turkic peoples too but Azeris are more culturally related to Iranians, one of the reasons can be that they are also Shia muslims.

Why don't you think just contrary?

It can be very well said that Iranians except langauge is Azeri or Turkic.   But since you are too much involved in "Aryan stories" you can only describe Turks as only nomad and Mogoloid. But this is not true.

What is interesting is that some Persian forumers do not want to understand that Turks and Persians have formed a new and combined culture that cannot be labelled by any of the two part.

What we can say is that everything that you mention as "Iranian culture"  there is Turkish in it. And everything that we mention as "Turkish culture" there is something Iranic in it. There is not a linear Iranian nor Turkish culture. They shaped each other.

As far as the Shia/Sunni difference is concerned; this was not that much important until 16th century. In fact majority of Turcomans were Shia. That's why there was the problem between Safavids and Ottomans.

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