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Herodotus Reliable?
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Pretorian
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Posts: 170 		  Quote Fula Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Herodotus Reliable?
    Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 07:25
Im keep hearing mixed reviews about this guy Some say he is the "Father of History" some say he's unreliable and fanciful at times. He himself claims he only reports what he sees and hears basically...
 
Its fustrating Angry because I actually qoute this guy in reference to African people specifically Egyptians and Ethiopians...So My Question is do Scholars take him Serious/Literal?
 
 
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Posts: 6084 		  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 08:35
The trouble really, fula, is that he ranges from reasonably accurate right through to the realms of the fairytale. I think it is thought that the closer he was to those things he is writing about, the closer his accuracy becomes, and even with them his interpretation could be questioned at times. Here is something I have just found doing some questioning what Herodotus has said.
It is often assumed that the Greek researcher Herodotus of Halicarnassus(c.480-c.429) visited Babylon, the cultural capital of the ancient Near East. His description of sacred prostitution is believed so widely that the word “Babylon” has become synonymous with sexual liberty. However, this custom is not mentioned in the thousands of cuneiform tablets that have been discovered in the nineteenth and twentieth century – and although we may one day find a tablet that confirms Herodotus’ story, this becomes increasingly unlikely. There is a point where absence of evidence becomes evidence of absence.

And there are more details that are simply wrong. No one who had visited the city could have said that it had hundred gates, had a wall that was 88 kilometers long, 100 meters high and 25 meters thick. In the eighteenth century, the British historian Edward Gibbon wrote in his copy of the Histories:

These dimensions, which have been devoutly swallowed by the voracious herd, are gigantic and incredible … Thirteen cities of the size of Paris might have stood within the precincts of Babylon … I much doubt whether he ever saw Babylon.

Many modern scholars agree, but we should be honest: Herodotus does not claim to have visited the city. He does write things like “people who have not been there, will find it hard to believe that…” and “this was still there in my days”. Highly suggestive, but there is not a single explicit statement that he actually visited the place.
 http://rambambashi.wordpress.com/2009/04/21/common-errors-3-herodotus-in-babylon/ 
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Posts: 6084 		  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 09:35
I found this little quote to be interesting, and somewhat surprising, about people not taking Herodotus seriously. This however doesn't automatically mean he shouldn't have.
It is odd that he was hardly appreciated in Antiquity. People admired his entertaining way of telling stories, but they did not believe them. The first to criticize the Father of History was Thucydides, who rejected Herodotus' religious explanation of what was happening . In later times, nobody dared to believe what Herodotus told about strange customs. For almost two thousand years, people considered him just a teller of (excellent) tales and thought that all these strange customs were merely inventions. His never ending stream of tall, short and winding tales earned him -as Salman Rushdie would say- not one but two nicknames: to some, he was the Father of History, but to others, he was the Father of Lies. Only when, after the discovery of the Americas, the Europeans learned to know the customs of hitherto unknown people, the reappreciation of Herodotus started. But even today, many of his claims are the subject of debate.
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Posts: 17084 		  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 10:30
Homer&Herodotus,Science Fiction virtual writers, from the same plagiarism's factory:Made in Byzantine&ancestors! 
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Posts: 6084 		  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 10:46
Originally posted by medenaywe

Homer&Herodotus,Science Fiction virtual writers, from the same plagiarism's factory:Made in Byzantine&ancestors! 
With story tellers you can still get a mixture of symbolism and embellishment, even when talking about events that might have happened, but when events are passed on by another party you can multiply those things. The trick I think is trying to discern truths from fairy tales, and see how much of works by these people, in percentage terms, can be trusted.   
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Posts: 170 		  Quote Fula Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 10:47
Thank you TheAlaniDragonRising...You Truly helped me out. From what I take I will try to avoid qouting him but I wont completely rule him out
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Posts: 170 		  Quote Fula Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 10:51
Would the Same apply for Diodorus Siculus? He Mentions Troy and the Trojan war etc...
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Posts: 6084 		  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 10:56
Originally posted by Fula

Thank you TheAlaniDragonRising...You Truly helped me out. From what I take I will try to avoid qouting him but I wont completely rule him out
I tend to be of that mind too. I might quote, but if it is pointed out how, say he was commenting from material passed to him, or there is reasonable evidence of him being wrong, then I will concede that what has been presented is not water tight, even if it means conceding the argument at the time. But then again I'm very strong on honesty.Shift+R improves the quality of this image. Shift+A improves the quality of all images on this page.
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Posts: 7392 		  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 15:21
Context. It all boils down to context and era within. Reliability of a specific era's scholar will change as does the knowledge base over time and the confirmation of the same by other scholars. So it also is with rejection.
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

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Posts: 6084 		  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 15:34
Originally posted by Centrix Vigilis

Context. It all boils down to context and era within. Reliability of a specific era's scholar will change as does the knowledge base over time and the confirmation of the same by other scholars. So it also is with rejection.
I guess that would also include a healthy dose of confirmation one way or another.Shift+R improves the quality of this image. Shift+A improves the quality of all images on this page. 
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Posts: 7940 		  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jan-2012 at 20:23
Like most ancient primary sources, Herodotus' works contain many inaccuracies, some deliberate lies, and a lot of political bias. There are also a few grains of truth, but the most useful aspect of any primary source is uncovering the viewpoint and agenda of the writer himself, notably why he depicted events and people the way he did
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Posts: 17084 		  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jan-2012 at 06:40
It is unreliable cause "entity" of main actors had been stolen and rest was copy&pasted from former documents.Byzantine Empire had stolen ancient world history from rest of the people and called most of  them "slaves" in new fabricated "history".Imagine USA tomorrow calls it's history English&Greek&Persian&Roman?This is the main reason that new "history compilation" looks so artificial.During it's 1622 years and lot of after new "truth" became legal presentation.


Edited by medenaywe - 14-Jan-2012 at 04:30
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Posts: 6084 		  Quote TheAlaniDragonRising Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jan-2012 at 11:58
Originally posted by Nick1986

Like most ancient primary sources, Herodotus' works contain many inaccuracies, some deliberate lies, and a lot of political bias. There are also a few grains of truth, but the most useful aspect of any primary source is uncovering the viewpoint and agenda of the writer himself, notably why he depicted events and people the way he did
Indeed, Nick, if nothing else, and I'm not saying he's totally unreliable, his viewpoint and agenda, what ever it is, is probably reliable.
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Posts: 21 		  Quote maks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-May-2012 at 04:31
I am of opinion that Herodotus account was originally reliable but medieval epitomizers have distorted it by introducing their comments. thus his account became very mixed...
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Posts: 7940 		  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-May-2012 at 19:42
Highly probable. The original texts have long since been lost and the surviving copies often contain errors
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Posts: 769 		  Quote Yugoslav Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-May-2012 at 13:16
Originally posted by Fula

Im keep hearing mixed reviews about this guy Some say he is the "Father of History" some say he's unreliable and fanciful at times. He himself claims he only reports what he sees and hears basically...
 
Its fustrating Angry because I actually qoute this guy in reference to African people specifically Egyptians and Ethiopians...So My Question is do Scholars take him Serious/Literal?
 
 

Well, he is also called Father of Lies, but actually, as we go deeper into more detailed historical analysis, more and more Heredotus' writings seem to be gaining on credibility. 

Not long ago with the development of critical historiography he was dismissed; previously erroneously having considered that he had actually had access to Persian imperial archives and brought those ridiculously high figures (millions and millions of Asians against a handful band of Greeks) directly from them. 

But now...it seems that Herodotus was actually right when he had claimed the Etruscan people's Oriental origins; it seems that he was right about the Armenians' origin (Hittite) and who knows what more we'll find out he was probably right about (in centuries often dismissed and sometimes even ridiculed for his claims) 
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