The Universe

Perhaps you don't understand the theology of "God" and God's place in the Universe. God in most theology is described as all-encompassing and infinite, thus, he would never have had to "come down" anywhere to communicate.

Originally posted by es_bih Perhaps you don't understand the theology of "God" and God's place in the Universe. God in most theology is described as all-encompassing and infinite, thus, he would never have had to "come down" anywhere to communicate.

Well ... I don't know about Islam but technically speaking God is anthropomorphic in most forms of Judeo-Christianity. This was one of the key criticisms the Greco-Romans had of Judeo-Christianity, as they had a concept of a universal creator called the "Demiurge" but it was as you describe.

Edited by edgewaters - 18-Feb-2009 at 02:58

It's not the anthropomorphism is the anthtropocentrism of the religion(s) that raises some problems.

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim God is certainly not anthropomorphic in Islam. That is quite kufr

universe is a really big mystery. as the video says most of us dont know and care about these things, all we have to look up in the sky to wonder these things. unfortunatly 90% of us dont care.

Originally posted by eaglecap I heard a story about a man of a boy who were walking and stopped to look at some ants. In a nut shell the man told his son that the only way they could communicate with the ants was to become an ant. Many Christians believe God took human form in Christ for this reason; so He could communicate and relate to man's problems. Both views are valid are far as I am concerned but subjective. This is why I avoid organized religion.

Edited by Goocheslamb - 19-Feb-2009 at 04:21

Originally posted by Cezar It's not the anthropomorphism is the anthtropocentrism of the religion(s) that raises some problems.

Your spot on.
The thing is there is nothing in religion (at least Islam) that should lead to anthropocentrism, in fact I think that it should be the opposite, that we are one part of a huge system in which our power and importance is severly limited. Nevertheless there are considerable number of muslims out there who still think that the world centres around humans (or even their ethnic group, or themselves).

There is a very similar thing in "evolution". There is nothing in the scientific theory that implies anthropocentrism, quite the opposite in fact, yet believers* in evolution still manage to place humans (or their ethnic group) at the highest pinnicle of evolution.

There seems to be predisposition to x-centrism amoung humans.



*As opposed to people who merely think its correct. People who put blind religious faith in the theory, and in science.

I actually think Islam and Christianity are of the same conviction in this: that when the Scriptures speak of God smelling, angering, repenting, etc., they speak as if He were smelling, angering, repenting, etc. It is a sort of linguistic economy adapted to convey something about Him by means of analogy. It's making the best of an imperfect medium. Is that about your understanding, Omar?

That's exactly right.
Many people don't understand this I think, they are still thinking in terms of the Greek god with the big beard in the sky, Monty Python style. Sometimes I think that people who actually understand religion are only a small proportion of any population; and those who do, regardless of which religion they are coming from, all seem to reach a remarkably similar position.

I know next to nothing about Aboriginal religion, but I do know that numerous people when writing about why 19th century Afghans usually settled with Aboriginal communities, or modern Aboriginal coversions to Islam, mention "similar beliefs" as a partial cause. Now as most of these writers come from Christian backgrounds it makes me wonder how exactly the Aboriginal religions, isolated from the rest of the world until at least 1600, manage to be more similar to Islam than Christianity - a sister faith from the ME.

Originally posted by eaglecap This is why I avoid organized religion.

I can assure you no-one is more disorganised than us.

Originally posted by Paul The feat of imagination to invent a religion or the failure to understand the universe?

That's an interesting sentence if you consider that thinking religion is invented is a failure to understand the universe.

Originally posted by Omar al Hashim That's an interesting sentence if you consider that thinking religion is invented is a failure to understand the universe.

Originally posted by Beylerbeyi I think this was the main reason behind my decision to become an atheist at the tender age of 12-13. When one understands how mind-bogglingly huge and old the universe is and how new and insignificant we are in it, there is no way you can believe the fairy tales in Quran or Bible. Their incredible pettiness is suddenly revealed by the bright light of truth, and the mind breaks its shackles and goes free from such primitive superstition.

It's good to see we're in perfect agreement for once.

No matter how I twist and turn it, I can't see religious faith as a sign of anything other than lack of comprehension, peer pressure or fear of what lies beyond, possibly all three combined.