Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Crusader hair

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12
Author
Quetzalcoatl View Drop Down
General
General

Suspended

Joined: 05-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 984
  Quote Quetzalcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Crusader hair
    Posted: 25-May-2005 at 04:46
Double post.

Edited by Quetzalcoatl
Back to Top
Quetzalcoatl View Drop Down
General
General

Suspended

Joined: 05-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 984
  Quote Quetzalcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2005 at 04:47
Originally posted by Quetzalcoatl

[quote] went to look at the Bayeaux tapestry and so far i have seen 4 depictions of beards: once on Edward the Confessor, one ship builder(Norman), once on a servant(Norman) and once on an English soldier. Four times out of all those dozens of depictions, and no real difference between Norman and Englishmen. Really the number of people depicted with substantial facial hair is tiny. Given there are a fair number of moustaches, but the lack of beards in depiction shows people being depicted were depicted in a more idealized fashion than the reality of the day would have provided for. Here's a link if you want to examine the tapestry: http://hastings1066.com/baythumb.shtml

 there is a need  to understand how to analyse this tapestry correctly.

1. The tapestry is from a norman POV so basically most of the scene will depict normans and how normans monks (who gave the instruction to the makers of the tapestry) thought of the anglo-saxons. Beard was simply not as common as you think in this area of France. Many statues and pictures of this time depicts the poeple as having no facial hair except moustache. The 9th century statue of Charlemagne proves my point.

2. It is a broidery expect it to lack some details, but it is clear the saxons have beards. Edward the confessor was possibly a well known figure so he is portrayed more accurately, you getting my point.

3. also look at all the details, you'll notice some of the saxons are made to look like normans (similar helmets similar armour), the reason for that again it is from a norman POV. But they got many thing rights also, like the huskarl using double handed axe.

 You got to understand it is not a perfect source of information (just like newspapers nowadays, it is all about the reporter perspective) but it is the best available and of great precision in details. . So it is better to base knowledge from the tapestry than from an historian speculating about the matter.  Well you analyse the tapestry think of yourself as a norman monks, it will be all clear.

Back to Top
Constantine XI View Drop Down
Suspended
Suspended

Suspended

Joined: 01-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5711
  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-May-2005 at 21:54
Yea mate I see your point. I was just pretty sure that in those days most people who were struggling to survive/on military campaign wouldn't really bother with shaving. I am doubting the beard's popularity also considering the harshness of those times, preventing shaving being a practical fashion. But then I am not too familiar with the actual details of fashions and I look at alot of medieval art and see pretty clear lack of accurate representation.
Back to Top
Reginmund View Drop Down
Arch Duke
Arch Duke


Joined: 08-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1943
  Quote Reginmund Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2005 at 13:11
The richer nobles would usually bring along at least some of their household, with servants and all. I can't imagine they would have any trouble grooming. No matter how harsh the conditions were, they didn't eat their combs.

Still, I can imagine men and women of lesser status looking quite scruffy after a while on the road.

We should really stop talking about "medieval fashion", this varied a lot just like today, both hair styles and clothing.
Back to Top
Degredado View Drop Down
Consul
Consul
Avatar

Joined: 07-Aug-2004
Location: Portugal
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 366
  Quote Degredado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-May-2005 at 16:25

Originally posted by Quetzalcoatl

1. The tapestry is from a norman POV so basically most of the scene will depict normans and how normans monks (who gave the instruction to the makers of the tapestry) thought of the anglo-saxons.

 

I don't know about that. I saw this documentary on TV (we all know how reliable TV is) that said that the tapestry shows the POV of Saxon women. They even show a portion which supposedly depicts William on a hunt... with his nasty bits hanging out.

Vou votar nas putas. Estou farto de votar nos filhos delas
Back to Top
Nick1986 View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor
Avatar
Mighty Slayer of Trolls

Joined: 22-Mar-2011
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7940
  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Nov-2011 at 19:13

In modern times the haircut of the medieval knight is known as a "pageboy." It was cut straight across the front so as not to impede his vision, and grown to approximately collar length on the rest of the head (any longer and it would have caught in the joints of his armor). This haircut would have appeared long for Muslims (expected to crop their hair short), but was normal for Europeans
Me Grimlock not nice Dino! Me bash brains!
Back to Top
Nick1986 View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor
Avatar
Mighty Slayer of Trolls

Joined: 22-Mar-2011
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7940
  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Nov-2011 at 19:02

By the time of Edward I, himself a well-known crusader, English knights typically had long hair and beards. Here's a painting of the king dating back to 1272
Me Grimlock not nice Dino! Me bash brains!
Back to Top
Nick1986 View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor
Avatar
Mighty Slayer of Trolls

Joined: 22-Mar-2011
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7940
  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Jan-2012 at 19:11

Tomb of Richard the Lionheart, dating to 1199
Me Grimlock not nice Dino! Me bash brains!
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.