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Can't find medieval depictions of the Colosseum

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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Can't find medieval depictions of the Colosseum
    Posted: 08-Jan-2014 at 18:57
Originally posted by opuslola

Originally posted by Sidney

Originally posted by opuslola

Just look at the book! It is most modern it is, is it not?

Ron


Which book?

Any of them shown above. Most all of them look almost identical to modern bindings, etc.

Ron


Book binding is far older than book printing, and the books above illustrate the normal practise of placing book pages between hard covers of wood or leather, in order to protect them. As this is the same technique as done today with hard back books, then they will look similar. It is a very straight forward method, so what startling difference are you expecting to see?

There is variation however. The last two illustrations exhibit books with flat spines, which shows they have been stitched to the board covers in a manner common to book binding up until the 15th Century. After that period, which is illustrated in the other pictures, books started to get a curve in their spine because the pages were sewn together and then attached to the covers which wrapped around three sides of the book.

Perhaps this technique is older than you realised?

Edited by Sidney - 08-Jan-2014 at 19:05
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jan-2014 at 20:44
Yes my friend it may well be!

Thanks, Ron
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2014 at 11:49
Originally posted by Sidney

Originally posted by opuslola

But, boy o" You present some great goods!

Could you provide a presentation like those above that presents Caesar wearing the armour of the Fleur di Lys?

Look hard and long for this one?

Regards, Ron

Could you give me an example to set the ball rolling?


From an old posting at this very site;

http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28094

Also Saladin in same form.

Ron
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2014 at 16:31
Originally posted by Sidney

Originally posted by opuslola

Sidney, what wonderful representations, but I am afraid I give no plus points for timeliness!

Thus your words:
"Artists often represent people in a context that their contemporary viewer would understand; containing symbolism and meaning shared at the time of painting between painter and audience. Placing historical people in anachronistic settings and clothing was not unusual. These images are not photos of an event or attempts at accurate historical reconstructions, but are portrayals of an idea that is communicated through stock mediums understood within the culture they were generated for."

I will give the above paragraph a 2 out of ten! That is, there is a 20% chance that you shall be proven correct!

The words written above were done so to correct scenes that could not be correctly or in my opinion incorrectly placed in the distant past.

Ron

So how come my images show Jerome in settings dateable from the 14th to the 17th Centuries? You are dismissing the concept of artistic history and symbolism.

You have an image of Julius Caesar, painted in the 14th Century, dressed in 14th Century armour and surrounded by people dressed in 14th Century costume. But there are illustrations of Caesar from the 13th Century in 13th Century costume, and also many paintings from the 15th Century that show Caesar and attendants in 15th Century costume, and from the 16th Century dressed in 16th Century costume, and from the 17th Century dressed in 17th Century costume.

My answer, as it is above when referring to Jerome, will be the same for Julius Caesar. Should you choose to give the same response as you did above, our exchange will have to settle on a disagreement.
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jan-2014 at 21:54

Sidney! You are a priceless person to speak unto! You seem to have an almost unlimited access to many places in the ancient world than do I?

Please keep this up!

More regards than you can understand! Ron
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jan-2014 at 19:40
I think I actually have a post showing the depiction of Saladin!

'De bello civili' by Lucan that portrays Julius Caesar after the victory over Pompey; the settting is typically mediaeval. Milan, Biblioteca Trivulzanniam Ms 691, fol. 86v. Taken from ,'Kostbarkeiten der Buchjunst. Illumination klassicher Werke von Archimedes bis Virgil'. Herausgegeben von Giovanni Morello. Stuttgart-Zurich, Belser Verlag, 1997., p. 33."

No, wrong one! I do have it posted somewhere here!

Ron
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jan-2014 at 21:40
And Sidney, I found that I had posted a clue to book bindings at the wrong site. Here is a copy of the pertinent information;

" http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpg

Ron


I presume I posted this site for some reason, but since I sometimes post in an inebriated state, I don't know why I posted it here? But I might well have used the ornate visual aid of an old book that is held in the hand of the venerated saint? Why? Because in another post, I held that old book bindings were very different from the more modern ones. So that is it!

Regards, Ron "
So my response was to show the manner of old book bindings. Perhaps you could post the image I was trying to convey?

Edited by opuslola - 15-Jan-2014 at 21:42
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jan-2014 at 10:50
Hello opuslola. Thank you for the image. I'm not absolutely sure whether you are corroborating or trying to query my post on the age of book binding.

The painting you give shows a book with a curved spin, which in my post I said started to appear in the 15th Century. The painting was made c.1500, and so agrees with my statement.

Whatever the reason, thanks for continuing your search for knowledge.
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jan-2014 at 21:49
Sidney! Are we looking at the same depiction?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpg

I just see it as most different than my first depiction!

Please compare the depictions in my first post with this one?

And, just what does a "curved spine" have to do with anything?

Regards, Ron

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpg

By the way, I drink every night! It makes my life easier! LOL

Edited by opuslola - 16-Jan-2014 at 23:30
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Jan-2014 at 10:57
Originally posted by opuslola

Sidney! Are we looking at the same depiction?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpg

I just see it as most different than my first depiction!

Please compare the depictions in my first post with this one?

And, just what does a "curved spine" have to do with anything?

Regards, Ron

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpg

By the way, I drink every night! It makes my life easier! LOL

Hello opuslola.

I'm seeing this image;


My reply was related it to this comment by you;
Originally posted by opuslola

And Sidney, I found that I had posted a clue to book bindings at the wrong site. Here is a copy of the pertinent information;

" http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Vittore_Crivelli_-_Saint_Bonaventure.jpg

Ron

which I took to be referring to this previous post by me;
Originally posted by Sidney


Book binding is far older than book printing, and the books above illustrate the normal practise of placing book pages between hard covers of wood or leather, in order to protect them. As this is the same technique as done today with hard back books, then they will look similar. It is a very straight forward method, so what startling difference are you expecting to see?

There is variation however. The last two illustrations exhibit books with flat spines, which shows they have been stitched to the board covers in a manner common to book binding up until the 15th Century. After that period, which is illustrated in the other pictures, books started to get a curve in their spine because the pages were sewn together and then attached to the covers which wrapped around three sides of the book.

Perhaps this technique is older than you realised?

which explains why I mentioned the curved spines on the books in the above painting.

If we have our wires crossed, could you help me understand? I do not know which 'first post' you are referring to (could you quote it?), nor what I'm meant to be comparing.

Edited by Sidney - 17-Jan-2014 at 11:03
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