Darts, used in battle ! What were they?

Well then my friend Ian, then I would suppose that you will concede that I have beaten you? Laugh!

But, you should work on your Russian, or perhaps you know Polish better?

Za tvoyo zdorovie   Ron

Originally posted by toyomotor Ron:  You wrote "Whilst I am probably part Native American on both sides of my family."   Does that mean your parents are related?   You are from Mississippi aren't you?

Actually the last name "Garrett" was carried by both of my Grand Mothers! But, I am sure they were at least fourth cousins or more!
Smile! But, I see no reason you should use such innuendo as a disparaging remark. I know though that you meant no harm!

Prosit, Ron

Edited by opuslola - 06-Feb-2014 at 18:54

Originally posted by opuslola Do you say "Look the window out?" or "Paint the house Red?" smile Ron

Just asking. My parents were related by marriage-theirs!

Originally posted by toyomotor Ron:  You wrote "Whilst I am probably part Native American on both sides of my family."   Does that mean your parents are related?   You are from Mississippi aren't you?

Originally posted by toyomotor Originally posted by opuslola Originally posted by toyomotor From what I've read over the years, I believe that the word "Dart" was used for a short throwing spear, as opposed to the longer, heavier spear which was used to jab opponents. Then would not that weapon be better described as a javelin? But the word "dart" means sometimes as "quick" or "fast" etc. The speed of a Javelin could not be much greater than that of a spear, but the speed of a "dart" it seems would be much greater even must greater than that of a leveraged spear or javelin! Thus, a solid metal "bolt" from a "crossbow", would effectively be the first "bullet!" Can anyone deny this? I will posit that after the small arrow (a Dart), fired from a crossbow, developed into a solid steel "bolt" that the terms/words to describe the projectile changed. It is probably only a translation problem, I.e. the distortion of time by chronologists and historians created a "void" that could not effectively be crossed, and that was related to word usage. Ron It was smaller than a Javelin.

I agree, it just had to be smaller, thus a dart!

Za vas! Ron

Originally posted by toyomotor From what I've read over the years, I believe that the word "Dart" was used for a short throwing spear, as opposed to the longer, heavier spear which was used to jab opponents.

Then would not that weapon be better described as a javelin?

But the word "dart" means sometimes as "quick" or "fast" etc. The speed of a Javelin could not be much greater than that of a spear, but the speed of a "dart" it seems would be much greater even must greater than that of a leveraged spear or javelin!

Thus, a solid metal "bolt" from a "crossbow", would effectively be the first "bullet!"

Can anyone deny this?

I will posit that after the small arrow (a Dart), fired from a crossbow, developed into a solid steel "bolt" that the terms/words to describe the projectile changed. It is probably only a translation problem, I.e. the distortion of time by chronologists and historians created a "void" that could not effectively be crossed, and that was related to word usage.

Ron

Edited by opuslola - 03-Feb-2014 at 17:31

Then, it seems, you have found what I have found, except for the "compound?" "Dart!", a feature I have never ascertained.

Of course "fletched" shafts were used until the era of "full metal Bolts!"

Can you now agree that this question is still under consideration?

Ron

Nice post RC! But did not you look at the examples I presented earlier? I found no one throwing a three foot arrow via an Atlatl!

Perhaps you can show us one or two doing it with a three foot dart?

And, I have never hunted for an arrowhead in my life! And the term "Banner stones" has never been seen by me until you posted it above!



Regards, Ron

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bannerstone

Whilst I am probably part Native American on both sides of my family, I have never had much interest in the history of that side, since there really exist no evidence of it in our Southern history, other than family stories.

Edited by opuslola - 31-Jan-2014 at 17:07

I would suggest that in the modern literature concerning the crossbow and its ammunition, I did not see it anywhere described with the usage of the word "dart!"

I did find this, however;   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarrel

The sites I perused most commonly used the word "arrow!"
And if you actually looked at the Wikipedia site above you also saw a photo of a "bolt." A "bolt" made of solid steel! And strangely enough they are about the size and shape of a modern "dart" used in the game of "Darts!"

I propose an answer to the original question. That is, the original "quarrels" were made of wood or bamboo, etc., and these shafts were attached at one time to a stone arrow head (and later to a an Iron head), and some kind of feathered wings on the back, just like a regular arrow. In addition. it seems the development of body armor became so good that the best the crossbow Quarrel could do was to sometimes penetrate it just enough to keep it attached to the armor so the knights sometimes looked like pincushions!   But the deadly tips often did not penetrate enough to pierce the skin or body of the knight.

So there became a war between the makers of crossbows and the armor of the knights. It even appears the famous English Longbow, became the better weapon against armored knights, for a while at least, that is until the crossbow makers were finally able to shape and test a new type of quarrel that was made of solid steel, since it looked much like a metal "bolt" (and perhaps the first ones developed were fashioned from one?) it was discovered it could defeat even the best sheet metal armor of the times but in but a few years gunpowder and bullets proved the deadliest of the bunch! The name became famous, and the word arrow was revived for the smaller crossbows of these times.

Thus the "bolt" is around the same size as our common day darts. smile

Ron

Originally posted by opuslola And that makes sense yomud! It is a "quick: movement, and if one was to avoid such a slap one would be quicker! Smile! Ron