Origins of Arscaid Parthians

This people emerge firstly in the form of Parni folk in the Northeast Iran. They are supposed (based on what?) to speak a Northeastern Iranian language-possibly in close relation with Scythian. But the fact is when they oust Seleucid Greeks and start off reigning in the so-called Parthian Empire, their official language (of which there is the slightest trace before than time) is Parthian language-a Northwestern Iranian language of course!

Now the question is how come they adopted this Northwestern language? And indeed where this language already was when they accepted it? Because the only Northwestern Iranian language known to us, before that time, is the language of Medes. In today Iran there are appear to be, in my opinion, three kinds of Northwestern Iranian language: 1. those with obvious Median affinity 2. those with Parthian background 3. those with no obvious Median nor Parthian elements:

Median Group : Sivandi, some Central Iranian dialects

Parthian Group: Hawrami, Zazaki

Third Group: Kurdish, Semnani, Talyshi


Sivandi : Hawrami : Zazaki : Kurdish : Talyshi

fardan : wardey : werden : xwardin/hwardin : xarde/harde

In the above example there are obviously three different linguistic developments for Proto-Iranian "hw-*" (< P.I.E "sw-*") attested in the so-called Northwestern Iranian languages: hw > f; hw > w; hw > h(w)/x(w).

There are also geographical difficulties to classify these groups. However one can draw lines for the cases of Median and the Third group, but the allegedly Parthian group (Zaza-Gorani) are scattered in the southwest and westernmost parts of the Northwestern languages map; whilst some close relatives of them may stay in the southeastern parts of Alborz.

I wonder what is the exact origin of Parthian language? Is there any records of it or its close relatives before the rise of the Parthian empire? And what about the pre-Parthian language of Arscaid people? Is there any historical records for this allegedly Northeastern Iranian language?

Unfortunately it is a little bit complicated. I do not know but I feel like maybe the conventional classification of all these languages into a single group-Northwestern Iranian- might need a revision. At least linguistic and historical materials may imply such a call.

Ethnically they do not differ that much: typical Middle Easterns (maybe only with a little bit more of Aryan influence among Kurds and Mazandaranis). Even a recent genetic survey proved that speakers of Zaza and Kurdish languages (both being historically of Kurdish ethnicity) do not represent genetic divergence in the same level that their respective languages differ.

The Median proper is for sure indigenous to Northwest Iran; but out of the Parthian and the Third group, one group I speculate is later brought to the area. It really needs more linguistic materials in order to judge.

Originally posted by Nick1986 Arsacids and Sassanians http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=f_gcyC8l80MC&lpg=PP1&ots=V3e6Y5JHDr&dq=arsacid&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q&f=false

Thanks for the link pal. However it is restricted too for my connection (filtered).

I've read that Hawramani Kurdish is the closest language to the Parthians.  Even Parthian documents were found in the Hawramani region.   What I find interesting is the similarties and the differences between Kurmanji/Sorani and Gorani/Zaza.  Kurmanji/Sorani shares certain similarities with SW iranian languages that are not present in Gorani/Zaza.  I believe maybe Kurmanji/Sorani were earlier more similar to Lori and Persian and later got heavly influenced by Parthian and Scythian. 

The whole East and West Iranian language classifcation might need updating as it could be that Parthian was a East Iranian language that mixed with with west iranian languages creating the NW and SW cline.  I also believe the Scythian also influenced NW iranian languages their presence in NW iran is noted and they likely had a influence on the Median groups.


Edited by Ince - 30-Jul-2012 at 19:59

Sorry for poor english !

 Parthians were aristocracy and native iranian/kurdish/pushtun sedentary people were dependant upon them. There’s no any parthian scripture in order that you may conclude exact ethnic origins, manihean and Nissa scriptures theoretically ascribed to parthian actually they’re arameyan. Ary – word means – pure, AR+SAK means “pure nomad”, “original nomad”. Persians (sassanids) massacred parthian tribes, parthians fled to their relatives to Kushan empire, Bactrians, Scythes. Parthians were pure nomads they chased selevkids out from iran and conquered sedentary persians, called themselves as “DAH” or “DAI”, they never interfered to religion and administrative matters but strictly requested obedience from sedentary iranian people, even developed persian religion wrote and shaped Avesta into book, built temples, loved to speak greek language in politics but with subject people spoke arameyan (as now english used worldwide). But noble nomads (ary+sak) paid bitterly for such philanthropist behaviour, at last they lost power. When last parthian king fought with Rome troops the persians sassanids treacherously attacked them at back. So sassanids started totally hunting and killing parthians, the hatred of persians was so great that they nearly killed them all, but woke up and understood that they killing their only capable rider warriors, the last parthian aristocrat named Mihran was fleeing persia and nearly reached caucasia when received letter from persian king that implored them to come back, it was written as follows – “wherever you will receive this letter, let my fleeing brother stop and take whatever much lands he wants, and rule those lands, and let him stay at persia!” Mihran accepted his proposal and stayed at persia……
Parthian language is pahlavi, also the country and nomad nation was called as Pahlav, Pahlavan, Pahlavigh. The neighbour scythe country was Bactria with capital -  Balh, was capital of bulgars and was called

In indian as – Bhallika, Bhali, Bahli;

Bactrian scriptures called -- Bahlo;

Persians caalled them – Bahli;

And lastly Armenians called it -- Bahl, Pahl.

So surely may conclude that pahlav means – native of Balh.
Arsak among persians had nickname as bloody robber same as nomad Timurleng or Nadirshah.

name parthia was given in memory of scythe ruler – Partatua (greeks call him as Prototius) son of Ishpaka, father of Mateo, ruled in 673-653 B.C.

another ancient indian sources indicate that main tribe of parthia – aparn, parna, avaran originate from sak nomads, for example rome sources called those aparn,parna,avaran nomads as “varhonit” that means avar+ hionit, hionit means hunns, so indian sources connected parthians with avar, hionit-hunns, bulgars, bahlavis, pahlavis.  
Another armenian sources also indicate  close affinities of parthians with avars, bulgars, ephtalites, hunns.

also Pompey Trog wrote that language of parthians is smth middle between scythe and midyan and that all their lives they live on the horseback and drink only horse milk, there is no nation in the world except hunns,avars,parthians that live dependant only on horses.