Finn origins

Scandinavians are mostly Europeoid/Caucasoid, but there is a slight influx of Mongoloid genes, particularly in the north and east, much like you find it in Russia except to a lesser extent. I know plenty of people with slightly Mongoloid facial features, and a few with markedly Mongoloid features, often in a combination of blonde hair and blue eyes with high cheek bones and slanted eyes. I used to know a girl who was an extreme example of this, unfortunately I don't have a picture. Erik Auvinen however, the one behind the school shooting in Finland not long ago, is a perfect example:

Originally posted by pebbles   Finns are " Mongoloid " !

Finns from Finnland are mostly "Eurpoid" and rather similar to their neighbouring Scandinavian countries. However, speakers of the Finno-Ugric language family include peoples of a wide range of phenotypes, ranging from extreme "Mongoloids" to Nordic "Europoids".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finno-Ugric_peoples
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samoyedic_peoples

In general, the Ugrian peoples living east of the Urals, such as the Khanti and Mansi, are predominantly Mongoloid, while those living farther west, like the Finns and Estonians, are typical Europoids. The Lapps (or Saami), who live in northern Scandinavia, are a mixture between the 2.
Many Turkic-speaking peoples today, such as the Bashkirs and Volga Tatars, could descend partly from Turkicised Finno-Ugrian peoples.

Finno-Ugrians form a larger part of a "Uralic" language family, that also includes "Samoyed" peoples living in Siberia. The Samoyeds tend to be extreme northern Mongoloids.

Originally posted by Reginmund   Originally posted by pebbles Wow ... this is complicated !   Are these individuals first & second generation offsprings of European & Siberian marriage unions,or Mongoloid genes inherited from many generations past ?   I know these genes are present because I see them myself on an everyday basis, but I don't know where they stem from. At first I assumed it was due to intermarriage with the Samis, but then I learn the Samis were Europeoid even before the Indo-European influx, so one can only assume it stems from an even older segment. Not that I find it very mystifying. Genes have a way of spreading across neighbouring regions. You find a lot of Mongoloid admixture in Russians, so it should come as no surprise that this is also evident in some of the Russians' neighbours, particularly Finland. Looking at a map of Russia, it's easy to see how these genes would transit into Scandinavia.

Edited by pebbles - 02-Apr-2009 at 12:34

Originally posted by pebbles   Except for recent decades,open inter-racial marriages between Western people & Asians were low.

This is a lie.
Intermixing between Europoid and Mongoloid peoples had begun in pre-history; both in Europe and in Asia.

It is believed that Finno-Ugrian speaks had once populated much of Eastern Europe, of what is today northern European Russia. Little is known about their phenotype, but it could possibly have included Mongoloid features; and the indigenous population of the Ural region were partly Mongoloid.
During the expansion of Slavic tribes in Eastern Europe, many of these Finns adopted Slavic language and culture and began to identify themselves as Slavs. Some anthropologists suggest that up to 50% of ethnic Russians could descend from Finno-Ugrians (don't ever tell this to a Russian Nazi).
In a similar manner, they could also have expanded into Scandivania where they intermixed with Vikings and contibuted to the modern gene pool.

Apart from this largely undocomented intermingling of indo-european and Uralian peoples, there are other better known cases of intermxing between Europoids and Mongoloids, starting with the migration of the Xiongnu into Europe, followed by the Avars, and all the other Turkic peoples.

In the East, it has been discovered through DNA analysis of ancient Xiongnu tombs from the 1st century B.C., that 10% of their genes had Europoid origin, meaning that they were a mixed people as early as when they lived in Mongolia.

Originally posted by pebbles   Why is there such a controversy in Europe ?

I think chosing sexual partners has a large cultural element in it as well.
For example, in Spain, I've seen a trend take a reverse turn in less than one generation.

The most common inter-national marriage here is between Spaniards and Latin Americans.
Among the generation older than 30, the ones who are getting married now, the pattern is overwhelmingly Spanish men marrying Ecuadorean, Colombian, Dominican, or Peruvian women. Spanish women of this age group have more of a mental block of mating with foreigners; and if they do so, surprisingly, the prefered partners are North Africans or Middle Easterners.
Out of every 10 mixed marriages, in 8 or 9 cases the Spaniard is male.

Among teenagers, the trend has reversed; as 16 and 17 year old growing up in mixed neighbourhoods have little mental "blockage" in mating with those of foreign phenotype. Among this age group, it tends to be Spanish girls who are more willing to date Latin-American boys!
I think this has a lot to do with education, as Spanish women have been rather "repressed" up to the current generation so they naturally suffer greater taboos.

Regarding European men prefering East Asian women and European women prefering "southern" men, I always have my "instintive explanation".
In general, men tend to be attracted to smaller women, while women tend to be attracted to larger men, whether taller or stronger.
East Asians in general tend to be smaller and less hairy than Europeans; and "smaller" and "less hairy" are generally considered to be more feminine traits; which gives their women an advantage, but not the men.

Men also attract women with their attitude and prowess; such as the way they walk and dance. In this sense, African and Latin American men have more of a cultural tradition, which gives them an advantage.

It's not quite that simple. First off Europeoids in that area have intermingled with Mongoloids from the east since time immemorial, it would be more surprising if they didn't exhibit any Mongoloid traits. There is a gradual transition of predominantly (but not completely) Europeoid traits in the west around Russia and Finland to increasingly Mongoloid traits in Central Asia. In both regions you find the genetic legacy of their neighbours and in both regions you will find some people in whom it is more pronounced, like Auvinen.

The black hair argument doesn't hold up as light hair is a much later and marginal evolution that the majority of humanity did not go through.

Originally posted by calvo Originally posted by pebbles   Except for recent decades,open inter-racial marriages between Western people & Asians were low.   This is a lie. Intermixing between Europoid and Mongoloid peoples had begun in pre-history,both in Europe and in Asia. It is believed that Finno-Ugrian speaks had once populated much of Eastern Europe,of what is today northern European Russia. Little is known about their phenotype, but it could possibly have included Mongoloid features; and the indigenous population of the Ural region were partly Mongoloid.