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'HUMAN' MIGRATION

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  Quote BIG D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 'HUMAN' MIGRATION
    Posted: 12-Nov-2010 at 13:05

what are your thoughts/knowledge on pre-humans or humans populating the earth....did the pre-humans spread out somewhat, then evolve to human---or were they more human before a big migration...did they evolve at a different pace per geographic location??ty

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  Quote TheGreatSimba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2010 at 14:09
Well the way i understand it, is that humans evolved in African, then migrated out, the first group died off. Then there was a second migration out of Africa, which was more successful.

I use CAPS for emphasis, not yelling. Just don't want to have to click the bold button every time.
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  Quote Cryptic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2010 at 15:48
Originally posted by BIG D

what are your thoughts/knowledge on pre-humans or humans populating the earth....did the pre-humans spread out somewhat, then evolve to human---or were they more human before a big migration...did they evolve at a different pace per geographic location??ty

As TGS mentioned, there is no evidence that humans evolved simultaneously in different locations outside of Africa.  All modern humans are descended from the second successful African migration.
 
There is a possibility, however, that some Austrolopethicus or Homo Erectus type species evolved in multiple locations.  For example the recently discovered "hobbit" remains found in Indonesia.   


Edited by Cryptic - 12-Nov-2010 at 15:49
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2010 at 20:32
I will stick to my theory, and it is mine only, I think, that the prototypical man, evolved or was mutated to almost his present form, while living in dried out sea beds!

Maybe the Med, the Black Sea., or even the Persian Gulf, etc., maybe all of them since they might well have been connected via lower sea levels before the seas returned!

But, all of them originated at what is presently called, " hundreds of feet below sea-level!"

REgards,

Edited by opuslola - 12-Nov-2010 at 20:33
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  Quote BIG D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 08:55
Originally posted by Cryptic

Originally posted by BIG D

what are your thoughts/knowledge on pre-humans or humans populating the earth....did the pre-humans spread out somewhat, then evolve to human---or were they more human before a big migration...did they evolve at a different pace per geographic location??ty

As TGS mentioned, there is no evidence that humans evolved simultaneously in different locations outside of Africa.  All modern humans are descended from the second successful African migration.
 
There is a possibility, however, that some Austrolopethicus or Homo Erectus type species evolved in multiple locations.  For example the recently discovered "hobbit" remains found in Indonesia.   
so the 2nd migration were humans??
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  Quote BIG D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 08:56
Originally posted by TheGreatSimba

Well the way i understand it, is that humans evolved in African, then migrated out, the first group died off. Then there was a second migration out of Africa, which was more successful.

ty--that's a lot of migrating...birth rate couldn't have been high...?
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  Quote BIG D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 08:57
Originally posted by opuslola

I will stick to my theory, and it is mine only, I think, that the prototypical man, evolved or was mutated to almost his present form, while living in dried out sea beds!

Maybe the Med, the Black Sea., or even the Persian Gulf, etc., maybe all of them since they might well have been connected via lower sea levels before the seas returned!

But, all of them originated at what is presently called, " hundreds of feet below sea-level!"

REgards,
why sea beds?
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  Quote Cryptic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 09:16
Originally posted by BIG D

Originally posted by TheGreatSimba

Well the way i understand it, is that humans evolved in African, then migrated out, the first group died off. Then there was a second migration out of Africa, which was more successful.

ty--that's a lot of migrating...birth rate couldn't have been high...?
Due to a variety of human techniques and natural conditions, nomadic hunter gatherer groups can have very low birth rates.  One big factor could be that women under alot of physical exertion (such as modern professional and serious amateur atheletes) do not ovulate as much. Of course, not every day is a work out day for nomadic hunter gatherers, but they do an awful lot excersize just living.  Then factor in birth control techniques.    
Originally posted by BIG D

so the 2nd migration were humans??
Yes.  


Edited by Cryptic - 13-Nov-2010 at 09:35
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  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 10:45
What if we are living only ,last human civilization, cycle?
Exept extraterrestrials among us!!!Sorry  X-creatures,monkey, no chimpmates?


Edited by medenaywe - 13-Nov-2010 at 10:50
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 10:45
Big D,

I have come to this as my explanation due to a number of factors.

One is the "Out of Africa" theory!

Thus if proto-humans developed in areas now under hundreds of feet or even a thousand feet of water, then they had to abandon there origins as the water levels in these shallow seas started to rise or suddenly rose?

I don't know if you know it, but sismologists or geologists have actually found an ancient Nile river channel that is about one mile deep! This channel could only have been created when the sea level of the Med. was over one mile lower than today!

The effects upon proto-humans living in such an area, that is maybe a mile below current sea level, is mostly unknown, but it would have been a place currently unlike any other place on this planet with the possible exception of the Dead Sea! That is, there would have been a much higher atmospheric pressure and possibly a higher concentration of oxygen or other of the heavier gases!

Second, at such depths, the harmful effects of sun-light is mostly nil!

Third, this area, might really have been "the land of plenty"? We really have no idea just what the conditions might have been like during this period or periods! But, one can speculate that if there was a lot of rain in N. Africa at this time, and since natural fresh water springs do occure under sea waters, then anyone or creature living there whould have numerus sources of fresh water!

Since the present continental shelf(s) that are now submerged to a depth of 300 to 600 feet, then they would have been exposed during low sea level times! These shelfs most naturally resemble huge cliffs, and there is every reason to believe that most naturally certain numbers of animals would from time to time literally fall into the depths! Certainly if weather patterns led to regular flood seasons, then there is also reason to believe that during these periods literally thousands of land animals could have been swept over the shelf valley during floods! Thus you would have fresh food, literally delivered from above!, and with the vast salt deposits found in the depths, this food would be easy to dry and or salt for later consumption.

Note the above is merely a short version of my idea!

Evidence? Well for sure the finding of a painted cave somewhere near the coast of present day France, with the only entrance being now under water is one clue, as well as the numerous sunken cities that have been discovered under water, as well as others that seem to be constantly discovered. Ruins that may or may not be man made found in the Pacific Ocean off the coast of Japan such as;

http://members.toast.net/rjspina/Japan's%20Underwater%20Ruins.htm

Might well signal another clue? As does the new finds in the Black Sea area!

But "there are lots of theories in the 'Naked City'! This has just been one of them!" (paraphrased from an old TV series called, surprisingly, "The Naked City!"

That should be enough for now!
Regards,
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  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:05
agree about all you are talking about...but like You always use to say,dating is and will be problem...Last glacial period/float is repetetive, on 14000/20000 years .We realy have no proof for, or against that this is last cycle of civilizied humanity!?!
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:07
Just an add on to Opuslolas-  There are 20 million square miles of land,  now under water, that was exposed and inhabited during the Glacial max.  Approx 9,000 ya.  [the same time frame as the destruction of "Atlantis"] something, now thought to be an asteroid impact, caused the sudden collapse of the Laurentide Ice Sheet, covering most of NA.  This caused the sudden increase in ocean levels and the rise of the Mediterranean.  This caused the Med to break through the land barrier separating the Med from what is now the Black Sea, which was a fresh water lake up until then.
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:10
Originally posted by medenaywe

agree about all you are talking about...but like You always use to say,dating is and will be problem...Last glacial period/float is repetetive, on 14000/20000 years .We realy have no proof for, or against that this is last cycle of civilizied humanity!?!
 
 
Don't fall into the trap that Opuslola has been living in.  Dating on all of this is solid.  There have been many Glacial Maxxs and mins.  I'm not sure what you mean on the rest of this.
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:13

There are more than a few opinions on all of this, however, a more scholarly approach can be found at- http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/stanley_ambrose.php

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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:14
Thanks red! Now you can see that the range for the flooding of the Black Sea, was somewhere between 14,000 ybp to 9,000 ybp! There also seems to have been numerous variations in the level of the Med. Sea, well into the era of 3,000 to 1,000 ybp! (YBP, meaning years before present!)
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:22
Sea levels continued to rise until approx 6,000 bce.  Drastic level changes ceased at about then, however gradual increases have continued to this day.  We are now in a Glacial Minimum.
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:34
Dear red, are you suggesting that "I live in a trap?" Or did you imply to our new friends that I am leading them, our new members, Big D and medenaywe, into a trap?

Beware Big D, and medenayne! Be very, very afraid!

Maybe they are old enough to "think" for themselves? Without good old "Big Brother" there to warn them!

Regards,

Edited by opuslola - 13-Nov-2010 at 11:35
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  Quote medenaywe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 11:35
That is just like you say...lot of proofs are beneth the see,rest are distroyed by eroding time effects of nature...and we have no corppus delictus...we are inside zone of speculations...but we also have long period i beleve more than several milions years for our ansestors,only to eat and reproduce and not to use brain for something that makes them human today...
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 12:43
For some opinion that might support my view, and one which I would guess that red-clay would wish you would avoid at all costs, please see;

http://salt.org.il/frame_sealevel.html

Lots of very good information is available here (at the main site), including some interesting stuff about the Dead Sea levels!

Enjoy the reading, there is a lot of it!

And medenaywe wrote;
"....not to use brain for something that makes them human today..."

There exists some really good information that the intake of salt by humans is a bonus effect on brain power! Perhaps constant exposure to goodly amounts of salt upon our remote ancestors, was the method whereby their brains were forced to grow and mature?

Edited by opuslola - 13-Nov-2010 at 12:48
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  Quote TheGreatSimba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2010 at 12:56
Big D, you are correct, it is estimated that the gene pool of which humans are a part of was a result of no more than 1000 to 10,000 individuals. Early Homo Sapiens only nnumber in the thousands when they began their migration.

Also, as cryptic mentioned, homo sapiens were not the only intelligent beings on the planet. Neanthertals and the recently discovered "hobbit" species were two different non-human intelligent beings that went extinct.


I use CAPS for emphasis, not yelling. Just don't want to have to click the bold button every time.
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