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Why the steppes?
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Feramez View Drop Down
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Posts: 521 		  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Why the steppes?
    Posted: 10-Jul-2006 at 06:05
Originally posted by raygun

Originally posted by Feramez

What does this kit do, that you guys mentioned?
 
Hi, the kit basically test your genetic ancestry, looking for the migration route your forefathers taken after they left Africa. If you're in the US, it cost US$99, if you're in other parts of the world then its US$129 including shipping.
 
You can then use the results and maybe use this site (http://www.ysearch.org/)to trace for pple with similar genetic codes. It shld be fun to see who is your distance relative.
 
cheers
 
 
Maybe I'll try that out, thanks.
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Posts: 80 		  Quote raygun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jul-2006 at 05:11
Originally posted by Feramez

What does this kit do, that you guys mentioned?
 
Hi, the kit basically test your genetic ancestry, looking for the migration route your forefathers taken after they left Africa. If you're in the US, it cost US$99, if you're in other parts of the world then its US$129 including shipping.
 
You can then use the results and maybe use this site (http://www.ysearch.org/)to trace for pple with similar genetic codes. It shld be fun to see who is your distance relative.
 
cheers
 
 
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Posts: 2200 		  Quote mamikon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jul-2006 at 15:07
Originally posted by raygun

They went to Kazarkstan to interview a man who carried a gene form 40,000 yrs ago (if I remembered correctly)!


isnt that the case with all of us? most human genes (close to 99%) are conserved. Furthermore you, I and about everyone here has almost the same mitochondrial DNA, the same DNA present in humans as early as 200,000 years ago.The only variability comes from a few mutations in the mitochondria that occur in places where it does not matter.

The mitochondrial DNA has been one of the few ways to trace human migrations.
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Posts: 521 		  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jul-2006 at 14:02
What does this kit do, that you guys mentioned?
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Posts: 521 		  Quote Feramez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jul-2006 at 14:01
Originally posted by raygun

I ordered a National Geographic's Genographic Project test kit. It contains a DVD on the Journey of Man. Interestingly, they showed that CA was a "melting pot" - sort of an distribtuion point when man came out of Africa, before the Europeans moved to Europe, and the East Asians moved to China, etc.
 
They went to Kazarkstan to interview a man who carried a gene form 40,000 yrs ago (if I remembered correctly)!
 
And they also visited the Chukchi(sp?) tribe in north-eastern Siberia in -50 C. Those Chukchi are really incredible people! You must watch the DVD to believe how tough they are!
 
cheers
I saw that program on PBS a while ago, it was great.  Except for the humans that migrated to southern India and Australia before they got to Central Asia, everyone else mixed and mingled in Central Asia before going off their seperate ways.  Yea, that was an Uygur man in Kazakistan, they said something like his DNA has not been mixed for 40,000yrs.  So he is the most purest, known, human in the world.  I thought that tribe he visited in Siberia were the Kipchak.  Isn't the Chukchi the Native Americans he visited in Arizona?
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Posts: 1919 		  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jul-2006 at 04:33
Originally posted by raygun

I ordered a National Geographic's Genographic Project test kit. It contains a DVD on the Journey of Man. Interestingly, they showed that CA was a "melting pot" - sort of an distribtuion point when man came out of Africa, before the Europeans moved to Europe, and the East Asians moved to China, etc.
 
They went to Kazarkstan to interview a man who carried a gene form 40,000 yrs ago (if I remembered correctly)!
 
And they also visited the Chukchi(sp?) tribe in north-eastern Siberia in -50 C. Those Chukchi are really incredible people! You must watch the DVD to believe how tough they are!
 
cheers
 
yes I saw this one it was verry intresting I wanted to order the kit but I don't thrust it
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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Posts: 80 		  Quote raygun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jul-2006 at 04:17
I ordered a National Geographic's Genographic Project test kit. It contains a DVD on the Journey of Man. Interestingly, they showed that CA was a "melting pot" - sort of an distribtuion point when man came out of Africa, before the Europeans moved to Europe, and the East Asians moved to China, etc.
 
They went to Kazarkstan to interview a man who carried a gene form 40,000 yrs ago (if I remembered correctly)!
 
And they also visited the Chukchi(sp?) tribe in north-eastern Siberia in -50 C. Those Chukchi are really incredible people! You must watch the DVD to believe how tough they are!
 
cheers


Edited by raygun - 09-Jul-2006 at 04:19
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Posts: 241 		  Quote minchickie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jul-2006 at 22:20
Originally posted by Kalevipoeg

, then why is Siberia and the entire steppes of Asia so filled with human life since, well, forever? In the coldest steppes of the world where temperatures drop to -30 or -40 degrees celcius or even lower, human life has known to exist for thousands of years, maybe even tens of thousands. Why didn't we all migrate to some sort of a Mesopotamia or the valley of the Nile?  
 
 
This is simple. We know that the Earth is coming  off of the last Ice-age presently. By presently , meaning within the last 5,000-7,000 years or so. We know, every 60,000 years approximatley that the planet goes throught the Ice Ages.
In what are now deserts, we have found the bones of Wooley Mammouths. Of course they would not need so much hair  in the desert but this is because once was ice there, etc..
The American Indians probaly got into the Americas through a wall of ice connecting both continets. This was also due to Ice glaciers left over from the last ice-age.
For better explanation (I am tired), google in "ice-ages".
Star


Edited by minchickie - 08-Jul-2006 at 22:22
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2006 at 17:38
Originally posted by Imperator Invictus

Well, any territory is difficult for outsiders to attack. The uniqueness about the steppes is that it is easy for insiders (other nomadic factions) to attack due to the lack of fortifications. In a sedentary territory, a dying faction can still hold out in the city garrison for several months. Not on the steppes.
 
I disagree as well, the opposite is quite true. if you have no cities to defend you have a major advantage. and huge infantry based sedentary armies face logisitcal problems as well. and almost no Steppe empire fell because it was conquered but because it lost political cohesion. compare to urban empries. Rome had the Limes, China the great wall and all urban empires had many fortresses and walled cities. did any of those ever stop them from being conquered? no. was the maginot line a sucess? the westwall? the atlantik wall? fortifications have never prooven sucessfull in the past and never will, static defensive strategies have never ever prooven sucessfull.
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Posts: 1869 		  Quote Lmprs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jun-2006 at 19:49
Originally posted by Forgotten

simply because the africa thing is not true

Can you explain your statement a little bit more?
    
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Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jun-2006 at 17:26
Ofcourse it is, this is scientifically proven, were all Somalian Smile
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Posts: 63 		  Quote Forgotten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jun-2006 at 16:02
Originally posted by Kalevipoeg

It is believed that the first human settlement or shown existance of our activity is somewhere in Eastern-Africa if i am not mistaken. But if we started from such warm and nice places, then why is Siberia and the entire steppes of Asia so filled with human life since, well, forever? In the coldest steppes of the world where temperatures drop to -30 or -40 degrees celcius or even lower, human life has known to exist for thousands of years, maybe even tens of thousands. Why didn't we all migrate to some sort of a Mesopotamia or the valley of the Nile?  
 simply because the africa thing is not true
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Posts: 84 		  Quote Suevari Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jun-2006 at 09:33
Plus, you said '...compared to mountain empipres'.  Most key steppe empires ruled the mountains that surrounded their inland grasslands, especially to the north.
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Posts: 84 		  Quote Suevari Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jun-2006 at 09:27
Invictus, the Steppe is hard to attack.  I may look easy to an attacker because of it's wide plains, but to an army unused to it's specialised terrains it was a daunting and usually ultimately perilous task.

Ah, then you say it is easy for armies within the Steppe to attack each other, that's a different matter.  Plus, the key steppe empires had fortifications, like the Gokturks, but not of course on the scale of Roman for example as they were semi pastoral nomads.
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Posts: 3151 		  Quote Imperator Invictus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jun-2006 at 08:55
Well, any territory is difficult for outsiders to attack. The uniqueness about the steppes is that it is easy for insiders (other nomadic factions) to attack due to the lack of fortifications. In a sedentary territory, a dying faction can still hold out in the city garrison for several months. Not on the steppes.
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Posts: 817 		  Quote BigL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Jun-2006 at 04:35

Steppe empires fell very quicly mainly because tribes would change their allegience if they senses weakness with ruling tribe.Juan Juan lost a battle to chinese and their tribes changed their alliance to Turks.

Invading the steppe was extremely difficult
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Posts: 3151 		  Quote Imperator Invictus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jun-2006 at 23:18
No, it was actually the opposite. The steppes were hard to defend and easy to attack. That's why steppe empires rose and fell faster than mountain empires.
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Posts: 84 		  Quote Suevari Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jun-2006 at 16:30
Easy to defend, hard to attack.  Plus they required specialised warfare, another advantage.
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Posts: 1919 		  Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jun-2006 at 12:26
When people first left africa the followed hurds of animals who grased on the steppes. that explains alot dusn't it.
 
There are plenty fish in the see. What are the steppes a ocean of grass so plant animasl = food


Edited by xi_tujue - 04-Jun-2006 at 12:27
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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Posts: 4310 		  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Jan-2005 at 10:47
most steppe areas used to be incredibly fertile, most dinosaur bones are found in Montana and Mongolia
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